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QUOTE (greg775 @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 01:29 PM)
1.) What do ya mean? Are stores all closed? Just wondering.

 

I would think it's the economy. I hear people b****ing about movie prices. Why would anybody go to a major league baseball game at full price? Most people want good seats not upper tank. If good seats cost that kind of money, people probably take their family or nephew once or twice a year and go to minor league games the other times

 

An observation that the south Chicago area has been hit harder than most places in Illinois by the economy. Foreclosures, business closing, etc. I've gone to south side bars on Friday nights that were packed a few years ago, now they're empty.

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I get that salaries spiraled out of control similarly, but the fans are the ones paying for all this. It is absolutely unreasonable to believe $200-$500 is a reasonable amount of money for any middle class family to spend on an afternoon's worth of entertainment.

 

I can't imagine baseball cares about families at all. No family with little kids wants to go sit in the upper tank with dad/mom dropping 500 bucks. Middle class wives I know would have a seizure if hubby even suggested a 500 buck outing. And to watch that s***ty offense for that kind of jack?

 

Baseball caters to the businesses who buy tickets and the businessmen who buy four season tickets a year and go spend a mint on beer, food, etc.

Edited by greg775
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Heck, you can stay at a really nice hotel in Bali for $50-75 per night.

 

Rent a car for $10-15 per day.

 

Gas for 3-4 days, $10.

 

Eat 4-5 star food for $7.50-12.50 per meal.

 

If it wasn't for the flight from the US ($250 for me to fly Manila to Jakarta, $50-60 Jakarta to Bali each way), it would be a great bargain. But spending it on this White Sox team is a tough cost-benefit for everyone in 2011.

 

If Greg went to Bali and posted here less often, his blood pressure would decrease. $7.50 per hour for hot stone/Thai/Balinese massage....he'd like that.

Edited by caulfield12
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QUOTE (Soxfest @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 10:44 PM)
Sox get $23.00 for parking far and away the highest in MLB in the revenue stream.

 

23 bucks. They'll round it off to 25 next year. What a joke.

So you get 4 college kids driving to a game in the summer from suburbia like we used to do in the day.

Just the parking at 6 bucks a head would piss us off.

Beers are now 10 bucks? Tickets a lot? Do college kids still go to games a bunch at these prices?

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QUOTE (greg775 @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 05:46 PM)
Beers are now 10 bucks? Tickets a lot? Do college kids still go to games a bunch at these prices?

God no, if I were still in college I'd consider a game a year, probably against the Cubs, and that was it.

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Do they give student (with ID) and senior citizen (60+) discounts on ticketing? Curious.

 

I used to go to a ton of KC Royals game....$7-8 for outfield reserved bleacher seats, maybe the same for parking, pretty fair prices on food/concessions. Upper deck reserved seats were bargain-priced pretty consistently, too. Basically, the same upper deck as USCF, but no fountains/outfield backdrop to rival KC.

 

If I was feeling extra cheap, I'd just chow down at the Taco Bell across the street and spend no more than $15-16 plus gas. And you could park across I-70 and walk not so far and save the parking fee.

Edited by caulfield12
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QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 08:44 AM)
I wonder how many Sox fans have personally written to Brooks Boyer on this issue?

 

I've just never understood why they weren't AT LEAST a BIT more flexible with those upper deck seats...seems they're just so set in their ways with their price points/cost-benefit analysis.

 

They used to have good Sunday "family/kids" day crowds.

 

Do they still do those Pepsi half-price promos?

 

Why don't they try doing 2 for 1 beer specials for those sitting in the upper deck? Free promo item if you are in the first 3-5000 upper deck fans? Or hot dog and a Large Coke for $5.00? There has to be some good ideas out there that could be implemented.

 

OH, WEATHER.

 

Forgot that convenient excuse.

 

 

http://espn.go.com/mlb/attendance

 

Currently 19th.

I don't get how we're behind Cincinnati, Houston and San Diego, especially those last 2. I guess the Reds had an increase based on their 2010 season and increased 2011 season ticket sales, because they've played a LOT like the White Sox this year.

 

http://espn.go.com/mlb/attendance/_/sort/allAvg

We're also 19th in overall attendance, home and away combined.

