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QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Feb 17, 2015 -> 10:39 AM)
Yeah that's true too - don't think of the negotiation as having to do with the payments. Get the best price, then talk financing. If the financing terms seem bad, then maybe go to your next best offer and see if they can do better on rate. But the payment amount is not the cost, exactly.

 

 

 

They aren't an investment - they are a cost center. As soon as you come to that realization (don't mean you Rock, meaning anyone), it all becomes more clear.

100% agree. Dont stretch payments/cost of a car because you "think" you can handle it. The things is depreciating as you sit there, get what you can afford for the best price and enjoy.

 

Its actually good timing as I am about to trade in my wife's leased CRV early for another vehicle so I can report on the interactions as this happens. Ending a lease early is a daunting task in itself but I f***ing hate driving that car and I want to get rid of it.

Edited by RockRaines

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QUOTE (RockRaines @ Feb 17, 2015 -> 12:01 PM)
100% agree. Dont stretch payments/cost of a car because you "think" you can handle it. The things is depreciating as you sit there, get what you can afford for the best price and enjoy.

 

Its actually good timing as I am about to trade in my wife's leased CRV early for another vehicle so I can report on the interactions as this happens. Ending a lease early is a daunting task in itself but I f***ing hate driving that car and I want to get rid of it.

 

I can't wait to get rid of my wife's CRV either.

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QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 17, 2015 -> 12:29 PM)
I can't wait to get rid of my wife's CRV either.

My wife wanted one so bad and we got it loaded up and the price was way too high for what we got and I hate driving it. The thing barely starts, sucks in the snow and is slow as hell. Why do people want this car so badly>?

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QUOTE (RockRaines @ Feb 17, 2015 -> 12:33 PM)
My wife wanted one so bad and we got it loaded up and the price was way too high for what we got and I hate driving it. The thing barely starts, sucks in the snow and is slow as hell. Why do people want this car so badly>?

 

Agreed. I HATE its winter starting. Even with a brand new battery last year, it never feels like it is going to start when we get under say 10 degrees. It slides a lot in snow, even with the all wheel drive. Part of their point was how good gas mileage was, and even that isn't great. My 6 cylinder 2004 Impala still blows it away in gas mileage even though the CRV is only a 4 banger.

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QUOTE (RockRaines @ Feb 17, 2015 -> 12:33 PM)
My wife wanted one so bad and we got it loaded up and the price was way too high for what we got and I hate driving it. The thing barely starts, sucks in the snow and is slow as hell. Why do people want this car so badly>?

What year is it? We have a 2012 Honda Pilot (the bigger one than the CRV), and it's been pretty fantastic. Well other than guzzling gas, but I knew that going in.

 

I suppose the engine is different on the Pilot too, maybe that makes the difference.

 

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QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Feb 17, 2015 -> 01:59 PM)
What year is it? We have a 2012 Honda Pilot (the bigger one than the CRV), and it's been pretty fantastic. Well other than guzzling gas, but I knew that going in.

 

I suppose the engine is different on the Pilot too, maybe that makes the difference.

2013 I think, maybe 2012. The engine is just sub par to me, like they threw in a civic engine.

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QUOTE (RockRaines @ Feb 17, 2015 -> 02:24 PM)
2013 I think, maybe 2012. The engine is just sub par to me, like they threw in a civic engine.

It might literally be a civic engine, maybe Accord. I'm pretty sure the engine in our Pilot is the same as used on the Acura MDX (their version of the bigger SUV) and the lower-size engine on their Ridgeline pickup, so it's got plenty of power. I wouldn't call it fast, but it's fast enough.

 

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Anyone else heading to the auto show or have already gone? The wife and I are going Saturday to check some stuff out. Two on the list are the Dodge Durango (3rd row family car. Love the re-design in 2014) and the Mazda 6 (commuter car but sporty, also a nice redesign in 2014).

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QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 17, 2015 -> 12:37 PM)
Agreed. I HATE its winter starting. Even with a brand new battery last year, it never feels like it is going to start when we get under say 10 degrees. It slides a lot in snow, even with the all wheel drive. Part of their point was how good gas mileage was, and even that isn't great. My 6 cylinder 2004 Impala still blows it away in gas mileage even though the CRV is only a 4 banger.

