Official Recruiting Thread II

[LittleHurt05]

This is the Illini special. I don't see any group of fans have these types of comments of "offered more money" "got a better package" more than those fans.

 

My favorite are the accusations against Bill Self at Kansas. He is playing dirty there, yet there is zero chance he played dirty at Illinois?

[Brian]

My favorite are the accusations against Bill Self at Kansas. He is playing dirty there, yet there is zero chance he played dirty at Illinois?

 

Not too mention whatever Self gave Alexander, topped Groce's "check".

Edited October 8, 2014 by Brian

[Buehrle>Wood]

My favorite are the accusations against Bill Self at Kansas. He is playing dirty there, yet there is zero chance he played dirty at Illinois?

Is it wrong to think he was insanely dirty at both?

[clyons]

Is it wrong to think he was insanely dirty at both?

 

Probably. I've never heard anything to seriously suggest that.

[Buehrle>Wood]

Probably. I've never heard anything to seriously suggest that.

You've never heard anyone say Kansas is dirty?

 

 

 

I mean if he's doing it there it just makes sense he was doing it at Illinois.

[bigruss]

You've never heard anyone say Kansas is dirty?

 

 

 

I mean if he's doing it there it just makes sense he was doing it at Illinois.

I'm sure he was and is. Just like I bet Groce has some dirt as well, it's just the nature of the game.

[bmags]

I've heard lots of Illini fans say everyone is dirty.

 

Look, Kansas has great facilities, an incredible history and fieldhouse and the knowledge that if that if it's the best 2 or 3 programs in the country. When they come to talk to you, it just validates that you are the best to everyone.

 

They also likely have a great booster network that is interested in helping out the team.

 

This is also the case for many many programs. And if you sit down and listen to the recruits, every program is going to make you feel like you are taken care of, everyone has a great campus, but the thing that makes you put your ink down is the relationship you feel with the coach and program. Bill Self is Bill Self because he's made great relationships with programs across the country and those coaches trust him and those recruits trust their coaches.

 

But if you listen to Illini fans, every recruit is about to sign on with Ole Jim Groce if not fer Bill Self comin in with a helicopter full of money!

[illinilaw08]

Moore to Wake Forest. Thomas is so key and they'll probably strike out.

 

Thomas would be a huge get, obviously, but I actually prefer Darius Paul coming back over Moore... at least in the short term.

 

Moore seems like he has an insanely high ceiling, but all the evaluations of him seem to say that he needs work. Because neither Egwu or Leonard were remotely ready to contribute as freshman, I think it's fair, based on both Moore's ranking and the reports on him, that he's a guy who will take at least a full year before he's ready to make an impact.

 

I'm cautiously optimistic that Morgan/Colbert will make the requisite leap and be able to give good backup minutes this year and, if necessary, starter minutes in '15-'16.

[Buehrle>Wood]

I've heard lots of Illini fans say everyone is dirty.

 

Look, Kansas has great facilities, an incredible history and fieldhouse and the knowledge that if that if it's the best 2 or 3 programs in the country. When they come to talk to you, it just validates that you are the best to everyone.

 

They also likely have a great booster network that is interested in helping out the team.

 

This is also the case for many many programs. And if you sit down and listen to the recruits, every program is going to make you feel like you are taken care of, everyone has a great campus, but the thing that makes you put your ink down is the relationship you feel with the coach and program. Bill Self is Bill Self because he's made great relationships with programs across the country and those coaches trust him and those recruits trust their coaches.

 

But if you listen to Illini fans, every recruit is about to sign on with Ole Jim Groce if not fer Bill Self comin in with a helicopter full of money!

 

I do have to say this is insanely ironic from a Mizzou fan.

 

Since he took over Kansas, Self and KU have probably been investigated and busted more than any other program in the country. There's something to it at least.

 

 

And I must be forgetting who Groce has lost out to Self other than Alexander. I'm sure there's someone, honestly can't remember.

