AGon discussion, et. al.

[JPN366]

Flowers gave himself that nickname, he has it tattooed on his arm.

[iamshack]

Flowers gave himself that nickname, he has it tattooed on his arm.

One should never, ever, give oneself one's own nickname...

Edited November 18, 2009 by iamshack

[JPN366]

 

I hope you're doing better in broadcasting than me.

[JPN366]

Since Jay Hineybird is Jay Hineybird, can we have a vote on Cowley's nickname? My vote is for "Cowleysaurus."

[flavum]

Flowers gave himself that nickname, he has it tattooed on his arm.

 

Trade him!

[JPN366]

One should never, ever, give oneself one's own nickname...

 

What's done is done.

[Kalapse]

Okay there's nothing wrong with making it really clear how strong you feel about a point, but there's no need to demean callers/fans of the show just because they disagree with you.

Honestly, if Bernstein didn't belittle callers I wouldn't listen.

[longshot7]

Since Jay Hineybird is Jay Hineybird, can we have a vote on Cowley's nickname? My vote is for "Cowleysaurus."

 

God, those are both awful.....

[Flash Tizzle]

Did Joe Cowley seriously try to say he has some higher level training that we dont have? I would bet way over 50% of the people on this site have a better education than Mr Cowley.

Journalism is like most non-specialist professions where it's not so much that, if pulled off the street, we couldn't do anything they could do; but more of the idea that they've put in the time to reach their positions. With experience, they'll say, will come invaluable teachings of the profession that can't be taught within a classroom. Bloggers threaten not only their livelihoods, but (and I know I'm reaching quite a bit) their accomplishments. Someone in a basement with a keyboard can reach just as many people, and have just as much influence, as any big-city journalist. This can't feel good.

 

With Cowley, I'm sure he's been in the business for 10+ years. There's that voice in his head which repeatedly asks, "When will the Sun-Times wake up and realize that someone can do my job for much cheaper?" It doesn't even have to be a blogger. If Cowley had a whole host of sources that made him invaluable I could see it, but I'm very doubtful of that. If I was him I'd begin to think about my family and their future. If being arrogant and overly argumentative is his angle, similar to Hineybird, perhaps he'll always find a home at some newspaper. But he has to wonder, what will happen 20 years from now?

 

Far as this rumor, I hope nothing changes as a result of it. If this same Angels source calls Jason tomorrow I'd expect him to post another story without hesitation. I know one of the arguments made by newspapers against bloggers is that there's no accountability. That when a story falls through or is proven false, there's no recourse. Conversly, when a source proves accurate the blog receives all the praise. They're only upset because it's the perfect world -- all of the benefit with limited risk. And really, Jason made it quite clear that it was only a rumor. Nothing was certain. It isn't his fault news organization, fearful of being scooped, pick up on a story.

Edited November 18, 2009 by Flash Tizzle

[iamshack]

What form of accountability is there when newspapers have information and the event in question does not come to fruition?

 

I can't recall any sort of accountability in Chicago sports journalism over the past 5 years, other than Rick Morrissey eating his column about Joakim Noah a few weeks ago...

[bmags]

flowers named himself TFlow? Ugh. I don't like him anymore.

 

Accountability, (referring to Flash (btw what up flash)), in sports trade winds is just as non-existent with established media. There's a reason we called Levine the Carpetbomber or whatever, I don't know what the hell we called him, but it had something to do with reporting everything.

 

And frankly, I knew we'd be in the Gonzalez sweepstakes in terms of interest. BUt the interesting thing was konerko moving to get cash for it.

 

SO anyways, f*** off cowley.

[chetkincaid]

Honestly, if Bernstein didn't belittle callers I wouldn't listen.

 

 

At times Bernstein is an even bigger d-bag than Cowley. For a while there it seemed like Laurence Holmes was trying to imitate Bernstein and belittle callers.

