Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 Hey Buehrle can go wherever he wants in 6. by then we'll have 3 pennants, the Cards will suck, and he'll be in his late twenties. any guy who would rather play for his boyhood team than a real good team who's offerin him money out the wazoo is still a boy. And baseball is a Man's sport (or woman's) not a boy's (or girls). We have no room or money for that kinda players. see once again you guys are jumping before hearing both sides of the story......dont judge till you know ALL the facts................ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigHurt4evah Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 hey hsc, all I'm sayin is that someone is in the wrong. if it's the Sox, then they better realize what a good pitcher they have here. and if it's Buehrle, he needs to mature and realize he has a job to do. if it's omebody else, screw em, they should butt out. if it's hsc, she can do whatever she wants I'm scared of herrr. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 hey hsc, all I'm sayin is that someone is in the wrong. if it's the Sox, then they better realize what a good pitcher they have here. and if it's Buehrle, he needs to mature and realize he has a job to do. if it's omebody else, screw em, they should butt out. if it's hsc, she can do whatever she wants I'm scared of herrr. dont be scared of me.. im not that mean...lol.....i think within the next couple of days a good story may come out of this... its not on marks part this time.. they had a deal worked out....this one is on jr this time around...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clujer420 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 dont be scared of me.. im not that mean...lol.....i think within the next couple of days a good story may come out of this... its not on marks part this time.. they had a deal worked out....this one is on jr this time around...... Contradictions, galore. Â Madam, this is what you said in the post before (less the annoying ......'s and with correction punctuation and proper grammar)... Â "See once again you guys are jumping before hearing both sides of the story. Don't judge till you know ALL the facts." Â Then, you turn around and say "this one is on JR". Make up your mind - either reserve your judgement until you hear more about it, or come out and comment now -- but you can't have it both ways. Â Based on what I've heard about the deal that was rejected, Mark would have had $10M over 3 years guaranteed, and if he pitched 200+ innings in 2005, he would get $7M in 2006, and the Sox would have a $10M option for 2007. He's thrown 200+ innings in each of the past 2 years, so there's no reason to think he wouldn't do it again. That makes the deal 4 years for $17M -- over $4M per season. That is VERY fair. Â Based on that, it's on Mark and his agent -- NOT JR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 dont be scared of me.. im not that mean...lol.....i think within the next couple of days a good story may come out of this... its not on marks part this time.. they had a deal worked out....this one is on jr this time around...... Contradictions, galore. Â Madam, this is what you said in the post before (less the annoying ......'s and with correction punctuation and proper grammar)... Â "See once again you guys are jumping before hearing both sides of the story. Don't judge till you know ALL the facts." Â Then, you turn around and say "this one is on JR". Make up your mind - either reserve your judgement until you hear more about it, or come out and comment now -- but you can't have it both ways. Â Based on what I've heard about the deal that was rejected, Mark would have had $10M over 3 years guaranteed, and if he pitched 200+ innings in 2005, he would get $7M in 2006, and the Sox would have a $10M option for 2007. He's thrown 200+ innings in each of the past 2 years, so there's no reason to think he wouldn't do it again. That makes the deal 4 years for $17M -- over $4M per season. That is VERY fair. Â Based on that, it's on Mark and his agent -- NOT JR. i can have it anyway i want it..... and you heard wrong... dead wrong... those numbers and clauses are not whats in the writing.......not even close.......dont like what i have to say then dont read it...... wanna believe everything the press tells you go on ahead.. those of us who know better know what the real deal is.. this one is on jr cause he was in fact the one who turned down the first deal that was all worked out between marks agent and hahn... jr re did the deal......and that is the reason it was turned down by marks agent... its got so many cluases and unfair outlandish ideals that even superman himself couldnt adhear to all the stipulations in it............. