scenario Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 QUOTE (knightni @ Nov 22, 2009 -> 06:21 PM) Flowers, Hudson, Jenks and D2 for Upton might be TBs offer. If Friedman asked for that much, I'd refuse to take his phone calls in the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzie Ball Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 22, 2009 -> 10:53 PM) Since we already have a guy who can hopefully play a solid CF for us...our need for Upton is a little less than what other teams might have, esp. if he can't work as a leadoff hitter. It really doesn't make sense for this team to overpay for him. The thing that it would make sense for this team to overpay for would be a corner OF or a really big, 40 HR type bat somewhere on the field. If we're going to deal for Upton, we better feel like the Rays sold low. We still need an outfielder though, this way we'd be able to move Rios to RF, where he has been a better defensive player and then stick Upton in CF, where he has been better than Rios so you'd upgrading two positions defensively. I'd love to see a move for Upton if we can get him for a decent rate, but I wouldn't want to give Flowers, Hudson + for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cornball Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 22, 2009 -> 05:23 PM) If he had the kind of year it looked like he was capable of, he could legit ask for $8-10 mil as an opening arbitration bid. Ryan Howard won a $10 million bid a year or so ago didn't he? But of course, if he hit that well we'd probably have a world series under our belts, so we might not mind. I doubt he would be that expensive when the time comes and would be inexpensive for next year. I do believe he would be a perfect piece for the Sox. The defense would be vastly improved in the outfield and a leadoff man with speed. His career OBP is good, last year the exception. I think he would be the perfect piece, however he is a right handed bat and the need for a power lefty would remain. If you could work out a deal with Jenks (closer and catcher seem to be the concerns for the Rays) as the center of a deal, coupled with the farm for A Gonzales, all would be great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 QUOTE (cornball @ Nov 22, 2009 -> 07:30 PM) I think he would be the perfect piece, however he is a right handed bat and the need for a power lefty would remain. If you could work out a deal with Jenks (closer and catcher seem to be the concerns for the Rays) as the center of a deal, coupled with the farm for A Gonzales, all would be great. This ain't X-Box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted November 23, 2009 Author Share Posted November 23, 2009 IMO, Tampa is not going to trade a real good player for Jenks unless the White Sox eat a lot of money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 I would offer Jenks as a throw in just to free up money for Matsui. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Jenks won't make " a lot " of money. Maybe 6 or 7 mil. The Sox might pay part if they can get Upton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 QUOTE (knightni @ Nov 22, 2009 -> 06:56 PM) Jenks won't make " a lot " of money. Maybe 6 or 7 mil. The Sox might pay part if they can get Upton. Around $7.5M and yes, that's a lot of money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cornball Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 QUOTE (knightni @ Nov 22, 2009 -> 06:40 PM) This ain't X-Box. Your the guy wanting to send Flowers, Hudson, Jenks and D2 for Upton. That would be complete fantasy, way too much. A proven closer, and 3 major league ready prospects....wow. Get real yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 I said that it would take a lot to get him in Tampa's mind. I don't want to send those guys for Upton, I just know that it will take a lot to get him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 I'd offer them Bobby + 1 of Hudson/Flowers + Retherford for Upton + a reliever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cornball Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 QUOTE (knightni @ Nov 22, 2009 -> 07:26 PM) I said that it would take a lot to get him in Tampa's mind. I don't want to send those guys for Upton, I just know that it will take a lot to get him. I don't want to argue with you, that proposal was a direct quote from your post. A trade of Upton would only happen if Crawford would be extended, and they have their own prospect to plug in the OF. I think you may misjudge the value of prospects these days. Bobby Jenks also has value, except the salary is getting high, especially for the Rays. My "x-box" thought was he is a right handed hitter and while he would bat leadoff/improve defense, doesn't address the power lefty slot needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 QUOTE (cornball @ Nov 22, 2009 -> 08:36 PM) I don't want to argue with you, that proposal was a direct quote from your post. A trade of Upton would only happen if Crawford would be extended, and they have their own prospect to plug in the OF. I think you may misjudge the value of prospects these days. Bobby Jenks also has value, except the salary is getting high, especially for the Rays. My "x-box" thought was he is a right handed hitter and while he would bat leadoff/improve defense, doesn't address the power lefty slot needed. My quote is that's what TB would probably want. Upton and Gonzalez both is a dream. It is very unlikely without a game system and a CPU GM on the other side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Wait, Upton with his current MLB resume we're saying could net 9 mill a season? Or are we assuming improvement to what he should, in fact, be? