Jump to content

Vazquez and Swisher Redux


elrockinMT
 Share

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 157
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Sep 27, 2009 -> 06:49 PM)
Swisher is not above average at CF.

 

He played 0 games at CF this year and prior to joining the Sox had only started 57 games at CF for the A's.

 

If he is even average, why dont the Yankees use him there?

 

 

Putting hi in CF was the Sox bad not his. He can play CF and in fact all htree OF posiiton and he is better at iB defensively. There really was no open position for Swisher, but CF.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yeah it was the Sox fault to think he could handle CF.

 

But after they realized it, they were smart to cut their losses and not consider him a long term CF solution.

 

If the Sox had gotten a great offer for Dye, my guess is that Swisher is still with the Sox. They most likely got a better deal for Swisher and thought Dye would be able to produce similar results to Swisher.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Sep 27, 2009 -> 02:49 PM)
Swisher is not above average at CF.

 

He played 0 games at CF this year and prior to joining the Sox had only started 57 games at CF for the A's.

 

If he is even average, why dont the Yankees use him there?

Because Brett Gardner is REALLY good in CF. Melkey Cabrera isn't half-bad himself. And neither has the power to play a corner OF spot. Swish does.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Sep 27, 2009 -> 01:57 PM)
Because Brett Gardner is REALLY good in CF. Melkey Cabrera isn't half-bad himself. And neither has the power to play a corner OF spot. Swish does.

If Nady hadn't have been injured, Swisher would have been riding the bench. Considering how awesome you think he is offensively, wouldn't the minor defensive upgrade you give Gardner and Cabrera be offset by all of Dirty Thirty's awesomeness.

Swisher is a bad CF. The White Sox came to the conclusion before they traded Swisher that he would not be playing CF anymore. You are also assuming Swisher would have bounced back in Chicago when in NY he's about 15th on the totem pole, and in Oakland, not many players get too much scrutiny. Swisher coming back would have been a whole different circumstance and there is really no way of knowing what he would do. We do know when the Sox could have used him last year, except for June, he was awful.

Edited by Dick Allen
Link to comment
Share on other sites

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Sep 27, 2009 -> 03:02 PM)
If Nady hadn't have been injured, Swisher would have been riding the bench. Considering how awesome you think he is offensively, wouldn't the minor defensive upgrade you give Gardner and Cabrera be offset by all of Dirty Thirty's awesomeness.

Swisher is a bad CF. The White Sox came to the conclusion before they traded Swisher that he would not be playing CF anymore. You are also assuming Swisher would have bounced back in Chicago when in NY he's about 15th on the totem pole, and in Oakland, not many players get too much scrutiny. Swisher coming back would have been a whole different circumstance and there is really no way of knowing what he would do. We do know when the Sox could have used him last year, except for June, he was awful.

I’m not sure how big of an assumption it would be to think Swish would bounce back this year considering, you know, HE’S BOUNCING BACK, RIGHT NOW. Every measurable statistic said that Swish was unlucky last year. His BABIP was absurd. His defense in CF is adequate, and is offset my ability to get on base, and drive in runners from both sides of the plate I’d find the argument that he shouldn’t have been in CF this year, a lot more appealing if his main competition wasn’t Jerry Owens, Brian Anderson, and Dewayne Wise. Also, I don’t think it should be to Swisher’s detriment that he only stared performing after Nady got hurt. Nady got hurt, Swish played well. s*** happens. The Yankees got him as insurance, it paid off in spades. I can tell you from 1st hand experience that they love him out here. How do you like Marquez, Betemit, and Nunez?

Edited by Thunderbolt
Link to comment
Share on other sites

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Sep 27, 2009 -> 12:14 PM)
I’m not sure how big of an assumption it would be to think Swish would bounce back this year considering, you know, HE’S BOUNCING BACK, RIGHT NOW.

 

Different work environments = different results.

 

By your logic, Randy Moss should've been a stud in Oakland. How'd that work out?