Edited November 18, 2009 by Chet Kincaid

[jamesdiego]

Journalism is like most non-specialist professions where it's not so much that, if pulled off the street, we couldn't do anything they could do; but more of the idea that they've put in the time to reach their positions. With experience, they'll say, will come invaluable teachings of the profession that can't be taught within a classroom. Bloggers threaten not only their livelihoods, but (and I know I'm reaching quite a bit) their accomplishments. Someone in a basement with a keyboard can reach just as many people, and have just as much influence, as any big-city journalist. This can't feel good.

 

With Cowley, I'm sure he's been in the business for 10+ years. There's that voice in his head which repeatedly asks, "When will the Sun-Times wake up and realize that someone can do my job for much cheaper?" It doesn't even have to be a blogger. If Cowley had a whole host of sources that made him invaluable I could see it, but I'm very doubtful of that. If I was him I'd begin to think about my family and their future. If being arrogant and overly argumentative is his angle, similar to Hineybird, perhaps he'll always find a home at some newspaper. But he has to wonder, what will happen 20 years from now?

 

Far as this rumor, I hope nothing changes as a result of it. If this same Angels source calls Jason tomorrow I'd expect him to post another story without hesitation. I know one of the arguments made by newspapers against bloggers is that there's no accountability. That when a story falls through or is proven false, there's no recourse. Conversly, when a source proves accurate the blog receives all the praise. They're only upset because it's the perfect world -- all of the benefit with limited risk. And really, Jason made it quite clear that it was only a rumor. Nothing was certain. It isn't his fault news organization, fearful of being scooped, pick up on a story.

 

So this is an Angels source? Or did you just randomly name one of the teams?

[WCSox]

I know one of the arguments made by newspapers against bloggers is that there's no accountability. That when a story falls through or is proven false, there's no recourse. Conversly, when a source proves accurate the blog receives all the praise. They're only upset because it's the perfect world -- all of the benefit with limited risk.

 

That's a poor argument on behalf of the newspapers. Like newspapers, bloggers will suffer the same consequences when their readers realize that they're given bad information: they'll stop reading. As for the "all of the benefit with limited risk" part, bloggers tend to not get paid nearly as much money as professional journalists who work for major media conglomerates. Most bloggers have a separate full-time job as their primary source of income.

 

[iamshack]

So this is an Angels source? Or did you just randomly name one of the teams?

I think he is making assumptions, being that the Angels are one of the teams in the rumored discussion.

[Flash Tizzle]

What form of accountability is there when newspapers have information and the event in question does not come to fruition?

 

I can't recall any sort of accountability in Chicago sports journalism over the past 5 years, other than Rick Morrissey eating his column about Joakim Noah a few weeks ago...

Well, there will probably be some degree of recourse within the circle of other journalists and colleagues. Even if it's nothing more than talking behind someone's back. This would most likely occur with those who believe in thoroughly checking sources and only going through with a story when there's corroboration.

 

With readers, I don't believe many will care. CNN, Fox News and others sure as hell don't miss a beat when they race to pull up the "Breaking News" banner according to some rumor and it isn't accurate. There are a host examples from the 2000 election to more recently with Balloon boy.

 

There's a difference between what happened on Soxtalk then what would have happened if Cowley had an exclusive that turned out false. We'd all rip him because, as we still believe (maybe naively) that there still exists some process newspapers follow for releasing stories.

Edited November 18, 2009 by Flash Tizzle

[Dick Allen]

And what does it say that a bunch of Sox fans who cover the team AS A HOBBY scoop Cowley on stories?

Isn't Cowley the guy who said Uribe was going to be released several times--------never happened. Said the Sox were going to go hard after Orlando Hudson------------------never happened. Said Chone Figgins was going to be the target this offseason earlier in the year---------------------not going to happen. Who is this hack questioning anyone? I wouldn't care what the Sox gave up, just to make him look like a fool it would awesome if they got Gonzalez and somehow sent Paulie to the Angels.

 

As far as the rip on training, I would assume Cowley was a journalism major. What kind of training did he have to be on the radio? He's a Hineybird wantabe, and he can't even hang with him.

