BrandoFan Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 Why would Freddie take any offer from the Sox? if we give him a valid offer, that just starts the bargaining process, and he can interview twenty teams in the off season. So what that means is that we gave up Reed, Morse, and Olivo for 5-6 wins and a draft choice next June. I don't like the Olivo part, but we had to go after Freddy. This team was not gonna hold with Garland-Show-Diaz as 3-4-5. Failure to make postseason AGAIN, esp as the Cubs are trying to win the Series, would be another huge blow to the Sox fandom. If he helps take this club past ALDS, and then demands 10+ Mill a year, then we get a couple of compensation picks and all is well with the world - I assume the playoff run means the beginning of the revitalization of our old alienated fanbase. Now we just need for players to become less greedy and to execute. Think June of 2000 but with better pitching. And Randy Johnson would be welcome as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
israel4ever Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 Keep in mind, if the Sox falter in the 2nd half, we can always trade Freddy to NYY for their catching prospect (Dioner?) and Jose Contreras (who is already locked into a contract). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hi8is Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 no way does KW make this trade for garcia and not sign him up even if he asks for 9 - 11 mil a year, he'll get it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
valponick Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 no way does KW make this trade for garcia and not sign him up even if he asks for 9 - 11 mil a year, he'll get it EXACTLY. KW is a smart man. He knows that he might have to overpay a little bit for Freddy. This offer was just a starting point for negotations. Freddy has already stated that he would like to work out an extension, the money just has to be right. Freddy is probably a bigger priority for KW right now than Magglio. He'll resign him no matter what it takes because he knows the fans and how pissed off they would be if we gave up a fan favorite in Olivo and didn't sign Freddy long-term. The deal will get done and so will the Maggs deal. If KW and JR think there is even a 1% chance the Cubs will acquire Ordonez in the offseason the checkbook will open up because they'll lose fans and fans=money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSGuy406 Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 Why would Freddie take any offer from the Sox? if we give him a valid offer, that just starts the bargaining process, and he can interview twenty teams in the off season. So what that means is that we gave up Reed, Morse, and Olivo for 5-6 wins and a draft choice next June. :headshake If you're going to bash Kenny, at least use facts. You're throwing s*** at a wall right now. Kenny isn't stupid enough to trade a top prospect, a solid catcher, and a hit-or-miss SS for a top pitcher, and then not sign him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 no way does KW make this trade for garcia and not sign him up even if he asks for 9 - 11 mil a year, he'll get it It all depends how Freddy pitches down the stretch. If he has a 4.00+ ERA and loses his playoff game(s), then he can go f*** himself and I'll take the draft picks instead. There is always a chance Garcia pulls off a Colon/Ponson Special after signing a fat contract, so let's just watch and see what he does Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 he's already signed a big contract in seattle and then pitched lackamadaisically...maybe he's learned his lesson from that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
israel4ever Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 :headshake If you're going to bash Kenny, at least use facts. You're throwing s*** at a wall right now. Kenny isn't stupid enough to trade a top prospect, a solid catcher, and a hit-or-miss SS for a top pitcher, and then not sign him. Really? Didn't KW trade prospects for Carl Everett, Robbie Alomar, Scott Sullivan, etc., and not sign any one of them??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 Really? Didn't KW trade prospects for Carl Everett, Robbie Alomar, Scott Sullivan, etc., and not sign any one of them??? Garcia > Alomar + Everett + Sullivan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 Garcia > Alomar + Everett + Sullivan Actually, I wouldn't mind having Robbie back. I figured that with his lithe build, track-athlete background, awesome bat control, hand-eye coordination, sound swing mechanics and ever-cool nerves, he would actually age SLOWER than his peers because, unlike, say, Soriano or Patterson, Robbie never relied on pure batspeed/quickness -- which is always the first to go. What happened to him between his great 2001 season and very mediocre 2002 is a total mystery, that's for sure. You never know with these HOF'ers - they might give you an Indian summer of a season - and Robbie is much younger than Barry Larkin or Rickey Henderson (as a Met in 1999), Ripken in his final year or even Biggio this year. I'd love for him to have an unexpected awesome 2nd half for us and then retire. Uribe is just not a 2-hole hitter, unfortunately. For 450 K (which is what is left on Robbie's contract), I wouldn't mind getting him from the D-Backs. He could still get on base versus RHP, can still run a little bit, field a little bit, is a great bunter. An experienced and inexpensive insurence if anything else. Sullivan and Evrettt can kiss my ass, on the other hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSteve Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 Actually, I wouldn't mind having Robbie back. I figured that with his lithe build, track-athlete background, awesome bat control, hand-eye coordination and ever-cool nerves, he would actually age SLOWER than his peers because he never relied on pure batspeed/quickness. What happened to him between his great 2001 season and very mediocre 2002 is a total mystery, that's for sure. You never know with these HOF'ers - they might give you an Indian summer of a season - and Robbie is much younger than Barry Larkin or Rickey Henderson (as a Met in 1999), Ripken in his last year or even as Biggio this year. I'd love for him to have an awesome 2nd half for us and then retire. Uribe is just not a 2-hole hitter, unfortunately. For 450 K (which is what is left on Robbie's contract), I wouldn't mind getting him from the D-Backs. He could still get on base versus RHP, can still run a little bit, field a little bit, is a great bunter. An experienced and insexpensive insurence if anything else. Sullivan and Evrettt can kiss my ass, on the other hand. Keep Robbie away! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 Keep Robbie away! Well, as long as you've weighted all the options and considerations..