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clujer420 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 i can have it anyway i want it..... and you heard wrong... dead wrong... those numbers and clauses are not whats in the writing.......not even close.......dont like what i have to say then dont read it...... wanna believe everything the press tells you go on ahead.. those of us who know better know what the real deal is.. this one is on jr cause he was in fact the one who turned down the first deal that was all worked out between marks agent and hahn... jr re did the deal......and that is the reason it was turned down by marks agent... its got so many cluases and unfair outlandish ideals that even superman himself couldnt adhear to all the stipulations in it............. I haven't reached the point of not reading your posts - but that could happen at some point if this sadness continues. Â And what did I say about the contract that wasn't true? The following is cut and pasted from the Sox official website... Â "Buehrle seemingly walked away from a great deal more. Along with a final $11.5 million offer, Buehrle had the chance for two option years that would have raised the contract's total to $27 million over five years when factoring in buyouts, according to a club spokesman, responding to a report on ESPN Radio. Â The first option year in 2006 would have been triggered by Buehrle pitching 200 innings in 2005, which would have added $7 million to the contract. The White Sox then had a final year option with Buehrle for $10 million." Â So, either you're saying the Sox page is lying (it appears you are), or you simply don't understand the contract (likely). Â 200 IP is an "unfair and outlandish ideal"? What other stipulations are there in the contract if you know so much about it? Â And you're right, you CAN have it both ways. Provided you're willing to be labeled a hypocrite by myself and anyone else who isn't kissing your ass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baggio202 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 dont be scared of me.. im not that mean...lol.....i think within the next couple of days a good story may come out of this... its not on marks part this time.. they had a deal worked out....this one is on jr this time around...... Contradictions, galore. Â Madam, this is what you said in the post before (less the annoying ......'s and with correction punctuation and proper grammar)... Â "See once again you guys are jumping before hearing both sides of the story. Don't judge till you know ALL the facts." Â Then, you turn around and say "this one is on JR". Make up your mind - either reserve your judgement until you hear more about it, or come out and comment now -- but you can't have it both ways. Â Based on what I've heard about the deal that was rejected, Mark would have had $10M over 3 years guaranteed, and if he pitched 200+ innings in 2005, he would get $7M in 2006, and the Sox would have a $10M option for 2007. He's thrown 200+ innings in each of the past 2 years, so there's no reason to think he wouldn't do it again. That makes the deal 4 years for $17M -- over $4M per season. That is VERY fair. Â Based on that, it's on Mark and his agent -- NOT JR. i can have it anyway i want it..... and you heard wrong... dead wrong... those numbers and clauses are not whats in the writing.......not even close.......dont like what i have to say then dont read it...... wanna believe everything the press tells you go on ahead.. those of us who know better know what the real deal is.. this one is on jr cause he was in fact the one who turned down the first deal that was all worked out between marks agent and hahn... jr re did the deal......and that is the reason it was turned down by marks agent... its got so many cluases and unfair outlandish ideals that even superman himself couldnt adhear to all the stipulations in it............. its another frank thomas type contract Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 dont be scared of me.. im not that mean...lol.....i think within the next couple of days a good story may come out of this... its not on marks part this time.. they had a deal worked out....this one is on jr this time around...... Contradictions, galore. Â Madam, this is what you said in the post before (less the annoying ......'s and with correction punctuation and proper grammar)... Â "See once again you guys are jumping before hearing both sides of the story. Don't judge till you know ALL the facts." Â Then, you turn around and say "this one is on JR". Make up your mind - either reserve your judgement until you hear more about it, or come out and comment now -- but you can't have it both ways. Â Based on what I've heard about the deal that was rejected, Mark would have had $10M over 3 years guaranteed, and if he pitched 200+ innings in 2005, he would get $7M in 2006, and the Sox would have a $10M option for 2007. He's thrown 200+ innings in each of the past 2 years, so there's no reason to think he wouldn't do it again. That makes the deal 4 years for $17M -- over $4M per season. That is VERY fair. Â Based on that, it's on Mark and his agent -- NOT JR. i can have it anyway i want it..... and you heard wrong... dead wrong... those numbers and clauses are not whats in the writing.......not even close.......dont like what i have to say then dont read it...... wanna believe everything the press tells you go on ahead.. those of us who know better know what the real deal is.. this one is on jr cause he was in fact the one who turned down the first deal that was all worked out between marks agent and hahn... jr re did the deal......and that is the reason it was turned down by marks agent... its got so many cluases and unfair outlandish ideals that even superman himself couldnt adhear to all the stipulations in it............. its another frank thomas type contract but worse........