New Buyer Seller thread

[BamaDoc]

I have gone back and forth as to wether we should be buyers or sellers. I struggle with a make the playoffs and hope vs clear cut world series contender. I think many understand there can be a difference. My greatest fear was treading water and getting nothing done. No playoff run and no addition of promising youngsters. I really looked at our schedule until the trading deadline. 16 games in 15 days before the 31st is up with the last sets of

 

4 home Tampa Bay

 

4 in 3 days at Detroit

 

3 at Minnesota

 

2 home Yankees(third post July 31st)

 

I think that schedule will show what we are and may explain why we added a reliever already in a trade.

 

 

[kev211]

2nd place at the break 3.5 games back. We better be buyers.

[ThunderBolt]

We're buying. We'll be pretty agressive about it too. Book it.

[harfman77]

KW is almost always in buy mode, especially during the season. The closer we are the more aggressive he gets, and being 3.5 out, he will be extremely aggressive.

[BaseballNick]

Kenny is buying. He tried with Peavy, and I believe he probably inquired about Oswalt, Bedard, and Halladay at some point. There was also the report that he's looking into Teahen who would be a great piece to add on a contending team.

[103 mph screwball]

Might end up being buyers and sellers. We may need to trade a contract like Dotel's in order to afford whoever KW has his sights on. Mostly buyers.

[RME JICO]

Buy Mode, but we will have to wait until the end of the month.

 

If the Sox are to add to the current roster, expect it to be tweaking rather than a blockbuster. Also, expect it to be something that is done in the 11th hour, as GM Ken Williams wants to see how the Sox do on a July 24-29 road trip in which they play in Detroit and Minnesota.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=Arjc...ype=team_report

[Cowch]

Which prospects do you think are touchable/untouchable at this point?

[ThunderBolt]

Which prospects do you think are touchable/untouchable at this point?

No one is untouchable. Flowers, Viciedo and Danks are close.

[BigSqwert]

Which prospects do you think are touchable/untouchable at this point?

[Cali]

I say neither. More of the "stand pat", and "trade" for CQ...

[103 mph screwball]

Which prospects do you think are touchable/untouchable at this point?

Danks because he changed agents to play with his brother and we want to keep big brother happy. I'd even trade Beckham for a Cy Young potential starting pitcher who would be under the Sox control for a long time. Everyone else is fair game as long as KW has a plan B and is improving the team.

Edited July 13, 2009 by 103 mph screwball

[Jordan4life_2007]

Which prospects do you think are touchable/untouchable at this point?

 

The one untouchable prospect we had is now currently playing 3B for the Chicago White Sox.

[Chisoxfn]

The one untouchable prospect we had is now currently playing 3B for the Chicago White Sox.

Tyler Flowers is very close to being untouchable as well.

[BearSox]

Which prospects do you think are touchable/untouchable at this point?

 

As someone else stated, no one is untouchable. But on the MLB roster and in the minors, the following are probably not going anywhere:

 

Danks, Floyd, Thornton, Beckham, Quentin, JorDanks, Flowers, Viciedo, Hudson, and maybe Jenks and Ramirez.

 

Buehrle and Konerko, I think odds are they will practically finish their careers with the White Sox. Buehrle will probably play his last season or two for the Cards, and Konerko, I think he'll be around for another 3-4 years at least (unless he reverts back to 07/08 Paulie for good). Dye is also a possibilty to stick around for quite a while as well. Thome, he is unmoveable this year, but I highly doubt we bring him back. He can barely catch up to a 90 mph fastball anymore. He might jump on as part time DH with some team that is a definiant WS contender.

 

The rest, they could be had for the right price.

[caulfield12]

Quentin's health and return is the biggest factor in whether we make a move or not.

 

If he can come back and contribute, the place to make a short-term move is on a 3B finishing out his contract this year...and it would be a very tough decision to bench Getz/Nix with the way they've been playing 2B and move Gordon to yet another position (3rd) this season, and at the major league level.

 

Probably, the calculation in KW's brain is not to make that move, unless it's something significantly better than a Rolen/Wigginton/Herbert Perry type of player over there...and trading for an impact 3B with a longer-term deal makes no sense with Fields and Viciedo around, unless Dayan is definitely being targeted for a corner OF spot, DH or 1B.

