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Number one picks overall

 

2000 Adrian Gonzales

2001 Joe Mauer

2002 Bryan Burlington Pirates a dirt dirt cheap organization

2003 Delmon Young

2004 Matt Bush

2005 Justin Upton

2006 Luke Hoechvar Cheap move, the better move was to pick up Andrew Miller.

2007 David Price

 

 

That still looks like a pretty good list.

 

 

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QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Sep 11, 2007 -> 01:16 AM)
On a sidenote, I want to point out I don't have a problem with anyone rooting for the club to lose. I understand all about the top pick. I'm also trying to throw out other points so you guys get an idea of where those that may not be rooting for the club to lose are coming from.

 

I basically take the approach if they lose, fine, top pick here they come, but if they win I see the added benefit in terms of player development that could come with those wins (since typically when you win its because you've played well and if young players play well its a good sign of your future as you may actually have a couple young players that will turn into quality major league players).

 

I'm not about to care much either way, unless of course we have some significant injuries. All I care about is if the young players play well and I hope vets play well to raise trade value.

 

 

To me, the wins are secondary to our young kids getting experience. I would rather get game experience and find out about our young kids over a few measley wins in September on this season. Tonight watching Gavin pitch, watching Richar and Fields and Owens is what I am watching right now. If they win, great. If they lose, oh well.

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QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Sep 11, 2007 -> 01:20 AM)
Number one picks overall

 

2000 Adrian Gonzales

2001 Joe Mauer

2002 Bryan Burlington Pirates a dirt dirt cheap organization

2003 Delmon Young

2004 Matt Bush

2005 Justin Upton

2006 Luke Hoechvar Cheap move, the better move was to pick up Andrew Miller.

2007 David Price

That still looks like a pretty good list.

Yeah in '04, Verlander and the Rice trio were pretty universally ranked ahead of Bush, who was a mid-round talent.

 

In 2002, Upton was viewed as the best HS position player by a good margin. Though I don't really recall whether he was a consensus #1.

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You seem to almost be blaming some of us for this team being horrible. Right now blame the manager (who I know you think is amazing), the coaching staff, the GM, and the players? I think there's a lot more Sox fans that hate the Cubs than Cubs fans that hate the Sox.

 

I'm not blaming those who want the Sox to lose for the team being horrible.

Try answering this for me.

If we wind up the worst team in baseball which is likely, we get the No. 1 pick and all of you will be so happy waiting for the draft.

Chance are the team will suck again next year.

Let's say the team goes 1-10 to open the season.

So now are you going to root against the Sox every day next season starting in mid April, and the season after that and after that, just so they can keep getting top draft picks?

I prefer to win every and any game possible and hope the GM signs some free agents and makes some decent trades for a change.

The Royals have stunk for years. You think their No. 1 picks have been that good?

Edited by greg775

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Number one picks overall

 

2000 Adrian Gonzales

2001 Joe Mauer

2002 Bryan Burlington Pirates a dirt dirt cheap organization

2003 Delmon Young

2004 Matt Bush

2005 Justin Upton

2006 Luke Hoechvar Cheap move, the better move was to pick up Andrew Miller.

2007 David Price

That still looks like a pretty good list.

Let's see:

2000: Has been traded for relievers, twice. So apparently isn't that difficult to acquire #1 pick talent.

2001: Great talent, can't stay healthy.

2002: Who?

2003: Headcase, home run total is small, OBP issues despite a nice BA, took 3 years to develop in a loser oganization. Still young

2004: Flopped completely as a SS, won't pitch until 2009.

2005: young

2006: too early

2007: Too early

 

I'm not exactly impressed with the numbers 1 so easily. I want the Sox to start winning again in less than 3 years.

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QUOTE(greg775 @ Sep 11, 2007 -> 08:35 PM)
I'm not blaming those who want the Sox to lose for the team being horrible.

Try answering this for me.

If we wind up the worst team in baseball which is likely, we get the No. 1 pick and all of you will be so happy waiting for the draft.

Chance are the team will suck again next year.

Let's say the team goes 1-10 to open the season.

So now are you going to root against the Sox every day next season starting in mid April, and the season after that and after that, just so they can keep getting top draft picks?

I prefer to win every and any game possible and hope the GM signs some free agents and makes some decent trades for a change.

The Royals have stunk for years. You think their No. 1 picks have been that good?

