Fitting Ending to 2009 Season

[greg775]

I agree he's played himself out of a position in right. He's a DH now. Now you could ask, "Why not consider it an off second half defensively since you are saying he just had an off season offensively?"

I don't know. I just have a feeling he can still hit, but those big long legs just can't get moving in right field as much any more. I disagree that he's always been awful in right. He's been OK in right his Sox career, but the second half did seem like he was worse than normal.

If the Sox or somebody decides he can still roam the outfield, I'd be OK with that, but I'd tend to agree with you (just from my own eyes) that he's a risk out there in right at the age of 36 and up. Would interesting to hear what KW and the scouts really think.

[Jordan4life_2007]

I agree he's played himself out of a position in right. He's a DH now. Now you could ask, "Why not consider it an off second half defensively since you are saying he just had an off season offensively?"

I don't know. I just have a feeling he can still hit, but those big long legs just can't get moving in right field as much any more. I disagree that he's always been awful in right. He's been OK in right his Sox career, but the second half did seem like he was worse than normal.

If the Sox or somebody decides he can still roam the outfield, I'd be OK with that, but I'd tend to agree with you (just from my own eyes) that he's a risk out there in right at the age of 36 and up. Would interesting to hear what KW and the scouts really think.

 

An off second half defensively? He's been a butcher in RF for years now. The older he gets the worse he gets.

[simba43]

An off second half defensively? He's been a butcher in RF for years now. The older he gets the worse he gets.

i believe rios will have a great year next year and we got a very good defensive cf in him to i for one like the rios pickup .

i say he hits 285 25hr 105 rbis and 30sb

[son of a rude]

An off second half defensively? He's been a butcher in RF for years now. The older he gets the worse he gets.

~The legacy of 2005 will live on in the minds of fans forever~

[Jordan4life_2007]

i believe rios will have a great year next year and we got a very good defensive cf in him to i for one like the rios pickup .

i say he hits 285 25hr 105 rbis and 30sb

 

I was referring to Dye. Rios' defense isn't, and never has been, in question. I love the pickup. He's already our best all-around player.

[nitetrain8601]

As santo=dorf put it, his career OPS+ is only 101. Really, he's had 2-3 years of great success, but even then, his career numbers are worse than Swisher's. To see alot more of Rios' in depth stats, I suggest people read that Javy and Swisher thread.

 

Anyways, Rios did look like a competent hitter finally for the last two weeks of the season. We'll see what happens.

[santo=dorf]

Your bias against Rios is just getting obnoxious. Stupid comments like the part I bolded make it annoying. He is a great center fielder. What makes you think he will end up in RF? Is it that unrealistic that he will play in CF throughout his contract with us?

Ozzie is still the manager, and I have a feeling the Sox will bring back Wise and make an attempt to lure back Pods. I don't expect Dye to be back.

 

Then there's also the idea that Ozzie played with in rotating the 4 OF's with the DH spot. So instead of having a full time CF and full time DH, we'll have a below average defensive player in CF (Pods) or brutal hitter in CF (Wise,) with a DH that has a 101 OPS+/

[ThunderBolt]

If we bring back Wise, i'm a f***ing A's fan from now on. Not really, but i'll be pissed off.

[Dick Allen]

Ozzie was on comcast, some sort of exclusive interview. He expects Dye to be gone and told Lillibridge and Nix they are little guys and if they don't start trying to play like little guys they won't be White Sox for long.

[ThunderBolt]

Ozzie was on comcast, some sort of exclusive interview. He expects Dye to be gone and told Lillibridge and Nix they are little guys and if they don't start trying to play like little guys they won't be White Sox for long.

Yeah, Ozzie! Damn that Jayson Nix with his 30-bomb pace! You need to play to your limitations, not surpass them! God, Ozzie's a moron isn't he?

[Dick Allen]

Yeah, Ozzie! Damn that Jayson Nix with his 30-bomb pace! You need to play to your limitations, not surpass them! God, Ozzie's a moron isn't he?

