Sox Draft Carlos Rodon> Draft Day Discussion Thread

[BlackSox13]

Aaron Fitt of BA saw his start in the SEC Tournament against Arkansas and said he was at 95-96 in a first inning or so, then sat 92-94 until the 8th. That would do just fine.

I read that too, was a good read. I didn't really like the idea of Nola til I read that article yesterday. I'm much more at ease with the idea of drafting Nola. I still prefer Aiken, but Kolek or Nola would make fine selections as well if Aiken is gone.

 

The "safe" pick at 1-3 is different than the "safe" pick at 1-15, which is where Broadway went.

I agree. Its just that the scouting reports remind me of what was said about Broadway when he was drafted. This doesn't mean Nola will have the same fate as Broadway by any means.

[southsider2k5]

With Kolek's late "slide," might he be abetter financial deal than we thought at #3?

 

Also an interesting though. I'd be much happier with Kolek pick if it saved, say a million dollars.

[DirtySox]

Also an interesting though. I'd be much happier with Kolek pick if it saved, say a million dollars.

 

Agreed.

Edited June 5, 2014 by DirtySox

[ptatc]

According to Perfect Game, that's exactly what he is.

http://www.perfectgame.org/Articles/View.aspx?article=9818

 

Edit: we should expect Nola to touch 95 as much as we should expect Kolek to touch 102.

 

Nola is a low-90s guy with great command of the fastball and change.

 

Kolek draws comps to Nolan Ryan and Kerry Wood.

 

If you're a-scared, buy a dog. Then you take Kolek.

I though I read he sits more in the 92-94 range. I agree Kolek has the higher upside but I don't know if I risk it here. The Sox have taken too many "higher upside" players lately and the system has suffered.

[DirtySox]

Both Callis and Mayo have the Sox taking Kolek in their latest mock, noting that Nola is still possible as well.

 

3. Chicago White Sox: Tyler Kolek, RHP, Shepherd HS (Texas)

It's apparent the White Sox will take the best arm. In this scenario, it's Kolek. They could play it safer and go with LSU's Aaron Nola.

Callis' pick: Kolek

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article/mlb/jonath...p;vkey=news_mlb

Edited June 5, 2014 by DirtySox

[royoung]

This is what I don't understand. Stone is just as anti-saber as Hawk. He mentions wins when judging pitchers seasons. Yet it is totally ignored. I do agree he knows a bit about pitching, and when they had the TJ segment the other day, his part where he showed how the younger HS guys throw breaking balls incorrectly causing eventual problems was top notch. But Stone is just as anti-HS pitcher as Hawk.

 

I'm not implying Stone is a pitching savant, just that his opinion on the top pitchers would be more astute than say, Hawk's. But people still try to find clues in Hawk's ramblings about HS pitchers, when I don't think him or Steve Stone are clued much about the front office's preferences. Generally speaking, it wouldn't be a very wise decision to let two people who have to fill three hours of air space nightly know your intimate draft scouting reports and preferences.

Edited June 5, 2014 by southside hitman

[ptatc]

It's probably because Stone isn't a loudmouth idiot.

 

Anyway, it still blows my mind with how infatuated people are with velocity. Movement and control have always, and will always, be more important than velocity.

Yes, but if you take a guy who throws 100 with good control and teach him great command at 95 you have the best of both worlds and an All_star pitcher.

[witesoxfan]

I would have my top 3 as Aiken-Rodon-Kolek, but my belief is that the Sox see it as Aiken-Rodon-Nola. I have absolutely no problem with that.

[Buehrle>Wood]

Also an interesting though. I'd be much happier with Kolek pick if it saved, say a million dollars.

I think we have a better chance saving a lot more on Nola than Kolek. Obviously that's all speculation but Nola is older (college), has a quick window(more reason to sign ASAP) and so far has a lot less hype.

[Brian]

I really want Rodon for some reason. Him on the rotation next year with Sale makes me salivate.

[royoung]

Also an interesting though. I'd be much happier with Kolek pick if it saved, say a million dollars.

 

Perhaps that is why he is "sliding?" Sox could leak info saying they prefer Nola and hope that Kolek's camp panics.

[The Ultimate Champion]

It's probably because Stone isn't a loudmouth idiot.

 

Anyway, it still blows my mind with how infatuated people are with velocity. Movement and control have always, and will always, be more important than velocity.

No that is not the case. Movement and control ADDED to velocity is always more important.

 

In the Major Leagues you have to pitch off your fastball and then after that usually is the change. That's why Nola is the safer pick. But if you develop the guy that can work in the mid to high 90's with a plus slider or curveball then instead of the opposing offense having to force their opportunities by putting the bat on the ball they're in the dugout praying for rain.

[BigHurt3515]

We either pick Rodon or Nola.

[royoung]

I though I read he sits more in the 92-94 range. I agree Kolek has the higher upside but I don't know if I risk it here. The Sox have taken too many "higher upside" players lately and the system has suffered.

 

http://www.baseballamerica.com/college/sec...salute-to-nola/

 

Yes, he maintained 92-94 into the 8th inning according to Baseball America's Aaron Fitt. Also touched 96 early, but was probably just the adrenaline.

[southsider2k5]

I think we have a better chance saving a lot more on Nola than Kolek. Obviously that's all speculation but Nola is older (college), has a quick window(more reason to sign ASAP) and so far has a lot less hype.