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPN366 Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Forget Upton, trade for Desmond Jennings and you'd have your leadoff hitter/CF for years. As much as I like Daniel Hudson, I'd trade him for Jennings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Who in their right mind wouldn't trade Hudson for Jennings? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 QUOTE (Kalapse @ Nov 22, 2009 -> 07:20 PM) Around $7.5M and yes, that's a lot of money. Tampa recognizes they have to step up to compete in the AL East. If they scoff at the price... fine... Let them wallow in loserville again. God knows they're familiar with the territory. But if they want to play with the big boys... $7.5M is not alot of money to pay for one of the best closers in MLB. Look at what tightwad Cleveland was willing to pay for Kerry Wood to try and help them get over the top. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cornball Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 QUOTE (knightni @ Nov 22, 2009 -> 07:39 PM) My quote is that's what TB would probably want. Upton and Gonzalez both is a dream. It is very unlikely without a game system and a CPU GM on the other side. I must have missed it. Here are all your posts in this thread. I'd rather keep the young guys and rebuild than throw a bunch of prospects at another AL team for a guy due for a giant payday. Hmm.. Okay, that's not as bad as I thought. With arb though, he could be pulling down 9-10 mil a year. Flowers, Hudson, Jenks and D2 for Upton might be TBs offer. This ain't X-Box. Jenks won't make " a lot " of money. Maybe 6 or 7 mil. The Sox might pay part if they can get Upton I said that it would take a lot to get him in Tampa's mind. I don't want to send those guys for Upton, I just know that it will take a lot to get him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPN366 Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 QUOTE (3E8 @ Nov 22, 2009 -> 07:53 PM) Who in their right mind wouldn't trade Hudson for Jennings? I would with the depth in the rotation the White Sox have. I'm the last person who would want to trade top prospects, and I would make that deal for Jennings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Flowers, Hudson, Jenks and D2 for Upton might be TBs offer. QUOTE (knightni @ Nov 22, 2009 -> 08:39 PM) My quote is that's what TB would probably want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 (edited) I don't think TB would be too interested in D2, certainly not as an option for 2010. Hudson and Flowers would definitely be the starting place...it would be a huge gamble to give up cost-controlled starting pitching and a catcher to replace AJ for 6 years, if that's really where the club sees him sticking. If KW knows Flowers or Viciedo is ticked for 1B, then I would make this trade. Including Jenks in the deal means we would have to take back another contract from them. I'm not such how motivated they would be to take Jenks, it would be a huge gamble...and some of Jenks' biggest implosions last season came against TB, so maybe they're skeptical about him retaining his elite closer status. Of course, overspending for someone like Jose Valverde is risky too, but you don't have to give up any major league talent...and there's 4-5 other interesting guys out there on the closer's market that low payroll tier teams like TB would look at first IMO. Edited November 23, 2009 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 QUOTE (JPN366 @ Nov 22, 2009 -> 08:57 PM) I would with the depth in the rotation the White Sox have. I'm the last person who would want to trade top prospects, and I would make that deal for Jennings. I think you misread my statement, I was asking if there was anyone who wouldn't trade Hudson for Jennings. Jennings is one of the most elite prospects in the game Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPN366 Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (3E8 @ Nov 22, 2009 -> 08:17 PM) I think you misread my statement, I was asking if there was anyone who wouldn't trade Hudson for Jennings. Jennings is one of the most elite prospects in the game I see, my bad. I would float that idea to Tampa and see if they bite. It could always be a starting point at least. Edited November 23, 2009 by JPN366 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 KW really has never gone for that kind of a move, a Brandon Jennings. As great as his potential might be, KW always errors on the side of finding undervalued/underperforming talent. I can't think of one instance in his history where's overpaid for an unproven prospect, trading away the likes of Flowers/Hudson/Mitchell, etc. and a couple of other pieces to get him. In fact, his track record is just the opposite, trading overvalued prospects for proven talent. Yes, there are always going to be players in hindsight that you would have traded for (like an Evan Longoria), but 80-90% of the time those elite prospects never produce as expected, at least enough to justify their massive price tag in terms of talent surrendered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco72 Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Plus the Sox aren't in a position where they HAVE to overpay for someone. They need help at a few positions, and maybe you overpay for a proven talent like Adrian Gonzalez. I agree with Caulfield, I don't see KW overpaying for a prospect like Jennings or even a guy like Upton (again, unless it's a deal based on Upton's current MLB value). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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