His 30 HR pace slowed considerably. He can't hit RHP and hit .175 at USCF. I know you love him, but he has some issues.

[ThunderBolt]

His 30 HR pace slowed considerably. He can't hit RHP and hit .175 at USCF. I know you love him, but he has some issues.

I agree with you. My arguement has never been that Nix is a great player, just that he's better then Chris Getz. The fact is Nix looks like a guy who could hit you 20 or more home runs, and i find it bizzare that Ozzie wants him to play away from an obvious strength.

[Dick Allen]

I agree with you. My arguement has never been that Nix is a great player, just that he's better then Chris Getz. The fact is Nix looks like a guy who could hit you 20 or more home runs, and i find it bizzare that Ozzie wants him to play away from an obvious strength.

Ozzie played him a lot against LHP. If he played every day this season, he might not have hit .200. He needs to change. I think Ozzie knows he's not a 30 homer guy. If his approach remains the same, he's not going to be a MLB player for long. As for Lillibridge, I think the Sox should just release him.

Edited October 6, 2009 by Dick Allen

[ThunderBolt]

Ozzie Guillen was 5’11 with no power and a great glove.

Nix is 5’11 with a moderate amount of power and a great glove..

Dan Uggla 5’11

Brian Roberts is 5’9

Aaron Hill is 5’11

Dustin Pedroia is 5’9

Brandon Phillips is 5’11

 

No. Nix is nowhere near as good as these players, but he is of comparable size, and skillset. These guys hits the long ball. I wonder if there’s a certain about of symmetry Ozzie sees in Nix.

 

[greg775]

Yeah, Ozzie! Damn that Jayson Nix with his 30-bomb pace! You need to play to your limitations, not surpass them! God, Ozzie's a moron isn't he?

 

Bolt, you and I disagree so much it's amazing.

How can you be this high on f***ing Jayson Nix?? He is not real good, period. And he shouldn't be trying to whack it out of the park, period.

How can you not agree with Oz? I will admit Nix is better than Lilly and is a good utility option.

 

And I wouldn't say Nix has a "great glove."

Edited October 6, 2009 by greg775

[greg775]

An off second half defensively? He's been a butcher in RF for years now. The older he gets the worse he gets.

 

This just isn't correct. He has not been a "butcher" in right field for years.

[greg775]

Quite a few.

Why do you guys call him a butcher in right field for "several years now."

Nationally Dye does NOT have this tag.

I'm not talking about the second half of this season when he was bad out there.

I'm talking about his other seasons with the Sox. He was serviceable out there. I honestly don't get where you are coming from with this s*** about how he has been AWFUL in right for several years.

Take a deep breath and realize the country does not share this opinion of Dye with you.

I'm not talking about this year's second half. Some of you act like Dye is a stiff; he was a f***ing stud with our team.

[son of a rude]

This just isn't correct. He has not been a "butcher" in right field for years.

Right greg. Your eyes are just better than stats and scouting reports about how good a players is defensively. All the stats and scouting reports say Dye is atrocious on defense. All the stats and scouting reports say Nix is great on defense. Your eyes are much better than them though.

[lostfan]

Quite a few.

Why do you guys call him a butcher in right field for "several years now."

Nationally Dye does NOT have this tag.

I'm not talking about the second half of this season when he was bad out there.

I'm talking about his other seasons with the Sox. He was serviceable out there. I honestly don't get where you are coming from with this s*** about how he has been AWFUL in right for several years.

Take a deep breath and realize the country does not share this opinion of Dye with you.

I'm not talking about this year's second half. Some of you act like Dye is a stiff; he was a f***ing stud with our team.

Yes, greg, he does have this tag. It's not like it's a secret, it's not a myth people created on Soxtalk. He's been my favorite player since 2006 but really there is no way to justify his bad defense. Do you ever watch him play in person? He's incredibly slow and barely covers any ground.

[daggins]

Dye's defense is kinda smoke and mirrors. It looks like he is really hustling and makes spectacular plays but really its just that he is slow and has no range. He looks like he is playing good defense (sometimes) but he is definitely not.