 

Even with how awful we've been, I didn't even think there was a chance we'd be in the bottom 3 even around the ASB. If anything, I wanted this team to fall out of contention fast, when it was obvious they had nothing this year, so we'd trade Buehrle and Dye at the deadline instead of losing them via free agency. Winning 65 games, as opposed to 61 games, isn't going to make us any better next year.

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Yes the #1 pick is a bad thing to have...

 

Ask yourself this question? When was the last time the #1 pick was such a foregone conclusing over a year before the draft takes place?

 

Who was that player?

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QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Sep 11, 2007 -> 04:30 PM)
Yes the #1 pick is a bad thing to have...

 

Ask yourself this question? When was the last time the #1 pick was such a foregone conclusing over a year before the draft takes place?

 

Who was that player?

I noticed the answer you posted on your blog, but I do recall people hyping Prior as the unquestionable #1 selection in late 2000. It jumps out at me because, in my more juvenile days, I was trolling the Cubs official MLB website and first became aware of him through there.

 

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QUOTE(santo=dorf @ Sep 11, 2007 -> 04:25 PM)
Let's see:

2000: Has been traded for relievers, twice. So apparently isn't that difficult to acquire #1 pick talent.

2001: Great talent, can't stay healthy.

2002: Who?

2003: Headcase, home run total is small, OBP issues despite a nice BA, took 3 years to develop in a loser oganization. Still young

2004: Flopped completely as a SS, won't pitch until 2009.

2005: young

2006: too early

2007: Too early

 

I'm not exactly impressed with the numbers 1 so easily. I want the Sox to start winning again in less than 3 years.

Whoa whoa. You are extremely negative on several of those guys.

 

Gonzalez is hitting .279 .345 with 26hrs and 86 rbi.

Mauer won a damn batting title and is a career .313 hitting with an almost .400 obp

upton and young are both rare talents. Upton averaged .319 .410 .961 OPS in the minors. Delmon young JUST turned 22 years old. He still is almost a .300 hitter and should improve his other stats.

 

You are right about Bush, he was a bust as a SS and had TJ as a pitcher. probably wont do much.

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Whoa whoa. You are extremely negative on several of those guys.

 

Gonzalez is hitting .279 .345 with 26hrs and 86 rbi.

Mauer won a damn batting title and is a career .313 hitting with an almost .400 obp

upton and young are both rare talents. Upton averaged .319 .410 .961 OPS in the minors. Delmon young JUST turned 22 years old. He still is almost a .300 hitter and should improve his other stats.

 

You are right about Bush, he was a bust as a SS and had TJ as a pitcher. probably wont do much.

Yes, Gonzalez's numbers look good, and I'm not slamming him even if it's been 7 years since he was drafted, but he was traded twice for relievers. My point was how it is possible to acquire "#1 talent" without having the #1 pick.

Mauer is a very special player, but he's only surpassed those career numbers once. It is inflated by his great 2006. His health is a serious concern but he is very good.

Saying "should improve his other stats" doesn't really say much to me because I think everyone can agree Brian Anderson "should improve his stats" when he is given playing time. I've already stated how young (no pun for Delmon) they are. I don't care about his BA, as his OBP is only .325 and his OPS is .744. Not bad for a first year player, but he is a serious headcase.

Edited by santo=dorf

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QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Sep 11, 2007 -> 04:41 PM)
I noticed the answer you posted on your blog, but I do recall people hyping Prior as the unquestionable #1 selection in late 2000. It jumps out at me because, in my more juvenile days, I was trolling the Cubs official MLB website and first became aware of him through there.

Prior's numbers were good, but not otherworldly in 2000. He was the consensus #1 as the draft approached, but I don't think he was anywhere near as highly thought of as Alvarez was a year before the draft.

 

An interesting trend that I've seen pointed out by others is that the the consensus top HS talent (when that player is a position player) has turned out better than their college counterparts... Off the top of my head that list includes, Adrian Gonzalez, Arod, Griffey, the Uptons, Mauer, Delmon Young,

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QUOTE(fathom @ Sep 11, 2007 -> 12:10 AM)
FWIW, the main reason I'm so big on having the 1st pick is due to the reports I had from a first-hand source at the Team USA tournament a few months ago. The reports said that Pedro Alvarez was far and away the best player, and it wasn't even close. The report also said that Danks was god awful, and Smauk is nothing special.

i read in a chat, cant remember where, maybe on baseball prospectus, and whoever was running the chat said they thought alvarez was a once in a generation type talent....

