flavum Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Of the ballots not accounted for yet, Frank would need to be on about 69% of them. Jack Morris would need to be on about 81% of them. I'm still sticking with Biggio falling just short. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 (edited) We have found the asshole. Ken Gurnick, Dodgers beat reporter on MLB.com, did not vote for Greg Maddux. In fact, he refuses to vote for any player who happened to play in the PED era. He voted for one player, Jack Morris. Gurnick should not be allowed to ever attend another baseball game in his life. Edited January 7, 2014 by LittleHurt05 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donny Lucy's Avocado Farm Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 11:24 AM) We have found the asshole. Ken Gurnick, Dodgers beat reporter on MLB.com, did not vote for Greg Maddux. In fact, he refuses to vote for any player who happened to play in the PED era. He voted for one player, Jack Morris. Gurnick should not be allowed to ever attend another baseball game in his life. Is this the same Dodgers beat writer that gave Chris Sale his first place Cy Young vote? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:24 AM) We have found the asshole. Ken Gurnick, Dodgers beat reporter on MLB.com, did not vote for Greg Maddux. In fact, he refuses to vote for any player who happened to play in the PED era. He voted for one player, Jack Morris. Gurnick should not be allowed to ever attend another baseball game in his life. While it's stupid, at least it's consistent if that's his process. To me, Maddux, Glavine, and Thomas (and maybe Biggio) are getting in tomorrow. And that should be looked as a positive thing rather than focusing on a handful of crackpot voters and steroids users. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox_Sonix Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Here's how MLB.com writers voted There are some gem of a ballots in there, including: Bagwell, Biggio, Bonds, Clemens, Glavine, Maddux, Morris, Mussina, Palmeiro, Piazza Bagwell, Biggio, Bonds, Clemens, Glavine, Maddux, Morris, Piazza, Trammell, Larry Walker Glavine, Maddux, Morris Glavine, Maddux, McGriff, Smith, Thomas Bagwell, Biggio, Glavine, Maddux, Morris, Smith, Trammell Morris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 (edited) QUOTE (flavum @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:31 AM) While it's stupid, at least it's consistent if that's his process. To me, Maddux, Glavine, and Thomas (and maybe Biggio) are getting in tomorrow. And that should be looked as a positive thing rather than focusing on a handful of crackpot voters and steroids users. What's stupid is that two of the best seasons Morris had came in his late 30s in 1991 & 1992, when the PED had already begun. So he's not consistent at all. Edited January 7, 2014 by LittleHurt05 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baron Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:38 AM) What's stupid is that two of the best seasons Morris had came in his late 30s in 1991 & 1992, when the PED had already begun. So he's not consistent at all. Yeah I was going to say...the argument is neither consistent or intelligent. Its just plain stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 Updated: Jan.7 - 10:30 ~ 149 Full Ballots ~ (26.1% of vote ~ based on last year) 100% - Maddux 96.6 - Glavine 92.6 - F. Thomas 80.0 - Biggio ——————————— 71.1 - Piazza 62.4 - Bagwell 59.1 - Jack (The Jack) Morris 57.7 - Raines 43.0 - Bonds 42.3 - Clemens 38.9 - Schilling 30.2 - Mussina 25.5 - E. Martinez 23.5 - Trammell 23.5 - L. Smith 14.8 - Kent 13.4 - McGriff 10.1 - L. Walker 10.1 - McGwire 8.1 - S. Sosa 6.0 - R. Palmeiro 5.4 - Mattingly ——————————— 0.7 - P. Rose (Write-In) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:24 AM) We have found the asshole. Ken Gurnick, Dodgers beat reporter on MLB.com, did not vote for Greg Maddux. In fact, he refuses to vote for any player who happened to play in the PED era. He voted for one player, Jack Morris. Gurnick should not be allowed to ever attend another baseball game in his life. Well, its been said that there's an asshole in every crowd and it looks like this guy is proud to be the one. Maybe he didn't like the " chicks dig the long ball" commercials. Glad his vote really won't make a difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 (edited) QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:38 AM) What's stupid is that two of the best seasons Morris had came in his late 30s in 1991 & 1992, when the PED had already begun. So he's not consistent at all. To me, the steroid era ballooned after 1993. Basically 1994-2002/2003. Obviously there was use before that and after that, but it got out of hand in the second half of the 90's. I'm not going to get into a big thing with Morris. He's more of a borderline case than people want to give him credit for, and that's fine. Close but no cigar it looks like. But if this guy always voted for Morris and not Trammell or Raines in the past. then at least he's consistent with his process--which is a dumb process. I have a bigger problem with leaving blank spaces and leaving off Bagwell if you voted for Piazza, or leaving off Mussina if you voted for Glavine. Edited January 7, 2014 by flavum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 If you don't want to vote for anyone, that's great -- in some ways, it's better than speculating on who did what. But don't vote for anybody then! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (flavum @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:45 AM) To me, the steroid era ballooned after 1993. Basically 1994-2002/2003. Obviously there was use before that and after that, but it got out of hand in the second half of the 90's. I'm not going to get into a big thing with Morris. He's more of a borderline case than people want to give him credit for, and that's fine. Close but no cigar it looks like. For me it really seemed to happen with the 1987 rookie race. What happened that year blew away everything that had happened before it in all MLB history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 (edited) QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:47 AM) For me it really seemed to happen with the 1987 rookie race. What happened that year blew away everything that had happened before it in all MLB history. I can agree with that. Wally Joyner admitted to some stuff later on in his career. But I think it really went crazy in the second half of the 90's. edit: Wally Joyner was before 87. The 86 race was Joyner and Canseco, so maybe that was the year you meant. Edited January 7, 2014 by flavum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 (edited) Jason Parks@ProfessorParks I'd have more respect for a writer that smeared his own s*** all over the submitted ballot than a writer that ONLY voted for Jack Morris. Edited January 7, 2014 by LittleHurt05 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:47 AM) For me it really seemed to happen with the 1987 rookie race. What happened that year blew away everything that had happened before it in all MLB history. There was obviously something going on with McGwire & Canseco, the Bash Brothers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cabiness42 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 We have found the asshole. Ken Gurnick, Dodgers beat reporter on MLB.com, did not vote for Greg Maddux. In fact, he refuses to vote for any player who happened to play in the PED era. He voted for one player, Jack Morris. Gurnick should not be allowed to ever attend another baseball game in his life. This is Jack Morris' last year on the ballot. If Gurnick defines the PED era as ending at the end of the 2004 season, with testing having started in 2005, then a player would have to have started his MLB career no earlier than 2005. Since you have to play at least ten seasons and be retired for at least five, the earliest possible year that Gurnick will again be voting for anybody is 2020. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Jake @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:47 AM) If you don't want to vote for anyone, that's great -- in some ways, it's better than speculating on who did what. But don't vote for anybody then! The best thing people can do is not click anything from the writer. Giving them publicity is exactly what they want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 When you have 550-600 people making a decision like this, there are always going to be a handful of nut jobs. Focus on the positive of who gets in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:47 AM) For me it really seemed to happen with the 1987 rookie race. What happened that year blew away everything that had happened before it in all MLB history. Check this article out: http://www.sfgate.com/sports/kroichick/art...ids-2637503.php Tom House says he was doing it in the 70's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Real @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 03:23 AM) Piazza used andro, which has always been a PED, but not always a banned substance. So yeah he did use PEDs link? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cabiness42 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 http://www.baseballthinkfactory.org/newsst...ollecting_gizmo Up to 149 ballots 100% - Maddux 96.6 - Glavine 92.6 - F. Thomas 80.0 - Biggio ——————————— 71.1 - Piazza 62.4 - Bagwell 59.1 - Jack (The Jack) Morris 57.7 - Raines 43.0 - Bonds 42.3 - Clemens 38.9 - Schilling 30.2 - Mussina 25.5 - E. Martinez 23.5 - Trammell 23.5 - L. Smith 14.8 - Kent 13.4 - McGriff 10.1 - L. Walker 10.1 - McGwire 8.1 - S. Sosa 6.0 - R. Palmeiro 5.4 - Mattingly ——————————— 0.7 - P. Rose (Write-In) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (flavum @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 11:03 AM) When you have 550-600 people making a decision like this, there are always going to be a handful of nut jobs. Focus on the positive of who gets in. Especially when that group of people makes more money for drawing attention to themselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 10:47 AM) For me it really seemed to happen with the 1987 rookie race. What happened that year blew away everything that had happened before it in all MLB history. While Canseco and few were using then, it really wasn't until the early to mid-90's that it became wide spread. In the mid-80's most players were just beginning to lift weights. That is why the actucal time is blurred. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 11:05 AM) Check this article out: http://www.sfgate.com/sports/kroichick/art...ids-2637503.php Tom House says he was doing it in the 70's The reason is wasn't as effective was that they didn't lift weights back then. He though it would increase endurance and probably did a little. However, without the added workouts the PEDs wouldn't have the same effect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 QUOTE (ptatc @ Jan 7, 2014 -> 12:22 PM) While Canseco and few were using then, it really wasn't until the early to mid-90's that it became wide spread. In the mid-80's most players were just beginning to lift weights. That is why the actucal time is blurred. Yeah, I get that, but for me that stands out as the time that the numbers on the offensive side really changed. The rookie HR record was just destroyed at that point. 40HRs became the new 25. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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