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

QUOTE (WCSox @ Sep 27, 2009 -> 03:27 PM)
Different work environments = different results.

 

By your logic, Randy Moss should've been a stud in Oakland. How'd that work out?

Football and Baseball are radically different sports. Swish plays in a sport where he depends on his own talent, not that of a QB throwing him a ball.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Sep 27, 2009 -> 12:29 PM)
Football and Baseball are radically different sports. Swish plays in a sport where he depends on his own talent, not that of a QB throwing him a ball.

 

Moss was a perennial Pro Bowler in Minnesota (even after Cris Carter and Robert Smith retired), with Daunte Culpepper's suck ass throwing him the ball. Surely, Kerry Collins wasn't a huge step down from Culpepper? Moss' numbers tanked in Oakland because he quit playing. He even said it himself: "Why should I try, when nobody else is?"

 

Similarly, Swish quit on the Sox last year. Instead of working with Walker when he slumped, he decided to sit on the bench, sulk, and draw the ire of his manager. Just like Moss wasn't going to work out in Oakland, Swish wasn't going to work out in Chicago. You can't look at a player in Situation A and conclude that his numbers will be similar in Situation B. Unlike video games, work environments in the real world matter.

Edited by WCSox
Link to comment
Share on other sites

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Sep 27, 2009 -> 02:14 PM)
I’m not sure how big of an assumption it would be to think Swish would bounce back this year considering, you know, HE’S BOUNCING BACK, RIGHT NOW. Every measurable statistic said that Swish was unlucky last year. His BABIP was absurd. His defense in CF is adequate, and is offset my ability to get on base, and drive in runners from both sides of the plate I’d find the argument that he shouldn’t have been in CF this year, a lot more appealing if his main competition wasn’t Jerry Owens, Brian Anderson, and Dewayne Wise. Also, I don’t think it should be to Swisher’s detriment that he only stared performing after Nady got hurt. Nady got hurt, Swish played well. s*** happens. The Yankees got him as insurance, it paid off in spades. I can tell you from 1st hand experience that they love him out here. How do you like Marquez, Betemit, and Nunez?

And you heard here until they got rid of him was how great a guy Swisher was and the Dirty Thirty crap and all of that.

Explain his splits then? He's hitting .222 with little power at home where the Yankees have set a record for most homers at home in their history. Perhaps, and its just speculation, the scrutiny, the microscope, bothers him. He goes on the road, he's not even a second or tenth thought with that roster and he plays really well. With the Sox, he would still be expected to do a lot of things, and Chicago isn't Oakland media-wise. The bottom line is I'd rather have Rios than Swisher, and even if Swisher were here and was able to hit .249 like he's hitting now, the Sox would not have won anything as Pods would likely not have returned either. Sometimes there is addition by subtraction. Your boy Milton Bradley, who you want KW desperately to acquire, was missed so much by Texas when they let him go for nothing, they contended for a playoff spot. The Cubs suspended him and they went 7-1. Swisher's act was old, and he teammates knew when he sulked, it was all just an act. I don't blame him for sulking. I want guys on the roster who want to play. But he's a phony and had other issues. His leaving didn't hurt the Sox at all, even if Marquez, Betemit and Nunez don't ever do a thing. Also keep in mind, Viciedo is part of this deal. I take it you are very high on him.

Edited by Dick Allen
Link to comment
Share on other sites

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Sep 27, 2009 -> 02:45 PM)
And you heard here until they got rid of him was how great a guy Swisher was and the Dirty Thirty crap and all of that.