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clujer420 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 its another frank thomas type contract Well...OK, let's see it...what have you heard? Â I don't want to continue to comment on it if I have read untrue things. But until I see a contract contrary to the one I read at the Sox official site, I stand by my claim that it's Mark's fault it wasn't signed. Â And if it's a "Frank Thomas type contract", that just means it's complicated -- not unfair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clujer420 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 but worse........ Based on what? Â Show it to us so we'll know what we're talking about. You seem to have all the facts. They say the proof is in the puddin', but where's the puddin'? Show me puddin'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baggio202 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 but worse........ Based on what? Â Show it to us so we'll know what we're talking about. You seem to have all the facts. They say the proof is in the puddin', but where's the puddin'? Show me puddin'. HSC has her sources and in the past they have proven to be very reliable...if she says a deal was worked out and JR at the least minute made changes that caused it to be nixed i believe her... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 i can have it anyway i want it..... and you heard wrong... dead wrong... those numbers and clauses are not whats in the writing.......not even close.......dont like what i have to say then dont read it...... wanna believe everything the press tells you go on ahead.. those of us who know better know what the real deal is.. this one is on jr cause he was in fact the one who turned down the first deal that was all worked out between marks agent and hahn... jr re did the deal......and that is the reason it was turned down by marks agent... its got so many cluases and unfair outlandish ideals that even superman himself couldnt adhear to all the stipulations in it............. I haven't reached the point of not reading your posts - but that could happen at some point if this sadness continues. Â And what did I say about the contract that wasn't true? The following is cut and pasted from the Sox official website... Â "Buehrle seemingly walked away from a great deal more. Along with a final $11.5 million offer, Buehrle had the chance for two option years that would have raised the contract's total to $27 million over five years when factoring in buyouts, according to a club spokesman, responding to a report on ESPN Radio. Â The first option year in 2006 would have been triggered by Buehrle pitching 200 innings in 2005, which would have added $7 million to the contract. The White Sox then had a final year option with Buehrle for $10 million." Â So, either you're saying the Sox page is lying (it appears you are), or you simply don't understand the contract (likely). Â 200 IP is an "unfair and outlandish ideal"? What other stipulations are there in the contract if you know so much about it? Â And you're right, you CAN have it both ways. Provided you're willing to be labeled a hypocrite by myself and anyone else who isn't kissing your ass. like i said before dont believe everything you read in the press...... your hearing half the story on this one......the only part the sox want you to know is that mark turned down 27 mil at 5 years.. they dont tell you all the stipulations of the contract or anything else.. and thats because they would look like a bunch of jackasses if they had let it out what they were demanding mark do for those next 5 years....... i fully understand what the sox reported and im tellin you its not the truth.......this much i know because i have it from a very reliable source ...which i may just have to have come here and tell it to you himself.........im not a hypocrite.... and i surely dont want you kissing my ass.....i dont care if you believe me or not to tell ya the truth... all im asking is that you get the whole story before you judge harshly on mark.... not everything is what it appears to be.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clujer420 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 like i said before dont believe everything you read in the press...... your hearing half the story on this one......the only part the sox want you to know is that mark turned down 27 mil at 5 years.. they dont tell you all the stipulations of the contract or anything else.. and thats because they would look like a bunch of jackasses if they had let it out what they were demanding mark do for those next 5 years....... i fully understand what the sox reported and im tellin you its not the truth.......this much i know because i have it from a very reliable source ...which i may just have to have come here and tell it to you himself.........im not a hypocrite.... and i surely dont want you kissing my ass.....i dont care if you believe me or not to tell ya the truth... all im asking is that you get the whole story before you judge harshly on mark.... not everything is what it appears to be.... If they only wanted us to know about it being 5 years, $27M, no mention of the $7M option (that would kick in if he pitched 200 innings in 2005) or the $10M club option for 2007 would be there.  