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Official 2011-2012 NFL Thread

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QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Apr 28, 2011 -> 11:13 AM)
If the Bears don't draft O-Line with their top pick, I murder someone.

 

I'd actually be fine with taking a DT if the value isn't there at OL at pick 29. They need to address the OL in the draft and FA but you also shouldn't reach just because you have a need.

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QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Apr 28, 2011 -> 11:13 AM)
If the Bears don't draft O-Line with their top pick, I murder someone.

If the top 5 tackles are off the board, I'd be ok with them trading down a bit and grabbing either a OT/OG/DT about 10 picks later (especially if they think austin's red flags will keep him around til pick 35 or so). but no doubt about it...they need to pick an offensive lineman with one of their first two picks

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QUOTE (whitesoxfan99 @ Apr 28, 2011 -> 12:18 PM)
I'd actually be fine with taking a DT if the value isn't there at OL at pick 29. They need to address the OL in the draft and FA but you also shouldn't reach just because you have a need.

Right now, you simply have to assume that FA will not happen. OL must be the Bears pick, at least in the first round, 2-3 OL in the draft would be preferred.

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QUOTE (daa84 @ Apr 28, 2011 -> 11:20 AM)
If the top 5 tackles are off the board, I'd be ok with them trading down a bit and grabbing either a OT/OG/DT about 10 picks later (especially if they think austin's red flags will keep him around til pick 35 or so). but no doubt about it...they need to pick an offensive lineman with one of their first two picks

Yeah I agree about the top tackles being off the board, but I don't wanna trade down.

 

I am all on board for Austin if he is there and the tackles are gone. I think Austin could be a huge steal. Yeah he was suspended, but he has been impressive in workouts and without the suspension would have been a top-10 pick. That is value you just can't pass up, especially in a position of need for the Bears.

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What the hell does Cam Newton have that Tebow didnt have? They both have terrible mechanics, havent operated in a pro-style offense and were running QB's. Newton wasnt even as good as Tebow.

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QUOTE (maggsmaggs @ Apr 28, 2011 -> 11:34 AM)
Yeah I agree about the top tackles being off the board, but I don't wanna trade down.

 

I am all on board for Austin if he is there and the tackles are gone. I think Austin could be a huge steal. Yeah he was suspended, but he has been impressive in workouts and without the suspension would have been a top-10 pick. That is value you just can't pass up, especially in a position of need for the Bears.

 

Austin has all the earmarks of an "Angelo pick." I concur with everything you said, but think he's too risky if the top tackles are still there.

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QUOTE (RockRaines @ Apr 28, 2011 -> 10:48 AM)
What the hell does Cam Newton have that Tebow didnt have? They both have terrible mechanics, havent operated in a pro-style offense and were running QB's. Newton wasnt even as good as Tebow.

 

Mostly agreed. I think the one difference is Newton has a way, way stronger arm than Tebow. And scouts are probably falling in love with that. But his accuracy is erratic, he played 1 year at the top level of college, and we have no idea if he can run a pro offense. Has disaster written all over him.

Edited by whitesoxfan101

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I'm pretty hyped for tonight's Draft! Our GM is a genius and has always drafted well. I'm hoping for Smith/Solder/Carimi/Castonzo in that order, but it's nice to not really care who my team picks!

 

2aqyixgohws3xwl7zir9.gif

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I think one of the big issues with the draft is undrafted free agents. So many UDFAs eventually make teams and become big-time players (Romo, Foster, Welker, Austin, Gates, etc.), but the way the labor situation is now, UDFAs can't be signed. I really hope the NFL allows UDFAs to sign even true free agency fails to commence.

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Im pretty sure most scouts think Newton has a better arm than Tebow (Tebow was still a 1st round pick).

 

Newton also has the advantage that he only played 1 year, so not as much time to see everything he did wrong. They had so much tape on Tebow that they basically knew every throw he could and could not make. Because Newton has only really played a season, its natural to expect hell progress and that hell be even better. Tebow was considered more a finished product.

 

Not that any of those statements are true, its juist a strange phenomenon that sometimes scouts not having as much information can be a good thing for the player.

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QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Apr 28, 2011 -> 01:23 PM)
Im pretty sure most scouts think Newton has a better arm than Tebow (Tebow was still a 1st round pick).

Josh McDaniels picked him though, so that's not really saying anything...