 

I'd love to see our overall ticket/parking/souvenir/food sales revenues at 25,000 per game versus 40,000 in Minnesota. To see how far we actually trail them in this one area. We're 5,000 per game behind the Tigers.

 

I would think the weather does play a role but some of the teams you mentioned have the same climate.

 

The economy has a lot to do with it. You wonder at what point the owners are going to admit that when it comes to free agency.

 

White Sox baseball is way over priced. I don't think it has as much to do with the quality on the field as the pricing.

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The Sox this year made dam near all games tiered pricing, I understand Bos, NY, Cubs, but alot made no sense at all and made the games way overpriced and fans said HELL NO! I think this turned off alot of fans IMO!

Edited by Soxfest
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QUOTE (Soxfest @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 04:50 PM)
The Sox this year made dam near all games tiered pricing, I understand Bos, NY, Cubs, but alot made no sense at all and made the games way overpriced and fans said HELL NO! I think this turned off alot of fans IMO!

 

There's also plenty of affordable "I don't care who wins" independent semi pro games to go to around the area. I miss going to Jackhammer games. The Sox also have the highest price Spring Training tickets. I got to see the Sox at Diamondbacks this Summer. While we got some free tickets, it was 7th row from the field and those were only $36. Their concessions have value items as well.

 

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QUOTE (kitekrazy @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 04:47 PM)
I would think the weather does play a role but some of the teams you mentioned have the same climate.

 

The economy has a lot to do with it. You wonder at what point the owners are going to admit that when it comes to free agency.

 

White Sox baseball is way over priced. I don't think it has as much to do with the quality on the field as the pricing.

Weather plays a role with the Sox in April and May. Not now.

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I started this thread and have now read some good observations. Almost all concern the money aspect. This seems valid to me as it would also be my main issue.

 

1. I'm not buying the weather factor. this summer has been just plain hot and the ballpark at night is glorious. All teams in our region have weather issues.

 

2.Not only is parking outrageous but I used to find street parking which is virtually impossible now due to the city instituting permit only and pay boxes within about 100 mile of the stadium.

 

3. I can't believe the White Sox charge much more than other teams, but some of you have opened my eyes to the fact that do. In a structured way. We do not go to nearly as many games as we used to because it is just too expensive.

 

4. The economy is bad in cities that still draw well.

 

5. I think a city with one team has complete focus and fan loyalty to that team and is not split. The sports spotlight stays on that team period. When the Cubs are really bad and the Sox are not riding high the focus turns to the Bears by mid July and baseball becomes an after thought. This city offers too many other [cheaper] options, especially in the summer.

 

6.Lets face it. Its about the money. Parking Tix and concessions. Thanks boys now I get it.

As a footnote here they did draw 33,000 the next night.

Edited by since56
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QUOTE (since56 @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 07:46 AM)
I started this thread and have now read some good observations. Almost all concern the money aspect. This seems valid to me as it would also be my main issue.

 

1. I'm not buying the weather factor. this summer has been just plain hot and the ballpark at night is glorious. All teams in our region have weather issues.

 

2.Not only is parking outrageous but I used to find street parking which is virtually impossible now due to the city instituting permit only and pay boxes within about 100 mile of the stadium.

 

3. I can't believe the White Sox charge much more than other teams, but some of you have opened my eyes to the fact that do. In a structerd way. We do not go to nearly as many games as we used to because it is just too expensive.

 

4. The economy is bad in cities that still draw well.

 

5. I think a city with one team has complete focus and fan loyalty to that team and is not split. The sports spotlight stays on that team period. When the Cubs are really bad and the Sox are not riding high the focus turns to the Bears by mid July and baseball becomes an after thought. This city offers too many other [cheaper] options, especially in the summer.

 

6.Lets face it. Its about the money. Parking Tix and concessions. Thanks boys now I get it.

As a footnote here they did draw 33,000 the next night.

 

 

Especially when you look at Detroit 5,000 per night ahead of us and Pittsburgh right on our heels.

 

Of course, we're dramatically outproducing the Pirates in overall revenue, but the economic crisis has had a much greater impact across the so-called "Rust Belt" than anywhere else...Cleveland, as well.

 

I wouldn't be surprised after all the "go for it now" trade/s to see the Indians start to outdraw us for the next two months as well.