 

to some he is the #1 next year, but ive read a handful of reports that had him pegged about 3rd...with smoak and i believe a HS pitcher ahead of him...i think the appeal of smoak is that he can play CF and turn into a grady sizemore curtis granderson type player

 

that said i saw every home game pedro played for 2 years at vandy and saw a handful of road games, so ive probably seen him play 50+ times...and i simply think that its such a no risk pick barring huge injury that you have to take him.....offensively he has it all, patience, power, ability to hit the other way, and hit the other way with authority....when hes hot, he smokes everything, not just out of the park but i mean lasers....the biggest downside on him is that he has a tendancy to K alot, but he takes his walks as well....he walked a little less this year than last year, but i think it was cause he was young and realized he had such great power and swung hard alot....i think with a little more maturity this year hell be an absolute beast and have even better patience than he did as a freshman.....i actually like the way he tends to stay on the ball vs. lefties too, he seems to drive it hte other way to left field, but some of his power seems to go away vs. lefties, but thats to be expected.

 

i am also down a bit on his defense at 3b....he has a rifle of an arm, but he doenst have good hands, and he doesnt have a good first step. besides, hes only gonna get bigger as time goes on and his body will dictate a move to 1b i think....he could play a corner OF spot if he keeps slender enough to retain the speed he has....that said a few of my friends, who actualyl work for the baseball team think hell be fine at 3b.

 

hes only gonna get stronger too....supposedly when he came to vandy as a freshman he never lifted weights before and couldn't even bench 135....yet he hit 6 balls out of yankee stadium and fenway when taking BP with a wood bat in a predraft workout for those two teams...

 

im certainly not a scout, and quite frankly i havent seen enough of college players to really know how they project to the majors, but i never thought jensen lewis would crack AA and hes been solid in the cleveland pen, and a few other guys i saw in the SEC i never thought would be as good as they have been in the minors/majors....so based on that i am not too hesitant to say that i think he will be an impact type player at the next level

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Winning 65 games, as opposed to 61 games, isn't going to make us any better next year.

 

I respect your position on this, but like I asked, when are you going to give up next year and hope we again have the worst record in baseball?

Where does it end for you?

The Sox have won one world series in about 80 years or whatever.

The odds are great they may not win another one in your lifetime.

I mean we're talking odds here.

So if the odds hold true, each year the team is not in contention are you going to spend most of the season hoping your team LOSES?

That's my point. Why want your team to lose?

It makes little sense.

You played baseball. Don't you see the foolishness in wanting your team to be embarrassed in the hopes of getting a draft pick that could be David Clyde II???

Give me victories or give me death.

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QUOTE(greg775 @ Sep 11, 2007 -> 10:37 PM)
I respect your position on this, but like I asked, when are you going to give up next year and hope we again have the worst record in baseball?

Where does it end for you?

The Sox have won one world series in about 80 years or whatever.

The odds are great they may not win another one in your lifetime.

I mean we're talking odds here.

So if the odds hold true, each year the team is not in contention are you going to spend most of the season hoping your team LOSES?

That's my point. Why want your team to lose?

It makes little sense.

You played baseball. Don't you see the foolishness in wanting your team to be embarrassed in the hopes of getting a draft pick that could be David Clyde II???

Give me victories or give me death.

 

The thing YOU are not getting man is that we did not want the sox to keep losing until we were basically out of the race. You think any of us had the mindset comming into 07 saying "Damn I hope we are one of the worst teams in the Majors so we can actually get the #1 pick." (who happens to be an Albert Pujols/A-Rod's left-handed reincarnation) This was when we were basically like 10+ games back in the best division in baseball. This is just ONE SEASON here. The sox have not had a losing season like this in years. YEARS. We all know that were gonna compete again next season, but there was waaaaay too many qustion marks comming into 07. Everyone here wants what is best for the team we love. I personally want to see the rookies succeed evaluating this season. It doesn't matter if we win the rest of the games left, were still getting a top 10 pick/are still one of the 10 WORST teams in baseball. You don't want to see us get another Frank Thomas for the 2010+ on? (And NO I'm not comparing Pedro to Frank Thomas but maybe he could have THAT same type of impact for us.

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QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Sep 11, 2007 -> 02:41 PM)
I noticed the answer you posted on your blog, but I do recall people hyping Prior as the unquestionable #1 selection in late 2000. It jumps out at me because, in my more juvenile days, I was trolling the Cubs official MLB website and first became aware of him through there.

Actually I think Texeira was also widely considered the potential #1 pick that far in advance as well but he had some sort of injury early in the collegiate season leading up to the draft and because of that injury slid down a few slots (and of course Prior was amazingly dominant at USC that season).

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