 

If the stories about Kolek not possibly being picked until #8 or even #11 are true, an underslot signing with the Sox is still WAY higher than slot or 10% above, at #8 or #11.

[royoung]

No that is not the case. Movement and control ADDED to velocity is always more important.

 

In the Major Leagues you have to pitch off your fastball and then after that usually is the change. That's why Nola is the safer pick. But if you develop the guy that can work in the mid to high 90's with a plus slider or curveball then instead of the opposing offense having to force their opportunities by putting the bat on the ball they're in the dugout praying for rain.

 

Tyler Danish tops out at 90 MPH and is our top pitching prospect currently.

 

EDIT: He actually sits more in the 85-89 range, but has topped out at 92.

 

Nathaniel Stoltz ‏@stoltz_baseball Apr 30

Kannapolis RHP Tyler Danish 89-91 T92 in the first, 85-89 T91 after, plus sink, SL 77-82 flashes plus w/tilt, okay CH 77-82.

Edited June 5, 2014 by southside hitman

[gatnom]

No that is not the case. Movement and control ADDED to velocity is always more important.

 

In the Major Leagues you have to pitch off your fastball and then after that usually is the change. That's why Nola is the safer pick. But if you develop the guy that can work in the mid to high 90's with a plus slider or curveball then instead of the opposing offense having to force their opportunities by putting the bat on the ball they're in the dugout praying for rain.

 

Or, they never learn the third pitch and command to be able succeed as a major league starter. Not saying I would pick Nola over Kolek, but after the draft nobody cares about "safety" if the guy performs.

 

 

[DirtySox]

Kiley McDaniel ‏@kileymcd 5m

Freeland medical described as "bad" by one scouting dir; could still go to 8/COL for deep discount. Some teams in 20s saying they'll pass.

Expand

[TaylorStSox]

No that is not the case. Movement and control ADDED to velocity is always more important.

 

In the Major Leagues you have to pitch off your fastball and then after that usually is the change. That's why Nola is the safer pick. But if you develop the guy that can work in the mid to high 90's with a plus slider or curveball then instead of the opposing offense having to force their opportunities by putting the bat on the ball they're in the dugout praying for rain.

You dont have to throw 100 to pitch off your fastball. It's like people don't remember guys like Martinez, Maddux and, to a lesser extent, Schilling. They all were capable of throwing hard, but sat in the low to mid 90's with movement and control. You can have Nolan Ryan, I'll take Greg Maddux.

[witesoxfan]

No that is not the case. Movement and control ADDED to velocity is always more important.

 

In the Major Leagues you have to pitch off your fastball and then after that usually is the change. That's why Nola is the safer pick. But if you develop the guy that can work in the mid to high 90's with a plus slider or curveball then instead of the opposing offense having to force their opportunities by putting the bat on the ball they're in the dugout praying for rain.

 

Felix Hernandez has (arguably) been the best pitcher in the majors this year. He's at 90-93 with his fastball.

 

You need velocity with regards to pitching in the same sense that you need arms with regards to pitching - there has to be SOMETHING there for effectiveness - but once it's at sufficient level, movement and command is far more important than pure velocity.

[The Ultimate Champion]

Tyler Danish tops out at 90 MPH and is our top pitching prospect currently.

Currently my favorite Sox pitching prospect. Taken in the second round, IIRC more towards the middle of the second round.

 

Not #3.

 

And a lot of people still don't want to call him more than a back-end starter.

[Buehrle>Wood]

Kiley McDaniel ‏@kileymcd 5m

Freeland medical described as "bad" by one scouting dir; could still go to 8/COL for deep discount. Some teams in 20s saying they'll pass.

Expand

Free fall to our 2nd pick.

 

 

I'm half kidding but reminds me of what Buddy Bell said last week. With the second pick they were targeting a couple pitchers that everyone had pegged as 1st rounders but could very well fall draft day.

[The Ultimate Champion]

Felix Hernandez has (arguably) been the best pitcher in the majors this year. He's at 90-93 with his fastball.

 

You need velocity with regards to pitching in the same sense that you need arms with regards to pitching - there has to be SOMETHING there for effectiveness - but once it's at sufficient level, movement and command is far more important than pure velocity.

Agree. But Felix had a much bigger FB earlier in his career along with multiple terrific secondary offerings and has become more of a pitcher than anything else. All that experience counts too. Neither Kolek nor Nola have anything on King Felix, but Kolek has a shot at being at least close, while Nola has none whatsoever.

 

I'm not saying Nola can't be effective. I'm syaing this is the #3 pick we're talking about here.

 

And let's not sit here and pretend as though Nola is a sure thing. Look at Appel, my how long it has been since he was drafted. This kid might a complete and total bust 1 and a half years from now while at the same time Kolek on another team is a consensus top-3-5 prospect in all of baseball. Nola has every bit as much a chance at busting then anyone else.

 

Hell, look at Erik Johnson. Anyone see that coming? I didn't, I thought he'd be our guy between Q and Danks. Nope.

[The Ultimate Champion]

Free fall to our 2nd pick.

 

 

I'm half kidding but reminds me of what Buddy Bell said last week. With the second pick they were targeting a couple pitchers that everyone had pegged as 1st rounders but could very well fall draft day.

We will draft Kolek at 90% slot and then take Hoffman in the second round with the leftover bonus going to Hoffman as well as 10% of our Round 3 pitcher who will also be awesome.

 

And then we will win. Everything.

[brian310]

Give me Rodon or Nola (if Aiken isn't there).