 

Even the Tigers now have their entire starting rotation under team control through 2014 (Verlander/Scherzer/Porcello/Fister/Jacob Turner). All will be under 30 or younger (Verlander I think 31) and two of them still 25 and younger as that season begins.

 

The Indians just made their future more interesting...but there's a downside now for them as well, a bit of risk-taking by management to try to bring back the enthusiam to Indians fans who used to consistently sell out Jacobs Field in the 90's and early 00's but have become skeptics like most Sox fans.

 

In many ways, we're kind of in the same exact position as the Twins with payroll/roster going forward. Except they have a brand new ballpark and are still averaging 40,000 in their second season there.

Edited by caulfield12
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QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 08:41 AM)
How much of that goes to the State of Illinois?

So what JR got a free stadium at taxpayer expense. JR is making money hand over fist on everything else.

 

Architect: HOK Sport (Kansas City); HKS, Inc. (Dallas; 2001-2005 renovations)

Construction: Gust K. Newberg (Chicago)

Owner: Illinois Sports Facilities Authority

Cost: $167 million

Public financing: $167 million, or 100 percent, mostly from a 2 percent tax on hotels in Chicago

Edited by Soxfest
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QUOTE (Soxfest @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 10:07 AM)
So what JR got a free stadium at taxpayer expense. JR is making money hand over fist on everything else.

 

Architect: HOK Sport (Kansas City); HKS, Inc. (Dallas; 2001-2005 renovations)

Construction: Gust K. Newberg (Chicago)

Owner: Illinois Sports Facilities Authority

Cost: $167 million

Public financing: $167 million, or 100 percent, mostly from a 2 percent tax on hotels in Chicago

 

The financing was public, but you do know that in exchange for that the Sox pay a portion of the revenues back to the state of Illinois, right?

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QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 31, 2011 -> 10:19 AM)
The financing was public, but you do know that in exchange for that the Sox pay a portion of the revenues back to the state of Illinois, right?

Sox paid 3 million last year in rent that is all, that is nothing IMO. That is a month of Alex Rios .

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It shouldn't be a failure to draw 2 million fans to the park per season. That's 25K per game. The first time it was done in Chicago (Sox or Cubs) was 1983 when the Sox won the division, and I remember it being a big deal. Now it's a failure if you only draw 25K per game. If the owners can't find ways to make money drawing 25K per game (um, how about not paying so much money for players?), I don't have sympathy.

 

The tickets are too expensive. It's that simple.

 

Watch a Yankees game. Winning team. Probably more fans than any other team. Yet, the seats behind home plate are empty because they're overpriced.

 

Same thing with the Cubs this season. I'd say that the percentage of Cubs fans vs. Sox fans is close to 75/25 in favor of the Cubs today (and that's probably conservative, especially when you factor in out of town fans - of which the Sox have close to zero). So, with the Cubs average attendance at 35,000, that means that 6,000 fans are choosing to stay home each game (and it's actually more than that if you count the no -shows). That doesn't seem too bad when you consider that the Sox have about 18,000 fans making the same choice to not go to games. However, let's say there are one million individual fans who attend baseball games in Chicago yearly (750K for the Cubs, 250K for the Sox) - and I'm making the one million number up just to illustrate. That means that on a daily basis, it's not 6,000 fans that are choosing to stay home from Cubs games, it's 715,000. That pool of fans who ate up every available ticket in previous years has had enough. Sure, there are a number of fans who only go to one or two games per season, but when they stayed home in the past, it wasn't noticable on the North Side because there were thousands willing to buy the tickets in their place. On the South Side, if these people stay home, there just aren't enough fans to take their place.

 

I've run out of steam. I don't even know if it makes sense.

 

ps The "our Sox" "their Sox" stuff by Hawk in this White Sox/Red Sox series is unbearable. Just call them the White Sox and Red Sox. I actually turned off the volume on yesterday's game (and I only see the games when they're on WGN so I'm not jaded at this point). It just sounds so stupid.

Edited by Middle Buffalo
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I don't agree about the 75/25 split...I think 60/40, 65/35 is probably closer, especially with how bad the Cubs have been the past 2 seasons.

 

We haven't taken advantage like we should or could have...but we all know the reasons it hasn't happened.

 

You might be right about 75-80% when you're talking markets like Iowa.

Edited by caulfield12
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