Explain his splits then? He's hitting .222 with little power at home where the Yankees have set a record for most homers at home in their history. Perhaps, and its just speculation, the scrutiny, the microscope, bothers him. He goes on the road, he's not even a second or tenth thought with that roster and he plays really well. With the Sox, he would still be expected to do a lot of things, and Chicago isn't Oakland media-wise. The bottom line is I'd rather have Rios than Swisher, and even if Swisher were here and was able to hit .249 like he's hitting now, the Sox would not have won anything as Pods would likely not have returned either. Sometimes there is addition by subtraction. Your boy Milton Bradley, who you want KW desperately to acquire, was missed so much by Texas when they let him go for nothing, they contended for a playoff spot. The Cubs suspended him and they went 7-1. Swisher's act was old, and he teammates knew when he sulked, it was all just an act. I don't blame him for sulking. I want guys on the roster who want to play. But he's a phony and had other issues. His leaving didn't hurt the Sox at all, even if Marquez, Betemit and Nunez don't ever do a thing. Also keep in mind, Viciedo is part of this deal. I take it you are very high on him.

Is it okay if I save this post and just copy and paste it for every occasion over the next 5 years that Nick Swisher is brought up?

 

The first Swisher deal was the bad one. The second one was a good one because it got his ass out of here without us having to eat salary, and in the process we were able to pick up Nunez and Viciedo. Sounds like a terrific deal to me.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mistake #1) Reading Phil Rogers. The guy knows nothing about baseball.

Mistake #2) Trading away Vazquez (A notorious good pitcher with bad teams/notorious bad pitcher with good teams) and Nick Swisher, who Dwayne Wise was starting ahead in the playoffs last yr weren't mistakes. Enuff said.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just find it amusing that people here actually think keeping Swisher and Vazquez would magically have prevented Quentin from being hurt and mediocre this year, Dye's second half suckfest, Linebrinks ERA of about 200.00 in the second half, and Buerhle being unable to win a game after his perfect game.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

QUOTE (almagest @ Sep 27, 2009 -> 11:08 PM)
I just find it amusing that people here actually think keeping Swisher and Vazquez would magically have prevented Quentin from being hurt and mediocre this year, Dye's second half suckfest, Linebrinks ERA of about 200.00 in the second half, and Buerhle being unable to win a game after his perfect game.

No, but our opening day CF wouldn't have been Wise and our 4-5 wouldn't of been both Colon and Contreras

Link to comment
Share on other sites

No, but our opening day CF wouldn't have been Wise and our 4-5 wouldn't of been both Colon and Contreras

 

Since you keep bringing up Swisher, whom I think is a stiff, let me put in a plug for Rowand. Until Rios (maybe) we haven't had a good option in cf since Rowand.

He was (is) a stud.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Since you keep bringing up Swisher, whom I think is a stiff, let me put in a plug for Rowand. Until Rios (maybe) we haven't had a good option in cf since Rowand.

He was (is) a stud.

Rowand was a pretty solid player. His 2004 season was pretty damn good. I'm not sure if I would go as far as calling him a stud, but he played sound defense and was decent on offense.

 

I think Rios will be better in years to come, though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Sep 27, 2009 -> 08:31 PM)
No, but our opening day CF wouldn't have been Wise and our 4-5 wouldn't of been both Colon and Contreras

 

We still would've had Contreras as our #5, and Vazquez would've predictably crapped his pants if we ended up contending down the stretch.

 

I'm not a fan of Rios' contract, but I like going into 2010 with Peavy and Rios a hell of a lot more than I would've with Vazquez and Swisher.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Sep 27, 2009 -> 10:31 PM)
No, but our opening day CF wouldn't have been Wise and our 4-5 wouldn't of been both Colon and Contreras
There's no guarantee either player would've done as well as they have with their new teams. Even if they did, there's absolutely no way that would push us from 6 below .500 to 11+ above. We also wouldn't have Peavy, Rios, Flowers, and possibly Viciedo.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

*angry yawn*

 

Do we really have to keep talking about Vazquez and Swisher? I realize it was this lousy article that brough it up, but enough is enough. Yes, the Sox did not get anything really for Swisher. But he obvously didn't fit in, whether it be with Ozzie or the team or whatever. And as far as Vazquez, good riddance to an almost guaranteed implosion every time he took the mound. Flowers should prove to be a good acquisition in the not too distant future.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...