The wizzard of OZ?

[I-HATE-CREDE]

Why would you use your only catcher on the bench in that situation?  If something happens and we go to extra innings, it is Chris Widger or bust, even if Widge gets hurt.  Its a common sense move.

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Honestly, with two outs and men on 2nd 3rd, the odds of only one man scoring and pushing it into late innings are long. More likely, either zero or two runs are going to cross home plate, making the "your only other cather" arguement moot. Plus, its not like it was the second inning and you were using your only back up catcher. It was the ninth and the game was on the line. Following your logic, AJ would never had been used.

[I-HATE-CREDE]

Why would you use your only catcher on the bench in that situation?  If something happens and we go to extra innings, it is Chris Widger or bust, even if Widge gets hurt.  Its a common sense move.

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Venura off Goosage my favorite Sox moment also. Robin had 12 or 13 hr's that July.....about Crede's yearly average.

[fathom]

I would have to agree with you here.. Ide rather have faced Quinlan in that situation too

 

I'm not saying that Quinlan is a great hitter. I was trying to show that Erstad isn't this phenom that Ozzie and Hawk try to make him out to be. There comes a time where Ozzie just has to say f*** the match-ups, and let our best players decide the game. In my opinion, there was no reason for Hermanson to not start the 9th inning, and no reason in the world for Everett to bat for Iguchi. Iguchi deserves the chance to redeem himself for his errors.....he's been our most consistent hitter. Also, Everett couldn't hit a 30 mph softball consistently right now.

[I-HATE-CREDE]

I'm not saying that Quinlan is a great hitter.  I was trying to show that Erstad isn't this phenom that Ozzie and Hawk try to make him out to be.  There comes a time where Ozzie just has to say f*** the match-ups, and let our best players decide the game.  In my opinion, there was no reason for Hermanson to not start the 9th inning, and no reason in the world for Everett to bat for Iguchi.  Iguchi deserves the chance to redeem himself for his errors.....he's been our most consistent hitter.  Also, Everett couldn't hit a 30 mph softball consistently right now.

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I wouldn't trust EVerett at this point if he was allowed to hit off a tee.

[Winnin Ugly]

Now I agree with you there I wouldnt have taken out Iguchi. As for Buehrle staring the 9th have no problem with he is our stud pitcher was pitching an awesome game give him a chance to finish it....

 

thats what is great about baseball many people have different opinions how they would do things different

[southsider2k5]

Honestly, with two outs and men on 2nd 3rd, the odds of only one man scoring and pushing it into late innings are long.  More likely, either zero or two runs are going to cross home plate, making the "your only other cather" arguement moot.  Plus, its not like it was the second inning and you were using your only back up catcher.  It was the ninth and the game was on the line.  Following your logic, AJ would never had been used.

 

AJ should have been the last man used. Its proper bench management. You don't leave yourself bare at the toughest position to play.

 

The Sox were a wild pitch away from going to extra innings... and judging by the wildness that Scot Shields showed yesterday, it isn't that hard to imagine.

[fathom]

Now I agree with you there I wouldnt have taken out Iguchi.  As for Buehrle staring the 9th have no problem with he is our stud pitcher was pitching an awesome game give him a chance to finish it....

 

 

Buehrle was far from pitching an awesome game. He got great results for 8 innings, but he was playing with fire all game. He left everything up in the zone, and the Angels hit a deep flyball nearly every inning. Considering that the Angels had 3 straight righties leading off the inning, I'm not sure why we didn't just let our closer with a 0 ERA come into the game. I am amazed that more people aren't on here today talking about what Jeff Brantley was saying about the game during the ESPN broadcast yesterday. I've never heard an announcer criticize a manager more during a game than he was yesterday. Way to go Brantley!

[fathom]

AJ should have been the last man used.  Its proper bench management.  You don't leave yourself bare at the toughest position to play.

 

 

If Ozzie would have let Iguchi bat for himself, he could have then used AJP instead of Timo. If something happened to Widger, then we just could have put AJ into the game, losing the DH. That's not something you want to have happen, but it's not the end of the world. Again, lets just be happy that Timo won the game........it would have been a lot worse on here if we lost after all that yesterday.

[I-HATE-CREDE]

AJ should have been the last man used.  Its proper bench management.  You don't leave yourself bare at the toughest position to play.

 

The Sox were a wild pitch away from going to extra innings... and judging by the wildness that Scot Shields showed yesterday, it isn't that hard to imagine.

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Then when IS a proper time to use AJ in that game? never?

[Guest JimH]

AJ should have been the last man used.  Its proper bench management.  You don't leave yourself bare at the toughest position to play.

 

The Sox were a wild pitch away from going to extra innings... and judging by the wildness that Scot Shields showed yesterday, it isn't that hard to imagine.

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Mike, to add to your point, why bring in one lefthanded hitter (AJP) to replace another lefthanded hitter (Timo). Timo already had an at bat under his belt and arguably was looser.

 

Plus your point about using your only other catcher is valid, even though it was the 9th. Good bench management is keeping AJP on the bench in case they wanted to PH for Widger in extra innings.

 

I still fail to see why he pinch hit Everett for Iguchi in the 9th, I can see him trying to get the lefty-righty match up, but ...

[southsider2k5]

Then when IS a proper time to use AJ in that game? never?

 

Last-man-off-of-the-bench.

