greg775 Posted September 20, 2009 Share Posted September 20, 2009 (edited) BTW. Steelers are making Bears look foolish. That's why they play four quarters. Bears win. Nice to see the Sox bats build on Saturday's win. What a pathetic offensive effort. KC kicks Detroit's ass; then wins 2 of 3 at the Cell. Sox have not been in the business of winning series for what seems to have been a long time. Edited September 20, 2009 by greg775 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Lost in all of this was a very nice job by Freddy. I tell you what, when he comes back next spring another six months away from shoulder surgery, if he adds any velocity, this rotation will be air tight, and might have a very good chance at being the best in baseball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Sep 20, 2009 -> 10:52 PM) The point is simple: Chris Getz is not the best 2b on this roster. Jayson Nix is also a rookie baseball player, who has shown the ability to hit the ball out of the ballpark, and does not rely on hitting it softly in front of a defender and running like hell. The platoon makes sense for the rest of rest year, but when your strength is excellent bat control, your potential at the major league level is limited. Break it down for me: what does Chris Getz do right? How many runs does he contribute to this team? What inherent value comes from his strengths? I've acknowledged how good he is when he gets on base, but just because we have 8 other guys who can hit on a team, doesn't necessitate the need for a ROLEPLAYER (as you said). Chris Getz is not the biggest problem on this team, I never said that, but he's not an ultimate solution fort next year. You are basing your comments about Nix being a better 2Bman then Getz on what? Homers? Homeruns isn't bat control. Getz is a better defender and that's what we need is defense. Nix is doing just fine as a sub at all 3 infield positions. He makes contact when at the plate and has speed., but he is not especially a great defense man. Edited September 21, 2009 by elrockinMT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Freddy has been great. No run support unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League Posted September 21, 2009 Author Share Posted September 21, 2009 QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Sep 20, 2009 -> 07:19 PM) You are basing your comments about Nix being a better 2Bman then Getz on what? Homers? Homeruns isn't bat control. Getz is a better defender and that's what we need is defense. Nix is doing just fine as a sub at all 3 infield positions. He makes contact when at the plate and has speed., but he is not especially a great defense man. Nix is far and away the better defender - Getz: -4.6 UZR, -4.0 RngR, -4.8 UZR/150 @ second. Nix: 3.6 UZR, 3.7 RngR, 10.2 UZR/150 @ second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 QUOTE (League @ Sep 20, 2009 -> 08:54 PM) Nix is far and away the better defender - Getz: -4.6 UZR, -4.0 RngR, -4.8 UZR/150 @ second. Nix: 3.6 UZR, 3.7 RngR, 10.2 UZR/150 @ second. Small.sample.size Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderBolt Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 QUOTE (scenario @ Sep 20, 2009 -> 10:21 PM) Small.sample.size There's ample proof from their minor league scouting reports that their is a very real disparity between Nix and Getz in the field. Not to mention the sample size you're taking issue with isn't actually that small. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Sep 20, 2009 -> 09:26 PM) There's ample proof from their minor league scouting reports that their is a very real disparity between Nix and Getz in the field. Not to mention the sample size you're taking issue with isn't actually that small. Ample proof, eh? Please provide me any minor league scouting reports or other resources you can find that talk about Getz's defense. Edited September 21, 2009 by scenario Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
son of a rude Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Its funny you say this about a guy with a .708 OPS in AA: There's no reason to call a 20 year old kid who hits .280 in AA, in his 1st pro season a bust. No reason for it, no truth to it. Viciedo is going to improve very quickly. I wouldn't be suprised to see him get a call-up next September. Yet write off Getz during a rookie year he's had a .692 OPS as a guy who will never hit the ball hard. There's a difference between a 20 year old coming from a completely differently country and going straight to AA and a 25 year old making his debut in the majors after years in the minors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
son of a rude Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Ample proof, eh? Please provide me any minor league scouting reports or other resources you can find that talk about Getz's defense. Exactly. None talk about his defense, yet most of Nix' scouting reports rave about his defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
son of a rude Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 You are basing your comments about Nix being a better 2Bman then Getz on what? Homers? Homeruns isn't bat control. Getz is a better defender and that's what we need is defense. Nix is doing just fine as a sub at all 3 infield positions. He makes contact when at the plate and has speed., but he is not especially a great defense man. Better OPS and better defensively. OPS has a higher correlation to runs than BA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderBolt Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 QUOTE (scenario @ Sep 20, 2009 -> 10:40 PM) Ample proof, eh? Please provide me any minor league scouting reports or other resources you can find that talk about Getz's defense. Getz draft report: Throws have carry. Soft hands, quick feet. Steady fielder. Solid 2B. Arm strength for all INF position. Instincts, knows how to play. http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/events/draft/y2005/...team&sp=cha “Lacks power and isn't a great defensive second baseman” http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/players/Chris_Getz “Comparing their season numbers, Nix has the edge over Getz—both offensively and defensively. Nix has a .761 OPS to Getz’ .691, aided by 10 home runs to the two Getz has to his name. Nix also has the advantage with the glove. UZR has Nix at 5.4 at second base—the highest UZR of any player on the White Sox—compared to Getz’ -3.0. Overall, FanGraphs has Nix worth 1.2 wins and Getz 0.4” http://baseballdigest.com/american-league/...