 

Then again sometimes a ball goes right over his head and you're just :facepalm:

[greg775]

Guys, my argument is not that Dye is below average defensively NOW.

I take exception to the fact he's been horses*** defensively the three years prior to that.

It's simply not true.

Blast him all you want for this year out there when he got a lot of bad reads and starts after balls and pretty much was below average out there.

He's always had a good to very good arm and he's gotten the job done out there.

 

My argument here is not about his D now. I agreed that I feel also he should start being switched to DH.

He has not sucked out there defensively the two to three years prior to this year.

 

I'd be dumb to not admit he was bad in right this year and rightly so probably should be switched to DH. I'm surprised you guys are burying him as a bad defensive player prior to this season. You act like he hasn't been able to ever read fly balls in the past and has been a total buffoon out there.

 

CAN I REPEAT?: Yes I agree it's time for him to DH now. And he's going to be a good DH for somebody next year, not the Sox. Good luck to KW replacing his production and Jimmy Thome's.

 

Oz is in love with Kotsay. Kotsay is not gonna produce playoff caliber team numbers.

Edited October 6, 2009 by greg775

[southsideirish71]

Quite a few.

Why do you guys call him a butcher in right field for "several years now."

Nationally Dye does NOT have this tag.

I'm not talking about the second half of this season when he was bad out there.

I'm talking about his other seasons with the Sox. He was serviceable out there. I honestly don't get where you are coming from with this s*** about how he has been AWFUL in right for several years.

Take a deep breath and realize the country does not share this opinion of Dye with you.

I'm not talking about this year's second half. Some of you act like Dye is a stiff; he was a f***ing stud with our team.

 

Greg. You listen way too much to the opinions of Hawk Harrelson. His player evaluations need to be taken with a grain of salt. Dye is a DH who happens to run out to RF between ABs. He is a statue out in RF. Now if a ball is hit to him, sure he catches it. But if its hit a bit to his left or right then the runner is off to the races. You can say he has a good arm. However when he backs up on his heels on every flyball play, it kind of defeats the momentum of throwing to a base when you are moving backwards. I have no idea on how anyone could watch more than 3 games of the sox and come away with the opinion that Dye is a good OF. This is not something new also. Dye has been bad for a few years now. Dye is to the outfield, what Brian Anderson is to hitting.

Edited October 6, 2009 by southsideirish71

[greg775]

Southside no disrespect but did you read my post?? I'm standing up for Dye the outfielder prior to the second half of this season.

He has not been a butcher out there in the past; he's been quite serviceable.

I've admitted he looks like a DH now. People have been burying Jermaine saying he's always been a bum in right field and that is not the case.

I'm not going to bury Jermaine just because he's the flavor of the second half to bury.

Edited October 6, 2009 by greg775

[daggins]

From 2006-2008 Dye posted a -21 UZR rating or worse in RF. You can argue the validity of UZR as a stat somewhat but when the numbers are that bad for that long, its pretty obvious that the player is a bad defender.

 

Also according to Fangraphs JD played at SS for a third of an inning in 2005. Weird.

[Kalapse]

Southside no disrespect but did you read my post?? I'm standing up for Dye the outfielder prior to the second half of this season.

He has not been a butcher out there in the past; he's been quite serviceable.

I've admitted he looks like a DH now. People have been burying Jermaine saying he's always been a bum in right field and that is not the case.

I'm not going to bury Jermaine just because he's the flavor of the second half to bury.

At this point it just sounds like denial. Why is it that you're just taking offense to this now? I and many others - including anyone in the baseball community that looks at advanced metrics when determining a player's defensive ability - have been talking about Dye's awful defense for a few years now. You just can't be that damn slow and be effective in the outfield. He also never learned how to properly set himself up to make a throw which is why his arm is so ineffective (this one is BLATANTLY obvious).

 

Just wait until the Sox find an everyday right fielder who doesn't move in slow motion, you'll be shocked by just how many balls should be routine but were out of the reach of our everyday RF of the past 5 years.