And I'm not judging harshly against Mark. I'm just saying it's not signed because of him -- not because it was an unfair deal.  To be honest, I hope the Sox DID try to shaft him. If he turns down a good offer, that's a sign that he wants to leave ASAP. If he turns down a bad one, that just shows that the club needs to get their head out of their ass and "show him the money".  So, what did you hear from your "very reliable source"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 I am waiting to hear more before I make judgments. Mis-information has leaked out before on this matter. Who knows? I am waiting to hear more. Michelle, as the first person here to cast doubt on the total accuracy of the White Sox front office stories in the press on the MB contract, let me to say this to our friends:  what the media stated and what thre Sox posted on their website is their official story.  Their.  official.  story.  There is always more to anything than what one side posts.  How many people here have heard the story from MB's side of it?  But you are totally ready to condemn MB for being selfish and greedy because of what a KW approved press release says?  Give me a f***ing break.  I suppose if KW posted a story on the Sox website, covered by ESPN, that said the moon was made of green cheese would believe that too?  Now, who do I know - repeat, who do I KNOW - that knows the Buehrle family as well as KW?  Oh, that would be Michelle.  Who do I know who knows the Buerhles? Now that would me, that would be Michelle, that would be Get Up Guy who has posted the same thing on the MLB boards.  Who do I know that was quick to label MB a selfish greedy player or whatever because of a KW press release?  For those of you who are waiting to hear the whole story, thank you, it will come For those who accept the pablum that KW dishes out, swallow good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clujer420 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 So...what are you saying? Â Are you saying the Sox are liars? Are you saying Mark is greedy? Are you saying you agree with me? Are you saying you agree with "Michelle"? Or are you saying you're going to wait until you hear more? Â I'm a bit confused by your post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 "Michelle"? In quotation marks? Â She is a special personal friend of mine, as well as her children. Â I read what the Sox posted. Â I read what Michelle posted, and what Get Up Guy said on the other boards. Â But even before I read their posts, I had suspicions that the official story was slanted - biased - tilted. Â In that Hahn and I "discussed" this matter at SoxFest, I was very suspicious as to the official story. Â So I started talking to people who I know are well informed on this matter. Â And I repsect MB all the more because I know that he is taking heat for declining a contract when in fact he was never offered the contarct as was reported. If it were me, I'd be calling KW a liar to the press right now. But MB has more savvy and more of an ability to take it than I do. Â Think about it: if there are contract negotiations, the only reason to go public with a story that the other side declined a "reasonable" offer is to make the other side look bad. In real honest negotiations, the details are not discussed in the media but in private. So look at who is "in the press" on this and who has kept his mouth shut. Â All Michelle did, as she always does, is give a heads up sign, as I tried to do yesterday, that we were not getting the full story - by any means not the full story. Believe her or not, believe me or not, believe KW or not. The choice is always yours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 I see it this way. MB wanted an extra year. If you put in the extra year it counts around 4 mill a year avg over 4 seasons. I think he believes he can do way better then that in arbitration and he probably could. I'll throw out the 5th year option cause that is up to the Sox. Its definately at a fair price, but there is no promise it happens. Right now it looks like a 4 yr 16 mill or so deal. Â Well, the only guarantee is that its a 3 yr deal worth 8 mill. No one knows what happens with Buerhle. For all he knows he gets hurt or the Sox jack around his innings to save money. You never know. I'm not saying it happens but it could. What makes this deal go down is if the Sox make the 5th year option mutual and drop the option on the 4th year. The deal is very fair to Mark cause he has 16 mill guaranteed and its fair to the Sox cause they save in the long haul. Then the 5th year deal can be done by each team, but there would be some clauses for protection. Something like if Mark accepts the 5th year its less money and if the Sox do it then its 10 mill. You dont' want mark able to accept 10 mill if he's hurt or not as good. The Sox could have a buyout in this though. Â This is just my theory. Its a difficult deal, but one that gives Mark more money GUARANTEED and one that gives the Sox good savings over the long haul. I think the Sox prefer the 5th year as just an option year for them though and they'll probably do it that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clujer420 