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QUOTE (High Mileage @ Apr 28, 2011 -> 01:59 PM)
I'm pretty hyped for tonight's Draft! Our GM is a genius and has always drafted well. I'm hoping for Smith/Solder/Carimi/Castonzo in that order, but it's nice to not really care who my team picks!

 

2aqyixgohws3xwl7zir9.gif

 

LOVE the direction the front office has taken recently. I'd actually prefer if they wait until later to address the OL. Obviously if Costanzo is there you have to take him but I really don't have much interest in Carimi or Solder. What would be awesome is if Julio Jones drops a little bit and KC can trade up to go get him. I'm confident in another good pick but I'd really prefer we address the pass rush and WR issues in the first two rounds.

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It doesnt matter who drafted him, Tebow went in the first, so Newton going 15-17 picks before him isnt that much of a difference.

 

Its not like Tebow was drafted in the same round as Brady.

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QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Apr 28, 2011 -> 02:43 PM)
It doesnt matter who drafted him, Tebow went in the first, so Newton going 15-17 picks before him isnt that much of a difference.

 

Its not like Tebow was drafted in the same round as Brady.

 

Unless a rookie salary cap is implemented, its gonna make a big difference. As the #1 pick, Newton would get a much larger contract than Tebow.

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QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Apr 28, 2011 -> 02:43 PM)
It doesnt matter who drafted him, Tebow went in the first, so Newton going 15-17 picks before him isnt that much of a difference.

 

Its not like Tebow was drafted in the same round as Brady.

I was mainly speaking on how much the scouts, fans etc crapped on him prior to the draft, yet Cam Newton who wasnt as successful and never had a year as good at Tebow did and has the same mechanical issues is a consensus #1 pick.

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QUOTE (RockRaines @ Apr 28, 2011 -> 11:48 AM)
What the hell does Cam Newton have that Tebow didnt have? They both have terrible mechanics, havent operated in a pro-style offense and were running QB's. Newton wasnt even as good as Tebow.

But Newton is black so he could be McNabb or Vick with his speed.

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And I addressed the part about scouts.

 

They had hundreds to thousands of hours of tape on Tebow, they can see everything hes done, and worse they could see how he did not really progress change his mechanics.

 

Newton they have limited information on, so they believe that he can fix things and get better.

 

{repost}

 

Newton also has the advantage that he only played 1 year, so not as much time to see everything he did wrong. They had so much tape on Tebow that they basically knew every throw he could and could not make. Because Newton has only really played a season, its natural to expect hell progress and that hell be even better. Tebow was considered more a finished product.

 

Not that any of those statements are true, its juist a strange phenomenon that sometimes scouts not having as much information can be a good thing for the player.

 

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QUOTE (RockRaines @ Apr 28, 2011 -> 03:01 PM)
I was mainly speaking on how much the scouts, fans etc crapped on him prior to the draft, yet Cam Newton who wasnt as successful and never had a year as good at Tebow did and has the same mechanical issues is a consensus #1 pick.

 

This just simply isn't true. Newton had a higher QB rating this year than Tebow did in any of his three years as a starter (their passing numbers were very similar, but Newton did it with less weapons around him and from the games I watched without near as many shovel passes or one yard completions that his receivers then broke for TDs), and was a much more effective runner than Tebow was in any of Tebow's three years as a starter.

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QUOTE (whitesoxfan99 @ Apr 28, 2011 -> 03:49 PM)
This just simply isn't true. Newton had a higher QB rating this year than Tebow did in any of his three years as a starter (their passing numbers were very similar, but Newton did it with less weapons around him and from the games I watched without near as many shovel passes or one yard completions that his receivers then broke for TDs), and was a much more effective runner than Tebow was in any of Tebow's three years as a starter.

They had a very similar YPA, so they both were throwing short passes as well as long ones. They are very similar players and Tebow had a much more successful college career. I'll give you that his rating was better, but I dont think theres a ton separating the players including their bad mechanics. Yet when the draft rolls around Tebow wasnt even considered as the #1 pick and was pretty much not even thought of as a first round pick and people were shocked when Denver took him. Newton played one year, has extreme character issues and is universally considered the easy #1 overall pick.

 

It just makes no sense to me. And I was one of the guys who hated on Tebow, and I see the exact same player in Newton.

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I'm also surprised Newton is being considered for #1. But I'm also surprised Gabbert is so high. He's got the tools no doubt, but his pocket presence is going to be f***ed up.

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