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chisox2334

cabrera wins twibs best defender award

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My eyes told me that he was vastly overrated as a SS. Not to say that he wasn't good, but he certainly wasn't gold glove material, he also had a noodle arm

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I also find it quite hard to believe that he had an OPS comparable with Royce Clayton, who I remember as the worst offensive player on the Sox over the last decade...along with catcher Mark Johnson.

 

I still think Uribe is a better defender, even at less than ideal body weight. It's just that Uribe could never have been a leadoff hitter for us this year.

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QUOTE (lostfan @ Dec 16, 2008 -> 07:07 PM)
Uribe is, without a doubt, a far better defensive SS than OC.

 

I know OC isn't a popular guy among his teammates (or the fans), but really, these blanket statements about how terrible a ballplayer/defender he is are getting ridiculous. You don't win Gold Gloves and the Best Defensive Player of the Year Award when there's another player on your own team that is by far a better defender than you. Go ahead and reply about the calls to the official scorer and whatnot. If you can't see for yourself that OC is a great defender, then I don't know what you were watching all season.

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QUOTE (shipps @ Dec 16, 2008 -> 06:31 PM)
Uribe would have been a better defensive SS than OC if he would have started this year and no one would have noticed.

 

You hit it on the head. Keeping Uribe around as the utility man instead of some of the current names being thrown around would be great. Who knows, perhaps a Josh Fields, Twig Boy, or 12 ML career AB's fall during the course of the season. Then what? Wilson f***in' Betemit? Keep Uribe, he'll probably come cheap, and has proven himself.

 

Cabrera stepped into a leadoff role and struggled at first, but was one of the reasons the Sox made it to October. The phone calls were cheap, but I liked the intensity (especially the late season episodes). The second Chris Getz is half the ballplayer Cabrera is, I'll eat my words and be glad management went with him. Until then, I would be thrilled to see him back in Charlotte with a serious replacement at second. I was excited about Alexei, Quentin, and am about Viciedo and Beckham, but not Chris Getz. I hope I'm wrong, I really do.

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QUOTE (Swingandalongonetoleft @ Dec 16, 2008 -> 11:17 PM)
You hit it on the head. Keeping Uribe around as the utility man instead of some of the current names being thrown around would be great. Who knows, perhaps a Josh Fields, Twig Boy, or 12 ML career AB's fall during the course of the season. Then what? Wilson f***in' Betemit? Keep Uribe, he'll probably come cheap, and has proven himself.

Wilson Betemit has over 1000 MLB at bats. and is younger, in-better shape, and has a more fluid approch to hitting then Uribe does. Why would we bring in Uribe when we have Getz, Lillibridge, Betemit, Nix and even John Shelby who could provide similiar production?

Edited by Thunderbolt

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By 12 AB's I was referring to the presumed starter, Getz. On that same token, why would we bring in Betemit when we could have had Uribe for roughly the same figure? Uribe is older, but not to the point where his age is a factor if you're looking at the realistic length of his would-be deal. He's also a better defender, and can and has covered 3rd, SS, and 2nd admirably, saving our ass as recently as last year. He's shown he can hit when provoked, despite the insistance to the contrary by many here.

 

I just wish that whole Swisher deal never happened. Trading someone coming off the lowest of lows when he could have made the presumed loss of JD easier to swallow for something (Uribe) you could have retained cheaply and some Yankee minor league players... Does anyone think Swisher will bat .200 again next year? Let's also remember that he hit just about everywhere in the order, and did just about everything but pitch on the defensive side of things.

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First of all, with the market falling dramatically for some of the second tier players, it's not clear that many teams could afford to take on Dye's salary...maybe 8-10 major league teams right now, at most.

 

Second, Uribe couldn't be offered a deal for $1.3 million like Betemit is getting.

 

His salary for this past season was $4.5 million, so the most we COULD possibly cut him down to is $3.6 million in arbitration. However, that would be NO certainty because of the fact that he got the bulk to the playing time after Crede went down, and his agent would want him treated as a starter and not as a utility player in a possible hearing. The arbitrator couldn't/wouldn't choose the lower offer simply because the White Sox didn't see him getting more than 150 at-bats when he's been a regular for pretty much five years here. We could easily end up on the hook for $4.5-5.5 million for Uribe, we wouldn't be able to trade him to another team (look at all the conjecture for the lowly Adam Everett at $1 million plus incentives, or for Jack Wilson) and that $4 million in savings with Betemit (who could certainly figure in a 3B platoon) could be more effectively invested in a starting pitcher or CFer.

Edited by caulfield12

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QUOTE (chisoxdavid @ Dec 17, 2008 -> 10:01 AM)
Im glad that a White Sox player won but at the same time Im confused at how he won it. Can any one explain?

 

the same reason Derek Jeter wins gold gloves

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QUOTE (BaseballNick @ Dec 16, 2008 -> 09:49 PM)
I know OC isn't a popular guy among his teammates (or the fans), but really, these blanket statements about how terrible a ballplayer/defender he is are getting ridiculous. You don't win Gold Gloves and the Best Defensive Player of the Year Award when there's another player on your own team that is by far a better defender than you. Go ahead and reply about the calls to the official scorer and whatnot. If you can't see for yourself that OC is a great defender, then I don't know what you were watching all season.

Yawn. Do you even know what my opinion on Orlando Cabrera is or are you just kind of attempting to read between the lines and talk out of your ass? Nowhere in that post did I say that Cabrera is a bad defender, and the worst I can ever recall saying on this board is that he's overrated. I believe Cabrera is a very good defender and overall an above-average player, but nothing like what I expected him to be after reading all the hype, especially defensively. From what I saw of this past year what with him booting balls around, lobbing balls to first, and the amount of times I saw in the stat box "Player X singles to left, deflected off O. Cabrera" I wonder how he won Gold Gloves... actually I don't, because the Gold Glove is really a meaningless award anymore. I believe Uribe is an elite defensive player (who's probably declined some), but who is a terrible hitter that necessitated an upgrade at SS to a better player.

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QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 17, 2008 -> 01:26 AM)
Just like my belief to this day that Valentin was a better defender than Royce Clayton. Same type of argument.

 

 

I have to say right here-right now: I liked Jose Valentin and wouldn't have a problem if the team resigns Uribe, which it probably won't

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