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 "Michelle"? Yes, "Michelle". She may be a friend of yours, and that's fine. But until she's a friend of mine, she will remain either hotsoxchick, maybe HSC, or "Michelle" -- no disrespect. Â Back to the matter at hand... Â I'm not claiming to be the knower of all that is to be known. All I can go by is what I've read about it so far. If some of you have information that is contrary to what is being reported, I think you have somewhat of an obligation to let us fellow Sox fans know about it before we start jumping the gun on things. Â I really like Mark and I would love to see him in a Sox uniform for many years to come. I also really love the Sox and I like to think that I can trust them. If I can't, though, I would like to know about it. Â So, what do any of you know that is not being reported? Speak now or forever hold your peace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 So...what are you saying? Are you saying the Sox are liars? Are you saying Mark is greedy? Are you saying you agree with me? Are you saying you agree with "Michelle"? Or are you saying you're going to wait until you hear more?  I'm a bit confused by your post. all im going to say is believe as you wish... i dont care....the whole story will come out soon enough..or at least marks part...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ncorgbl Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 Mark Buehrle is not thinking that far ahead, to say he wants to leave, that's not the message sent today. The message sent today is that the offer had provisions that are not acceptable to Mark. To fault Buehrle, or his agent is ridiculous, they didn't write the offer from the Sox. Their counter offer was rejected by the Sox, and it wasn't about money. Hahn and his puppet-master Williams are doing the 'old soft shoe' on this one, as usual. Â But look at it another way. The offer had Mark at a guranteed $11.5 million for 3 years. If Mark wins 20 this season, do you think the arbitrator would give a 23 year old, left handed Ace of the staff with 60+ wins in 3 years $9 million for the year? Of course he will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 1. I think you have somewhat of an obligation to let us fellow Sox fans know about it before we start jumping the gun on things.  2. So, what do any of you know that is not being reported?  Speak now or forever hold your peace. 1. Bulls***.  It is not my job to stop you from jumping the gun. Each person must do that for their own self.  2. Bulls***.  Not my job to break confidence with my friends that confide in me just to please some cyber person. Three people on this board have now said all that can be said to clue you in without breaking confidence. Believe as you wish.  and as I read your last sentence, that really pisses me off. Why should I betray someone to meet your ultimatums? Take a tip in good grace or screw off. You have been a good, intelligent, welcome poster - don't blow it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan420 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 1. I think you have somewhat of an obligation to let us fellow Sox fans know about it before we start jumping the gun on things.  2. So, what do any of you know that is not being reported?  Speak now or forever hold your peace. 1. Bulls***.  It is not my job to stop you from jumping the gun. Each person must do that for their own self.  2. Bulls***.  Not my job to break confidence with my friends that confide in me just to please some cyber person. Three people on this board have now said all that can be said to clue you in without breaking confidence. Believe as you wish.  and as I eread your last sentence, that really pisses me off. Why should I betray someone to meet your ultimatums? Take a tip in good grace or screw off. You have been a good, intelligent, welcome poster - don't blow it. i agree with you. you dont have to break confidence with your friends. with anyone on a msg board Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan420 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 Trade MB, I think the time is coming fast. Trade LEE and MB for Morris and Pujols Shut the f*** up. trade MB that is the stupidest thing ive ever heard on this board.(not counting what i say) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesox247 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 Buehrle seemingly walked away from a great deal more. I think the key word in this quote from the sox site is seemingly. The author of this article is one person stating his opinions, and I doubt that he was actually there to see MB and Sox Management talk about the contracts. I doubt that MB would have turned down a deal like that. Im not against anyone here, I'm just another guy stating my opinions about this deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mac9001 Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 Trade MB, I think the time is coming fast. Trade LEE and MB for Morris and Pujols Shut the f*** up. trade MB that is the stupidest thing ive ever heard on this board.(not counting what i say) Not only that, but STL would laugh there ass off at that deal... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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