-the-white-sox/ “Getz has average defensive tools, but is fundamentally sound. His best position is second base, but he can play shortstop or the outfield without hurting you too badly, though an average arm is a limit.” http://www.minorleagueball.com/2009/3/25/810157/chris-getz “I'm far more concerned with Getz' defense than his offense, though. I never would have expected Getz to have a -3.7 UZR heading into the All-Star break, but that's exactly the case. I don't think anybody expected a through-the-roof UZR from Getz, but at the least, I thought he was going to be an average defensive second baseman. And while he's not Dan Uggla bad, it's still disappointing to see him in the bottom third of MLB second basemen in terms of defense. Combined with his offense, it's not all that surprising that he's barely rated as a replacement-level player by WAR (-0.1).” http://bleacherreport.com/articles/216791-...card-infielders Oddly, every scouting report I see says that his future as a utility man, and his “disturbing lack of power (not my words) is an issue” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Pretty much what I expected. Articles written by sports-writers/bloggers do not qualify as scouting reports. How many of those guys actually watch players to evaluate their skills... or are even qualified to make more than a fan-level judgment? None. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 BTW... here are notes from an mlb.com article quoting Ozzie on Sunday... Guillen reiterated on Sunday that he doesn't see any changes coming for his infield in 2010. He likes the combination of Gordon Beckham at third, Alexei Ramirez at shortstop and Chris Getz at second base. "My infield is set. That's going to be the team, hopefully," Guillen said. "I'll take the three kids. They play well and have a lot of energy and bring a lot of great stuff. Alexei has been better the past two months, Beckham is unbelievable the way he plays third. Nobody talks about Getz, but he's a great baseball player." Guillen also believes that Jayson Nix will continue to function as a top-notch utility player, including as an emergency outfielder. Pretty much clears up where they stand in the organization's eyes, I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderBolt Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 QUOTE (scenario @ Sep 21, 2009 -> 10:59 AM) Pretty much what I expected. Articles written by sports-writers/bloggers do not qualify as scouting reports. How many of those guys actually watch players to evaluate their skills... or are even qualified to make more than a fan-level judgment? None. John Sickels and the guys from Fangraphs are two of the more respected sources in thefield. It’s amazing that you think you can just discredit everything in one sentence after I thoroughly reposed to your criticism over a lack of scouting reports. The reason there is not a depth of professional scouting reports (you know other than the 5 or so legitimate ones I’ve found) is because no one really cares enough to write up about Chris Getz. Why? Because he is a thoroughly unexceptionable baseball player. Would you like me to find you the dazzling reports about Jayson Nix now, or can those be tossed away too? Also, why the hell do we care about what Ozzie thinks here? I find his judgment impaired given that he’s the manager of the team on which Getz plays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 John Sickels is a columnist/blogger who used to work for ESPN.com... But they let him go and replaced him with analysis from BaseballAmerica and Keith Law. He runs a nice blog for fantasy baseball fans. But he is not a scout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Sep 21, 2009 -> 10:10 AM) John Sickels and the guys from Fangraphs are two of the more respected sources in thefield. It’s amazing that you think you can just discredit everything in one sentence after I thoroughly reposed to your criticism over a lack of scouting reports. Field? What field? I 'discredited' them because they're not scouting sources. Meanwhile, it appears that an baseball organization staffed with professional baseball evaluators and a GM with a scouting background decided to give Getz a shot as a regular starting MLB second baseman. And a manager who played infield in the majors for over a decade says Getz is more qualified to be a starter than the guy you want. But... they're wrong and the bloggers are right... right? Hello.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderBolt Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 "He dedicated himself this offseason in Arizona to the real rigors of a [conditioning] program," Regier said. "He wasn't physical at all in Double-A, but the program seems to have increased his strength and stamina. He's a contact hitter and an improving defender. And, though he was at Birmingham last year, there's no stigma in repeating Double-A, because you're just a phone call away from the big leagues. If you had to repeat extended [spring Training] or Class A there might be, but not Double-A." http://www.minorleaguebaseball.com/news/ar...b&fext=.jsp Baseball America has Getz pegged as a utitly man “Chris Getz, from Michigan, could be effective, but only in the way in which smallish second baseman can be. “http://baseballanalysts.com/archives/2005/06/drafting_team_r_1.php “check out Chris Getz. He has moved himself into utility role consideration for the White Sox, possibly by some time next season. “http://www.minorleaguebaseball.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20071211&content_id=328778&vkey=news_milb&fext=.jsp CHRIS GETZ 2B Triple-A Charlotte/White Sox Getz has excellent speed, bat control and defensive versatility, stamping himself as a future utility player. With his improved power, though, he was making a case to be a regular. http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/prosp...008/266404.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
son of a rude Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 BTW... here are notes from an mlb.com article quoting Ozzie on Sunday... Guillen reiterated on Sunday that he doesn't see any changes coming for his infield in 2010. He likes the combination of Gordon Beckham at third, Alexei Ramirez at shortstop and Chris Getz at second base. "My infield is set. That's going to be the team, hopefully," Guillen said. "I'll take the three kids. They play well and have a lot of energy and bring a lot of great stuff. Alexei has been better the past two months, Beckham is unbelievable the way he plays third. Nobody talks about Getz, but he's a great baseball player." Guillen also believes that Jayson Nix will continue to function as a top-notch utility player, including as an emergency outfielder. Pretty much clears up where they stand in the organization's eyes, I think. Ozzie is also the guy that continuously played DeWayne Wise. Just because he is playing Getz, doesn't mean that Getz is the best option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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