[kapkomet]

Everone and their f'in "IF this happens then that should have happened"... damn, it's OVER.

 

I can't wait until tonight so this s*** gets behind us.

[southsider2k5]

Everone and their f'in "IF this happens then that should have happened"... damn, it's OVER.

 

I can't wait until tonight so this s*** gets behind us.

 

And a whole new list of things to second guess.

[The Critic]

AJ should have been the last man used.  Its proper bench management.  You don't leave yourself bare at the toughest position to play.

 

The Sox were a wild pitch away from going to extra innings... and judging by the wildness that Scot Shields showed yesterday, it isn't that hard to imagine.

I agree with this.

The only second-guessing I'll do is to say that I think Iguchi should have batted in the 9th. If you need contact to get a run home from 3rd, you should leave your most consistent contact hitter in the game IMO.

The Hermanson situation can be debated too, but that's been done to death today.

I was puzzled by the Timo-for-Frank move at the time, but after I learned the reason I accepted it. Funny what having all the information will do to an opinion...

[I-HATE-CREDE]

Mike, to add to your point, why bring in one lefthanded hitter (AJP) to replace another lefthanded hitter (Timo).  Timo already had an at bat under his belt and arguably was looser.

 

Plus your point about using your only other catcher is valid, even though it was the 9th.  Good bench management is keeping AJP on the bench in case they wanted to PH for Widger in extra innings.

 

I still fail to see why he pinch hit Everett for Iguchi in the 9th, I can see him trying to get the lefty-righty match up, but ...

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You bat one lfety for another lefty when the first lefty hits like a woman. Also, you exaust your bench when the game is on the line. You don't save it for extra innings, which may or may not occur.

[kapkomet]

You bat one lfety for another lefty when the first lefty hits like a woman.  Also, you exaust your bench when the game is on the line.  You don't save it for extra innings, which may or may not occur.

 

HATE, your "woman" won the game. Give it up.

[I-HATE-CREDE]

HATE, your "woman" won the game.  Give it up.

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Yeah, but just because a move worked doesn't mean it was a good move.

[Guest JimH]

You bat one lfety for another lefty when the first lefty hits like a woman.  Also, you exaust your bench when the game is on the line.  You don't save it for extra innings, which may or may not occur.

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Just like that 3rd game of the season vs. Cleveland where Guillen ran out of pitchers and Vizcaino had to suck it up for 3+ innings. The possibility of extra innings has to be considered, and planned for. It was a one run game and as Mike points out, a wild pitch ties the game and Shields was all over the place.

 

The other aspect to this is Guillen showed faith in both Everett and Timo. We can debate all day long whether that faith is warranted, but it's May and this is a good time to show faith in your players. If Iguchi's feelings are hurt, it can easily be explained to him that he (Guillen) wanted the lefty-right match up in Everett vs. Shields.

 

Very rarely if ever would you pinch hit one lefty who's been sitting on the bench all day, for another lefty who's used to pinch hitting and already has gotten one at bat in the game. The only way he'd do it is if Pierzynski had monster numbers off of Shields and Perez hits Shields poorly. Pierzynski is saved as last man off the bench and/or pinch hitting for Widger in extra innings.

 

Personally I like the fact Guillen showed faith in both Everett and Perez but as I've stated a few times, I would not have pinch hit Everett for Iguchi, although I can clearly understand why he did it.

[The Critic]

Yeah, but just because a move worked doesn't mean it was a good move.

That is true.

Again, before I knew why Timo batted for Frank, I was telling my wife, "Well, I just hope Timo makes a bad decision work out all right".

Then he struck out weakly and I was less than happy.

Then later, I was happy on the last play of the game.

[I-HATE-CREDE]

That is true.

Again, before I knew why Timo batted for Frank, I was telling my wife, "Well, I just hope Timo makes a bad decision work out all right".

Then he struck out weakly and I was less than happy.

Then later, I was happy on the last play of the game.

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I was at the game and thrilled they won, but it doesn't excuse the moves Ozzie made. When I saw Perez in for Thomas I was ready to pull a Ligue on Guillen.

[The Critic]

I was at the game and thrilled they won, but it doesn't excuse the moves Ozzie made.  When I saw Perez in for Thomas I was ready to pull a Ligue on Guillen.

He absolutely made some mistakes.

Luckily, happily, the Sox overcame and won a big game to regain the 4-game lead over the Twins.

I just think we're dwelling on this more than a bit too much.

And I know you're kidding ( hope you're kidding??? ), but the last thing the White Sox EVER need is another episode like the inbred f***head Ligue family.

[I-HATE-CREDE]

He absolutely made some mistakes.

Luckily, happily, the Sox overcame and won a big game to regain the 4-game lead over the Twins.

I just think we're dwelling on this more than a bit too much.

And I know you're kidding ( hope you're kidding???   ), but the last thing the White Sox EVER need is another episode like the inbred f***head Ligue family.

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I was in the upper deck. It would have been a difficult manuever on my part.

[The Critic]

I was in the upper deck.  It would have been a difficult manuever on my part.

But absolutely impressive if successful.

SWANDIVE!!!!!

[I-HATE-CREDE]

But absolutely impressive if successful.

SWANDIVE!!!!!

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Tommy Lee Jones in the Fugitive....."Did you see that, he did a peter pan right here off this bridge"