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JimH Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 Here are the facts, this team is going for it. KW still has a good relationship with Robbie Alomar, Alomar's agents' screw up notwithstanding. Harris is struggling, and even though Harris is KW's guy, KW has proven he will cut the cord if it's not working out. Koch is a good example. It would not shock me if Alomar is a White Sox by July 31. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 I don't think we just drop Harris just like that though. Not a chance in hell. However, I could easily see Robbie come here and help. He could be either a starting 2Bman or be a utility IFer. And he would not cost much...maybe a bench player on the A or AA team. I do know for a fact that I'd like to see another starter here, be it Russ Ortiz or Randy Johnson...someone that is pretty damn good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelasDaddy0427 Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 This seems like a more then fair offer and I hope that he doesn't go any higher then 30 Mil over 3 years... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 I don't think we just drop Harris just like that though. Not a chance in hell. However, I could easily see Robbie come here and help. He could be either a starting 2Bman or be a utility IFer. And he would not cost much...maybe a bench player on the A or AA team. I do know for a fact that I'd like to see another starter here, be it Russ Ortiz or Randy Johnson...someone that is pretty damn good. It comes with the understaning that Robbie is gonna have to outplay either Harris Uribe or Crede in order to play even against RHP. Depth is something Sox could use - look at how the "unnessesary" signing of Todd Walker has paid in spades for the Cubs. And, again, there is always a chance Robbie could revitalize himself ala Kenny Lofton in the second half of 2003 and become a pitcher's nightmare in the pennant race and in the playoffs - an admittedly slim chance but you never know when it comes to HOF talents. As far as Ortiz and Unit.....don't even mention them in the same sentence. Ortiz won't be an improvement over Loaiza as a #3 the way he's pitched lately....while Unit and his sick Road ERA would be our ace-savior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelasDaddy0427 Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 And, again, there is always a chance Robbie could revitalize himself ala Kenny Lofton in the second half of 2003 and become a pitcher's nightmare in the pennant race and in the playoffs - an admittedly slim chance but you never know when it comes to HOF talents. Yeah because he did such a great job of that last year :puke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSGuy406 Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 Yeah because he did such a great job of that last year :puke ? What did Robbie do wrong last year? He provided stability to the top of the order, and he played very good defense. He's not the reason we didn't win the division. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasywheels121 Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 Robbie put up the same numbers here that he did in NY. NY hated him for the numbers he put up; it's pretty sad that we considered them good numbers. .253 BA...Woo hoo! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSGuy406 Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 Robbie put up the same numbers here that he did in NY. NY hated him for the numbers he put up; it's pretty sad that we considered them good numbers. .253 BA...Woo hoo! I'm not warrenting grabbing Robbie back, I'm just saying he isn't the reason we lost the division. He improved our team at the time. We had bigger problems (manuel, manuel, and manuel ). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 It comes with the understaning that Robbie is gonna have to outplay either Harris Uribe or Crede in order to play even against RHP. Depth is something Sox could use - look at how the "unnessesary" signing of Todd Walker has paid in spades for the Cubs. And, again, there is always a chance Robbie could revitalize himself ala Kenny Lofton in the second half of 2003 and become a pitcher's nightmare in the pennant race and in the playoffs - an admittedly slim chance but you never know when it comes to HOF talents. As far as Ortiz and Unit.....don't even mention them in the same sentence. Ortiz won't be an improvement over Loaiza as a #3 the way he's pitched lately....while Unit and his sick Road ERA would be our ace-savior. I would only hope that Robbie would just light it up, but I wouldn't count on it. However, one guy I wouldn't mind looking at is Matt Stairs. KC is well out of it, and I'm sure they'd take practically nothing for him(sort of like Alomar). He f***ing kills RHP. I'd want him or Randall Simon at the very least. And when talking about Ortiz and RJ....I was more or less referring to just getting another pitcher. Personally, I'm not super-confident in Garland-Scho down the stretch, and I'd just like to have depth. I do agree though that we need to do all we can to get RJ. Give them Borchard, Sweeney, Diaz, and Scho, and hope they accept(and I figure they would...perhaps sub in a couple decent prospects for Sweeney). Then hope RJ accepts. We do need to do all we can to get RJ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 to get RJ to accept playing here he'd have to be given a private jet to go home see his family every night...but i don't see how he'd accept this...He could see us stockpiling talent and say, hey, these guys are in it to win, and i wanna be a part of that again...but he could just as easily say that for the Angels, more so the angels in fact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted July 6, 2004 Author Share Posted July 6, 2004 Robbie Alomar is not going to come here and play as a backup. He's pouting right now because Scott Hairston is starting ahead of him, which is really the right thing to do in Arizona. Junior Spivey or Craig Counsell are probably more likely options IF we go after an infielder, but right now our main concerns are probably an extra guy in the bullpen and a new starting catcher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSteve Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 Robbie Alomar is not going to come here and play as a backup. He's pouting right now because Scott Hairston is starting ahead of him, which is really the right thing to do in Arizona. Junior Spivey or Craig Counsell are probably more likely options IF we go after an infielder, but right now our main concerns are probably an extra guy in the bullpen and a new starting catcher. Spivey is on the DL, Counsell could be fun to watch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted July 6, 2004 Author Share Posted July 6, 2004 Spivey is on the DL, Counsell could be fun to watch. Counsell will probably become a Yankee though, they'll replace Enrique Wilson eventually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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