Edited November 18, 2009 by Dick Allen

[Flash Tizzle]

So this is an Angels source? Or did you just randomly name one of the teams?

I assumed it was an Anaheim source. It probably is.

[iamshack]

Isn't Cowley the guy who said Uribe was going to be released several times--------never happened. Said the Sox were going to go hard after Orlando Hudson------------------never happened. Said Chone Figgins was going to be the target this offseason earlier in the year---------------------not going to happen. Who is this hack questioning anyone? I wouldn't care what the Sox gave up, just to make him look like a fool it would awesome if they got Gonzalez and somehow sent Paulie to the Angels.

One of the rare things we agree on.

 

My issue with Cowley is that as a beat-writer working in a major metropolitan area, for a major news outlet, his work just isn't up to snuff. He doesn't come close to offering out pieces like Gordon Edes, Susan Slusser, or former beat writers Buster Olney, Tim Kurkjian, Ken Rosenthal, etc,. His pieces are uninformed, illogical conjecture which bring absolutely nothing to the table. It does not appear that the White Sox are particularly enamored with his work either, as they certainly don't seem to go out of their way to give him much of anything in the way of valuable information.

 

As fans of a major market team, we deserve better than Joe Cowley. And that ticks me off.

[Flash Tizzle]

That's a poor argument on behalf of the newspapers. Like newspapers, bloggers will suffer the same consequences when their readers realize that they're given bad information: they'll stop reading. As for the "all of the benefit with limited risk" part, bloggers tend to not get paid nearly as much money as professional journalists who work for major media conglomerates. Most bloggers have a separate full-time job as their primary source of income.

When people stop reading newspapers, money is lost. When people stop reading blogs, what exactly is lost except someones (often) anonymous reputation? These consequences are not the same.

 

And as for your second sentence, it's basically enforces what I stated earlier. If you're paid for your work, are you willing to throw out something in the chance that it's accurate? What risks do bloggers assume here? If they're right, awesome; if not, well, it was just a rumor and the blog exist to give fans everything as they hear it.

 

 

[Dick Allen]

Someone needs to point out several moves reported on this board while Cowley was busy flexing in front of his bathroom mirror telling himself how great he was. There have been plenty.

[iamshack]

Someone needs to point out several moves reported on this board while Cowley was busy flexing in front of his bathroom mirror telling himself how great he was. There have been plenty.

Jason did so in an email he sent earlier this evening. Cowley basically scoffed at the notion and told Jason he was "out of his lane" in reporting these rumors because he doesn't have the access or knowledge to do so.

[SoxFan1]

I hope you're doing better in broadcasting than me.

Funny you mention this, my unofficial broadcast career started last Friday doing play-by-play for the GVSU Hockey team. Remember that PM you sent me a while back? That was reassuring. :lol"

 

Oh, and my favorite line from the reponse he sent you: "so don’t tell me how you can do my job. You can’t. You don’t have the training, the access or the staying power."

[Dick Allen]

Jason did so in an email he sent earlier this evening. Cowley basically scoffed at the notion and told Jason he was "out of his lane" in reporting these rumors because he doesn't have the access or knowledge to do so.

 

You would think a guy who beat cancer and gets paid to do what he does would be wound a little less tightly. I could understand how a guy writing for a paper would really despise any and all bloggers, but if the information is wrong, why would it upset him so much? The only way Cowley is going to look bad is if he gets scooped by a blogger. If anything he just made a lot more people read the blog. He really is a loser. He thinks he's a writer, comedian, talk show host, but all he really is is an insecure hack.

[Dick Allen]

Funny you mention this, my unofficial broadcast career started last Friday doing play-by-play for the GVSU Hockey team. Remember that PM you sent me a while back? That was reassuring. :lol"

 

Oh, and my favorite line from the reponse he sent you: "so don’t tell me how you can do my job. You can’t. You don’t have the training, the access or the staying power."

There are many comments we all could make about Cowley's "training" but they all are suspension-worthy.