[whitesoxfan99]

Wow, he must be pretty impressionable. Obviously the recruiting sites don't agree with me but i love what I see of Moore, even moreso than Thomas. He'll be on the nba real quick.

 

No. He didn't rebound, didn't block shots and only shot 40% from the floor during AAU play this summer. He looks the part but is bad at basketball right now.

[bigruss]

I've heard lots of Illini fans say everyone is dirty.

 

Look, Kansas has great facilities, an incredible history and fieldhouse and the knowledge that if that if it's the best 2 or 3 programs in the country. When they come to talk to you, it just validates that you are the best to everyone.

 

They also likely have a great booster network that is interested in helping out the team.

 

This is also the case for many many programs. And if you sit down and listen to the recruits, every program is going to make you feel like you are taken care of, everyone has a great campus, but the thing that makes you put your ink down is the relationship you feel with the coach and program. Bill Self is Bill Self because he's made great relationships with programs across the country and those coaches trust him and those recruits trust their coaches.

 

But if you listen to Illini fans, every recruit is about to sign on with Ole Jim Groce if not fer Bill Self comin in with a helicopter full of money!

Well first of all, I don't think head coaches ever mention money these days. The boosters on the other hand....

 

KU wins out because they're KU, they have a better everything than Illinois. It's just a fact. Groce has been trying to win recruits by having the better relationship and offering not just star status but the hero title of turning Illinois back into a powerhouse. So far, that's worked on top 30 and top 50 kids, we haven't snagged the top 20 kid with that offering, yet.

 

And maybe we don't until we make a run in the tourney with a team full of 4 stars, maybe we have to prove ourselves first and not rely on vision. That's all very fair, but I love that Groce is getting high ranked 4 stars to build a good team and going for the 5 star guys to make it a great team. Hopefully it all works out, I really believe this year is going to be the start of a great run of basketball at Illinois.

[Buehrle>Wood]

No. He didn't rebound, didn't block shots and only shot 40% from the floor during AAU play this summer. He looks the part but is bad at basketball right now.

The latter being why I love him. Give that man some proper coaching and on a nice training regime and he's going to be scary.

[gatnom]

Self operated in the gray area at Illinois. Self operates in the gray area at Kansas. Good coaches do. Every program has terrible fans who accuse all other programs for being dirty.

 

It amuses me how much people like to hate Illinois.

 

 

[clyons]

You've never heard anyone say Kansas is dirty?

 

 

 

I mean if he's doing it there it just makes sense he was doing it at Illinois.

 

I certainly agree with your last point, but I have never heard any serious suggestions that Self, specifically, is insanely dirty.

[Jake]

Sour grapes even before the guy spurns you.

 

I don't know that I believe it, but if people think he's saying he likes other schools when he actually has already made his choice, that would be a plausible explanation

[bmags]

I do have to say this is insanely ironic from a Mizzou fan.

 

Since he took over Kansas, Self and KU have probably been investigated and busted more than any other program in the country. There's something to it at least.

 

 

And I must be forgetting who Groce has lost out to Self other than Alexander. I'm sure there's someone, honestly can't remember.

 

I don't think it is ironic at all. I hate KU with a passion but I completely recognize why kids go there. My point is that when Jimmy Whitt chose Arkansas over Missouri despite being from Columbia I don't remember a knee jerk reaction of "He was paid more" by Arkansas. And losing to Arkansas sucks because of Mike Anderson.

 

But nearly every U of I fan I know that follows basketball has this instinctive reaction to assign the single reason all of these kids don't choose Illinois as they were better paid elsewhere. It's not a good look. It's not because I love to hate on Illinois, I'm basically forced to follow them just because of this board otherwise I wouldn't think about them at all.

Edited October 8, 2014 by bmags

[Buehrle>Wood]

I certainly agree with your last point, but I have never heard any serious suggestions that Self, specifically, is insanely dirty.