I know the tires are most likely part of the issue but the AWD sucks, and that starter, I dont feel comfortable letting my wife out in the cold in her car with that thing. I make her drive my JGC.

 

I'm look pretty heavily at the Cherokee, Escape, Volvo, and maybe the hyundai.

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QUOTE (RockRaines @ Feb 17, 2015 -> 02:24 PM)
2013 I think, maybe 2012. The engine is just sub par to me, like they threw in a civic engine.

 

I know the drive train is for the Accord, so maybe they threw in the Accord 4 cylinder engine too.

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QUOTE (RockRaines @ Feb 17, 2015 -> 02:26 PM)
I know the tires are most likely part of the issue but the AWD sucks, and that starter, I dont feel comfortable letting my wife out in the cold in her car with that thing. I make her drive my JGC.

 

I'm look pretty heavily at the Cherokee, Escape, Volvo, and maybe the hyundai.

 

Our tires only have like 15k miles on them. I bought new ones after the sliding problems too thinking that was the issue. Seriously, I would rather use my Impala in the snow.

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QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 17, 2015 -> 02:32 PM)
I know the drive train is for the Accord, so maybe they threw in the Accord 4 cylinder engine too.

We looked at the new one because it was a redesign and it was quieter etc, but at the end of the day the most important part (drivetrain) just doesnt add up.

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QUOTE (RockRaines @ Feb 17, 2015 -> 02:33 PM)
We looked at the new one because it was a redesign and it was quieter etc, but at the end of the day the most important part (drivetrain) just doesnt add up.

 

If I had it to do all over again, I would either buy something with a 3rd row, or another car.

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QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Feb 17, 2015 -> 02:26 PM)
Anyone else heading to the auto show or have already gone? The wife and I are going Saturday to check some stuff out. Two on the list are the Dodge Durango (3rd row family car. Love the re-design in 2014) and the Mazda 6 (commuter car but sporty, also a nice redesign in 2014).

Speaking of the Pilot, the new version of that car (due in stores in summer I think) is premiering there right now. If you are looking at the Durango, you should really look at the Pilot too, along with the rebuilt Highlander.

 

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QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Feb 17, 2015 -> 02:43 PM)
Speaking of the Pilot, the new version of that car (due in stores in summer I think) is premiering there right now. If you are looking at the Durango, you should really look at the Pilot too, along with the rebuilt Highlander.

 

Yeah the Pilot's on the list too, although it's not rated very highly from Edmunds, US News, Car and Driver, etc.

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QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Feb 17, 2015 -> 02:57 PM)
Yeah the Pilot's on the list too, although it's not rated very highly from Edmunds, US News, Car and Driver, etc.

My sister and SIL both have pilots and love them, even different years. Seems like every single family around here has one and they all have the same color. They must be doing something right.

 

After that I see the Volvo XC90/60's, Jeep GC, Range Rover sport and tahoe/yukons the most.

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QUOTE (Whitewashed in '05 @ Feb 16, 2015 -> 11:58 PM)
Looking to purchase my first brand new car. I wasn't going brand new initially, but after some research, a used model is only ~5k less. Been reading lots of reviews, articles on new car shopping/negotiating, noting down things such as invoice prices, average price paid, etc.

 

Anyone want to share any effective tips used when negotiating that really worked well for you?

 

I am in the car industry. What are some of your specific questions?

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QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Feb 17, 2015 -> 02:57 PM)
Yeah the Pilot's on the list too, although it's not rated very highly from Edmunds, US News, Car and Driver, etc.

The current model has fallen behind it's main competitors, especially the Highlander and Explorer. When the current version hit in 2009, then a slight re-do in 2012 in particular, it was more highly rated. Now it's behind the curve.

 

I wouldn't recommend the current one against the likes of the Highlander or Explorer perhaps, but the 2016 model (out this year) seems to have leapt past the others in many areas where it had been behind. That's the game.

