southsider2k5 Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 09:38 AM) You mean in that Ervin Santana has taken over every thread instead of just one You mean HEWHOSHALLNOTBENAMED? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Jimmy0 Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 QUOTE (Dunt @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 10:09 AM) Avisail should be batting 3 or 5 for the rest of his career. Putting him in the 2 hole is stupid. He would get more at bats in the 2 hole though. I generally agree that he should be in a run producing "spot" but the "best player in the 2 hole argument" is interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 11:19 AM) You mean HEWHOSHALLNOTBENAMED? Lol I actually like the idea of that being his nickname around here forever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 QUOTE (Dunt @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 11:09 AM) Avisail should be batting 3 or 5 for the rest of his career. Putting him in the 2 hole is stupid. Why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 10:30 AM) Lol I actually like the idea of that being his nickname around here forever. Better yet, HEWHOSHALLNOTBESIGNED Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 11:36 AM) Better yet, HEWHOSHALLNOTBESIGNED Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 10:36 AM) Better yet, HEWHOSHALLNOTBESIGNED Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunt Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 (edited) QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 10:31 AM) Why? B/c the 2 hole is for the best situational hitter and he doesnt strike me as the best situational hitter. Edited February 27, 2014 by Dunt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 QUOTE (Dunt @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 01:14 PM) B/c the 2 hole is for the best situational hitter and he doesnt strike me as the best situational hitter. I challenge your assertion that the 2 hole is for the best situational hitter. I know that's the traditional mindset, but there's a ton of research showing that the 2 hitter should be among your best run producers, based on the types of RISP situations that are most common across all nine spots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunt Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 12:16 PM) I challenge your assertion that the 2 hole is for the best situational hitter. I know that's the traditional mindset, but there's a ton of research showing that the 2 hitter should be among your best run producers, based on the types of RISP situations that are most common across all nine spots. Links? I would actually be interested in reading up on that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 According to this... "I think there's really an opportunity for him if we want to bat him second, he has that kind of approach at the plate, he does have some speed that we can utilize there," Ventura said. "When you look at it, you like what you see when you see him in there. It might happen." It sounds more like something they are willing to try this based on rationale, yet not set in stone. I'd rather see Avi in the three hole but if they experiment with him in the two hole and he does well I certainly won't complain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 QUOTE (Dunt @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 01:54 PM) Links? I would actually be interested in reading up on that I'm sure Em has more proof in the pudding, but here's a look at the Sox from early 2012. They then acquired Youkilis in June, batted him 2nd, and the offense improved greatly. http://www.highheatstats.com/2012/05/what-...-hitter-really/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCCWS Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 10:03 AM) Not necessarily. Many people believe that a team's best hitter should hit 2nd in a lineup. It's not surprising to me that a team with Rick Hahn as its GM would adopt this line of thinking though. Then again, the Red Sox decided the best hitter should bat third. So they moved Pedroia from 2nd to 3rd, which raised a lot of eyebrows. They won a World Series doing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 QUOTE (SCCWS @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 03:46 PM) Then again, the Red Sox decided the best hitter should bat third. So they moved Pedroia from 2nd to 3rd, which raised a lot of eyebrows. They won a World Series doing it. The Red Sox best hitter hit 4th, which is where your best hitter should hit. And let's not undercut the contributions of Shane Victorino (.294/.351/.451/.801, 21 out of 24 in SBs) hitting 2nd and Jacoby Ellsbury (.298/.355/.426/.781, 52 out of 56 in SBs) hitting in front of Pedroia. Boston had a really good offense. This is like saying "The White Sox used Chris Widger as a backup catcher instead of Ben Davis. You know what happened when they did that? They won a World Series." The causation effect of what you are suggesting is incredibly small and limited. Yes, it most definitely had an effect, but there were about 500 other things that affected it too, a lot of them just as important (or more) as Pedroia hitting 3rd instead of 2nd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 QUOTE (Reddy @ Feb 26, 2014 -> 11:22 PM) I normally wouldn't start a thread for this but I can't find the thread in which I said Avi would be our #2 hitter and I was shouted down by the masses. Just posting to gloat really. Avisail to get look as No. 2 hitter Cool story, bro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 QUOTE (Dunt @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 02:54 PM) Links? I would actually be interested in reading up on that http://www.amazon.com/The-Book-Playing-Per...l/dp/1597971294 This is where the original research was done -- I haven't been able to find anywhere online that reposts it in its entirety. However, here's an oft-cited summary of the findings: http://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/2009/3/17...-your-lineup-by Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 I don't mind him batting second. We don't really have a 2 hole hitter. It might help him see better pitches, and wait for better pitches, which is what he needs to do if he gets some protection. We don't need him trying to slug. Just wait for pitches and make good contact - homers will come. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammy esposito Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 QUOTE (GreenSox @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 04:43 PM) I don't mind him batting second. We don't really have a 2 hole hitter. It might help him see better pitches, and wait for better pitches, which is what he needs to do if he gets some protection. We don't need him trying to slug. Just wait for pitches and make good contact - homers will come. Ventura often batted in the #2 SPOT especially in light of one comment the #2 hitter should be the best situational; hitter in the lineup. He's paying Avi quite a compliment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyDo Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 I'm cool with him batting in the 2-hole as long as Ventura/Hahn are not asking him to do ANYTHING aside from his usual approach. No bunting guys over, no sacrificing ABs. Just hit. If he does that, I think the 2-hole is just fine for him. He should (theoretically) have plenty of opportunities to knock Eaton in and flash plenty of power. The contrived 2-hole hitter thing seems like it's more likely to hamper production than help it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted February 28, 2014 Author Share Posted February 28, 2014 The guy has limited power. He's a gap power, 20 homer guy. I'd much rather we have a line drive hitter who makes consistent contact and sprays doubles all over the field in the 2 hole, and leave Abreu for 3rd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 QUOTE (sammy esposito @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 05:10 PM) Ventura often batted in the #2 SPOT especially in light of one comment the #2 hitter should be the best situational; hitter in the lineup. He's paying Avi quite a compliment. That's what we really don't need - bunting, making outs to the right stuff, and junk like that. Garcia just needs to find the strike zone and hit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heads22 Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 QUOTE (Reddy @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 07:56 PM) The guy has limited power. He's a gap power, 20 homer guy. I'd much rather we have a line drive hitter who makes consistent contact and sprays doubles all over the field in the 2 hole, and leave Abreu for 3rd. He's also 22 and possibly not done improving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted February 28, 2014 Author Share Posted February 28, 2014 QUOTE (Heads22 @ Feb 27, 2014 -> 10:36 PM) He's also 22 and possibly not done improving. Remember when Beckham wasn't done improving? I'm just saying that as of right this moment, his bat better serves us in the 2 hole IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigsoxhurt35 Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 He's batting third today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 Biggest thread fail EVER? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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