Well the NCAA busted them for Darnell Jackson/JR Giddens for getting paid, not having a compliance compartment, Darrell Arthur for never graduating high school, lack of institutional control/more paying recruits, tons of other violations, that ticket scandal, among a bunch of other things that I don't remember.

[Buehrle>Wood]

I don't think it is ironic at all. I hate KU with a passion but I completely recognize why kids go there. My point is that when Jimmy Whitt chose Arkansas over Missouri despite being from Columbia I don't remember a knee jerk reaction of "He was paid more" by Arkansas. And losing to Arkansas sucks because of Mike Anderson.

 

But every U of I fan I know that follows basketball has this instinctive reaction to assign the single reason all of these kids don't choose Illinois as they were better paid elsewhere. It's not a good look. It's not because I love to hate on Illinois, I'm basically forced to follow them just because of this board otherwise I wouldn't think about them at all.

Mizzou fans are literally the only reason I know Self is so incredibly dirty. They used to have a running article on their message board tracking his every step. It was hilarious in all honesty, not even being snark about it. It was a great article and I hope they still keep up with it even after leaving the SEC

Edited October 8, 2014 by Buehrle>Wood

[IlliniKrush]

I don't think it is ironic at all. I hate KU with a passion but I completely recognize why kids go there. My point is that when Jimmy Whitt chose Arkansas over Missouri despite being from Columbia I don't remember a knee jerk reaction of "He was paid more" by Arkansas. And losing to Arkansas sucks because of Mike Anderson.

 

But every U of I fan I know that follows basketball has this instinctive reaction to assign the single reason all of these kids don't choose Illinois as they were better paid elsewhere. It's not a good look. It's not because I love to hate on Illinois, I'm basically forced to follow them just because of this board otherwise I wouldn't think about them at all.

Alright, enough of this painting with a broad brush crap.

[LittleHurt05]

Is it wrong to think he was insanely dirty at both?

 

Absolutely not. I have no idea who is/isn't or was/wasn't dirty, I just usually assume everyone cheats.

 

It just cracks me up when fans love to point the finger, but act like the finger can never be pointed back at them. Any kid who chooses Kentucky can't say no to Cal's bags of money, but if a kid chooses a different school over Kentucky, is he the one non-greedy kid out of them all? Unlikely.

[bmags]

Alright, enough of this painting with a broad brush crap.

 

It's not a broad brush, it is literally every U of I fan I know. Missouri has a bunch of Cardinals fans so I'm not trying to throw stones, but I've never seen another fanbase so focused on the payoff aspect of things.

[LittleHurt05]

It's not a broad brush, it is literally every U of I fan I know. Missouri has a bunch of Cardinals fans so I'm not trying to throw stones, but I've never seen another fanbase so focused on the payoff aspect of things.

 

Hey! What about me?

 

My favorite are the accusations against Bill Self at Kansas. He is playing dirty there, yet there is zero chance he played dirty at Illinois?

[bigruss]

It's not a broad brush, it is literally every U of I fan I know. Missouri has a bunch of Cardinals fans so I'm not trying to throw stones, but I've never seen another fanbase so focused on the payoff aspect of things.

Part of that may be that many of the recruits we lose out on are from Chicago, where we know money plays a factor for many of those players and their handlers.

[bmags]

Hey! What about me?

 

I honestly had no idea you were, but will edit original post.

[clyons]

Well the NCAA busted them for Darnell Jackson/JR Giddens for getting paid, not having a compliance compartment, Darrell Arthur for never graduating high school, lack of institutional control/more paying recruits, tons of other violations, that ticket scandal, among a bunch of other things that I don't remember.

 

That's all true, but the NCAA has been busting Kansas for decades, and several items you cite (lack of compliance dept., institutional control) speak to much more than the coach. I'm not trying to suggest that Self is holier than thou, but I think if he was "insanely dirty" relative to other top coaches, that would have been better established by now (and by more than a rival school's fan site). I might be just naive.