 

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QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Feb 17, 2015 -> 02:57 PM)
Yeah the Pilot's on the list too, although it's not rated very highly from Edmunds, US News, Car and Driver, etc.

By the way, when I think back to the list I had from late 2011, here were all the models I looked at (I left out models from BMW, Lexus, etc. that were far more expensive)...

 

Honda Pilot

Toyota Highlander (previous version, it's been updated since)

Ford Explorer (was a new version that year)

Mazda CX-9

Jeep Grand Cherokee

Subaru Tribeca (which is no longer available, as they go to an all new car in that segment)

Chevy (I forget which model)

Ford Edge

 

The Cherokee had the same problem I saw in almost all AMC products - awful sight lines and poor driving feel - so that went out the door. The Subaru was too expensive for less features and less space. The Chevy just felt chintzy and lacked some features we wanted. The Ford Edge was actually more expensive than the similar Explorer with less space, dropped that.

 

Test drove the top 3. Pilot was best but Explorer was close, except Explorer was too long for our garage to work well. So we went Pilot.

 

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My Grand Prix with 100k miles needed to get tires, rack, pinions, and tire rod ends replaced in addition to looming changes recommended due to its mileage. Minus the recommended services, I was still looking at $2000 in repairs for a car that wasn't worth much more than $3000-$4000. Thus, I launched a new (used) car hunt.

 

After looking for a nearly-new mid-size sedan at or below $15k and 25,000 or fewer miles, I finally settled on a 2014 Chevy Malibu 2LT. For one, this model year is the first that I've ever looked at these cars and thought "wow, I like how the Malibu looks." When I got my Grand Prix, I thought the GP looked kind of cool and sporty while the Malibus back then were very plain. The 2014-2015 Malibus now look really good to me. So, check off the first box that I look at it and really like how it looks. Also passing this test was the Nissan Altima and Mazda 6. Subaru Legacy, Ford Fusion, and Chrysler 200 wouldn't have been ruled out by this criteria either.

 

The 2LT Malibu has the MyLink in-dash touchscreen radio which was fairly meaningful for me. It's not amazing software by any means, but it automatically connects with my phone, lets me stream via Bluetooth from any music app while still showing artist info, and I can control things with the steering wheel when I need to. Lack of (free) navigation is a minus. Hands-free calling is more useful than I thought it would be. Overall, the in-the-drivers-seat experience is very nice in this car. I don't do long drives that often, but I do spend 30-60 minutes commuting during the week and I want a good experience when I'm out longer. Listening to music and podcasts is my primary activity in the car so between that, the controls, and the seat comfort/adjustability, I was happy in this regard.

 

Other aspects matched my prefs well. I don't need a big engine and I'd prefer fuel efficiency. This 'bu has a 4-cylinder engine with 196 HP, not much different in HP than the V6 in my old Grand Prix. 36 highway/24 city are the EPA ratings, which isn't mind-blowing in today's market but I'm happy with that. Has a nice feature where the engine shuts off when you're stopped at a stop light and things like that - the transition is seamless enough that I don't think I would have recognized that it's what is happening if I didn't know about it. The 2LT has 18" wheels which look a lot better than the 16s in lower models. Fog lights are a nice bonus. This model has been criticized for its small backseat, but I rarely if ever have rear passengers so this doesn't really apply to me. The trunk is huge, which is a tradeoff I'm happy to make. OnStar's complimentary remote start (via cell phone app) is a great extra for me as well, since I often walk 10-15 minutes to my car in the cold. Now I can make sure it's warm when I get there.

 

I also got a hell of a deal to get the 2LT at the price I got it. $15k, 20k miles. That's below the average wholesale for an equivalent 2014 2LT right now. I let the dealer finance it since that was clearly the only way they'd make money on the deal. So far, the main disappointment since getting it a few days ago is that the mileage is falling way short. In a long trip on the interstate, I got 29mpg, far short of the EPA estimate. Might be wind-related and/or temperature-related, since I had a slight side wind the day I drove it on the highway and it was sub-10 degrees.

 

 

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I drive a different car every week and the difference between the Malibu and Impala is night and day. The impala just feels so much more solid. The redesign for both of them was really well done though.

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