 

Best case scenario, Quentin is healthy and then you have to look at insurance for Pods in CF/leadoff (it seems 50/50 he will break down again, based on his past injury history), 3B/2B and the fifth starter's spot.

 

With a healthy Quentin, going out and packaging 2nd/3rd tier prospects for a Garland type (instead of starting Richard/Poreda/Carrasco) or any of our AAA/AA pitchers would be the correct move...where 2010-2012 wouldn't be impacted and we would be in an improved position to win the division this year as well.

 

I think trading Ramirez and being forced to go with Beckham at SS is a huge risk, because you're trading our most favorable contract in these economic times and you have absolutely ZERO insurance at that position if Beckham can't handle the position, unless you want to see Jayson Nix as the everyday SS, and he has lots of struggles offensively against RHP.

 

Trading Ramirez (for a big-name pitcher) leaves you with Beckham at SS, Getz/Nix at 2B and no clear 3B unless you count Fields again as part of the future of this organization, and it's hard to say that about either Fields or Anderson at this point...although things could change yet again in the 2nd half of the season, especially if Pods were to break down again.

Edited July 13, 2009 by caulfield12

[GreatScott82]

Thats the only way i make a deal for Halladay is if Rolen can come along with it. Right now we have the bullpen to compete and that doesn't come along very often in todays game. Trading away Ramirez, Poreda, and a couple other prospects for a 1.5 year of Halladay may be worth it if TCQ can come back. You would move Beckham to SS, Getz is playing strong in 2b and we would still be in great position to get younger after 2010 when Rolen, AJ and PK are all off the books clearing room for Viciedo to play 3b and maybe even FLowers to play C if he isn't included into a deal headed to Toronto.

 

Losing Ramirez hurts, but if you could get Halladay to sign an extension, the Sox would still be in outstanding shape for the next 3-4 years starting pitching wise.

Edited July 13, 2009 by GreatScott82

[iamshack]

I just don't care much to even entertain the notion of trading Alexei. He has an EXTREMELY favorable contract for being an impact offensive middle infielder. Secondly, the thought of trading Alexei so we can avoid taking Chris Getz/Jason Nix out of the lineup seems like backwards thinking to me.

 

In my mind you can't use any of your starting mlb roster to acquire Halladay. And if that is not good enough, so be it.

[Dick Allen]

Buy Mode, but we will have to wait until the end of the month.

 

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=Arjc...ype=team_report

Ironically, if he picked up a couple of pieces before the trip he could theoretically make that trip more successful. I don't buy that report. If there is a deal that can help the Sox win and they can afford it, KW will make it sooner rather than later. At worst, its one less thing he'll have to try to acquire in the off season.

[BearSox]

I was Alexei's biggest fan, but the more I see him play, the more I think he'll never come close to reaching his potential. He shy's away from contact at 2B for DP's, has no range to his right (at least at SS), isn't very bright, and I really dislike his approach at bat. He's gonna be a decent player for a while, but a very frustrating one due to his lack of consistency/concentration/baseball IQ.

 

I got no problem trading him while his value is still very high.

[RME JICO]

Ironically, if he picked up a couple of pieces before the trip he could theoretically make that trip more successful. I don't buy that report. If there is a deal that can help the Sox win and they can afford it, KW will make it sooner rather than later. At worst, its one less thing he'll have to try to acquire in the off season.

I don't think it is necessarily true when you talk about timing (sooner or later) when you are the buyer. You buy when available, not really when you want to. Sellers also get a little desperate near the deadline, which is also when most teams finally commit to becoming sellers. That may be the best time to make a deal (2 months left and more players available).

Edited July 14, 2009 by RME JICO

[caulfield12]

I was Alexei's biggest fan, but the more I see him play, the more I think he'll never come close to reaching his potential. He shy's away from contact at 2B for DP's, has no range to his right (at least at SS), isn't very bright, and I really dislike his approach at bat. He's gonna be a decent player for a while, but a very frustrating one due to his lack of consistency/concentration/baseball IQ.

 

I got no problem trading him while his value is still very high.

 

 

And you're willing to end up with Jayson Nix playing SS everyday if Beckham can't handle SS at the major league level and has to be moved to 2B?

 

Right now, we have a position of strength with our middle infielders (including Fields), but there's no certainty Gordon can play short, whereas at least we have more legitimate options for 2B and 3B that can be tried. If other teams see Beckham can't handle SS, the price tag for replacing that position with another impact-level player will be very high indeed, unless we get another Uribe/Eckstein/Everett/Wilson/Santiago/Berroa type of "filler" SS not in the long-term plans.

 

I'm not going to condemn Beckham's play at 3B and extrapolate it around the diamond or point to other players like Nix and Uribe that seem to be able to move all over the field without any negative impact defensively, but some of the mistakes at 3B in terms of judgement make you wonder how he'll do at SS when he'll have 50% more plays to make on an everyday basis.

 

Finally, there's almost NO way that Halladay would lock himself into a long-term contract extension right now in the middle of this season with the White Sox, when every player/agent is going to wait this economic crisis out and see what will happen over the next 2 years, with the economic climate for huge contracts perhaps returning once again. Why would Halladay want to be "stuck" with the White Sox if we fail to make the playoffs in 2009 and then end up going with a $65-80 million budget in 2010 with youth being the centerpiece, but rebuilding "on the fly" the context?

 

Not only that, but the Garcia extension was secured partially because of Ozzie's connection to him, at least that seems fairly likely. We have no "in" with Halladay that's comparable.

Edited July 14, 2009 by caulfield12

[ILMOU]

I was Alexei's biggest fan, but the more I see him play, the more I think he'll never come close to reaching his potential. He shy's away from contact at 2B for DP's, has no range to his right (at least at SS), isn't very bright, and I really dislike his approach at bat. He's gonna be a decent player for a while, but a very frustrating one due to his lack of consistency/concentration/baseball IQ.

 

I got no problem trading him while his value is still very high.

 

I'm frustrated with Lexi's defense to this point, but I couldn't disagree more regarding his approach at the bat. Despite another horrendous start, he's now hitting .281, and he's walking at more than twice the rate as he did last year. His OBP will continue to improve, and he remains uncommonly dangerous as a middle infielder.

 

I think his concentration level at the plate looks VERY good recently.

[BearSox]

I'm frustrated with Lexi's defense to this point, but I couldn't disagree more regarding his approach at the bat. Despite another horrendous start, he's now hitting .281, and he's walking at more than twice the rate as he did last year. His OBP will continue to improve, and he remains uncommonly dangerous as a middle infielder.

 

I think his concentration level at the plate looks VERY good recently.

 

Oh, he's hitting now, but pitchers haven't adjusted yet. Alexei can hit anyone's fastball, the league has learned that. What the league hasn't learned yet is that breaking balls away aren't much more effective because Alexei is on top of the plate and has good plate coverage with his arms. He has mashed a lot of outside sliders over the leftfield wall this year.

 

From watching him this year, the easiest way to get him out would be to throw breaking balls inside, aim them at his hip. There is really no way for him to hit the inside breaking ball with his current approach.

 

Plus, he is very streaky up there as well. And before, as I stated, he doesn't seem to have a good baseball IQ and he can often get out-smarted at bat, and he doesn't also do the right thing with certain pitches. Plus, he's far too much pull happy for my liking.

[RockRaines]

I was Alexei's biggest fan, but the more I see him play, the more I think he'll never come close to reaching his potential. He shy's away from contact at 2B for DP's, has no range to his right (at least at SS), isn't very bright, and I really dislike his approach at bat. He's gonna be a decent player for a while, but a very frustrating one due to his lack of consistency/concentration/baseball IQ.

 

I got no problem trading him while his value is still very high.

He's a rookie SS, he will get better and is already a pretty good defensive SS. Shying away from contact? No range? I disagree with both of those assessments. His footwork is a work in progress which is why he tiptoes around the bag during a dp, but once again, he turns a very nice one so who cares. His range right, left and out are VERY good, better than we've had in YEARS. His RF and FPCT are very respectable if not good for a rookie SS.

 

As far as his hitting, dont let your opinion get in the way of facts. He's an extremely good hitter for a middle infielder.

Since he's been moved to the 2-hole he is hitting .317 .379 .863 in 46 games. Thats good for the 4th highest OPS on the team behind Dye, Thome and Konerko. He's on pace for 22 HR and 84 RBI as a #2 hitter. Maybe your eyes may dislike his approach, but the numbers speak for themselves.