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Leonard Zelig

The Curious Case of Mark Buehrle

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Buerhle will always be a legend to me.

 

The guy is living history.

 

He has a perfect game and a no-hitter. a 5 time all star, 4 time Gold Glove winner. He's won and saved a World Series game in the same series and he pitches at a fast pace, the fastest in MLB atm by a good 2 seconds a pitch.

 

He has pitched at least 200 innings with at least 10 wins for the last 10 years and he has the best slide I've seen on a rain soaked Tarpaulin.

 

All this and his fast ball is slower than some player's change-ups.

 

He may not get into the Hall of Fame but damn, he's given me some fantastic memories.

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Another part of Buerhle's Sox legacy is his continuing affect on his teammates. I was at a game before the break started by Danks, so when a kid from the Sox RBI program threw out the first pitch, guess who caught it? Chris Sale. You could tell the kid was absolutely thrilled to meet him instead of the 25th man who catches those things for other teams. Do you think Clayton Kershaw or Justin Verlander is catching ceremonial first pitches? It is cuz Sale played with Buerhle, who taught him a ton about how to be a major league pitcher on and off the field.

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QUOTE (Tex @ Jul 18, 2014 -> 03:06 AM)
I know that Mark in the HoF is the longest of long shots but if I was taking someone who knew nothing about baseball into the hall of fame and told them why it's such a great game would you rather show them Clemens or Buehrle? Would you rather tell the story of Mark's career or Bonds? If we started valuing character and contribution to the game as much as gaudy stats, we'd start to get at the heart of why baseball is such a great sport.

 

I'd rather show them Ripken or Gwynn. What you're asking is a bit of a loaded question. Not to diss on Buehrle - I'm not doing that at all - but suggesting that you are supposed to explain the game with either a soft tossing left who stuck around for as long as he did because he was good but rarely great (over long periods of time) versus guys who put up enormous numbers because they cheated is not fair to either side and is going to cause the person to whom you're explaining to probably switch to soccer.

 

Ideally, you'd show them everything, because you're not going to stay at one exhibit for the 5-8 hours you'll be at the Hall of Fame anyways :)

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QUOTE (glangon @ Jul 18, 2014 -> 04:24 AM)
Buerhle will always be a legend to me.

 

The guy is living history.

 

He has a perfect game and a no-hitter. a 5 time all star, 4 time Gold Glove winner. He's won and saved a World Series game in the same series and he pitches at a fast pace, the fastest in MLB atm by a good 2 seconds a pitch.

 

He has pitched at least 200 innings with at least 10 wins for the last 10 years and he has the best slide I've seen on a rain soaked Tarpaulin.

 

All this and his fast ball is slower than some player's change-ups.

 

He may not get into the Hall of Fame but damn, he's given me some fantastic memories.

 

People always think of Buehrle winning a World Series game due to the Konerko granny giving him a 6-4 lead and leaving the game to the best bullpen in Sox history. The problem is that Jenks gave up the lead and Cotts had to come in to bail him out. Buehrle never won a game in the World Series.

 

He did save game 3 though, you are correct on that.

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QUOTE (Timmy U @ Jul 18, 2014 -> 05:59 AM)
Another part of Buerhle's Sox legacy is his continuing affect on his teammates. I was at a game before the break started by Danks, so when a kid from the Sox RBI program threw out the first pitch, guess who caught it? Chris Sale. You could tell the kid was absolutely thrilled to meet him instead of the 25th man who catches those things for other teams. Do you think Clayton Kershaw or Justin Verlander is catching ceremonial first pitches? It is cuz Sale played with Buerhle, who taught him a ton about how to be a major league pitcher on and off the field.

 

I think they probably asked Sale if he would go catch the pitch because he's a stud and he said yes because it takes 5 minutes. It would take a total jerk to not go out and catch the first pitch. I doubt that had anything to do with Buehrle. It's a nice anecdote anyways.

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QUOTE (Swingandalongonetoleft @ Jul 17, 2014 -> 10:15 PM)
His pickoff of Sammy Sosa shortly after he walked to become the only Texas baserunner of the night during his no-hitter is a big reason I might prefer that game to the Perfecto. Replace the Outfielder Weiss catch in the Perfect Game with a standard ground out or K and it wouldn't even be close.

Wise

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QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jul 18, 2014 -> 08:31 AM)
People always think of Buehrle winning a World Series game due to the Konerko granny giving him a 6-4 lead and leaving the game to the best bullpen in Sox history. The problem is that Jenks gave up the lead and Cotts had to come in to bail him out. Buehrle never won a game in the World Series.

 

He did save game 3 though, you are correct on that.

That's right. Damaso Marte has a World Series win, but Mark doesn't. Baseball isn't fair.

 

Buehrle's game against the Angels - the first of the four complete games - was perhaps the best of any pitching performance that postseason. 9 innings, 5 hits, 1 run, 0 walks, 4 K's, and 99 pitches thrown. One stupid Robb Quinlan homer kept him from qualifying for a Maddux. And does anybody doubt that he would have come out to pitch the 10th if we hadn't scored that infamous run to walk off?

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QUOTE (shysocks @ Jul 18, 2014 -> 08:56 AM)
That's right. Damaso Marte has a World Series win, but Mark doesn't. Baseball isn't fair.

 

Buehrle's game against the Angels - the first of the four complete games - was perhaps the best of any pitching performance that postseason. 9 innings, 5 hits, 1 run, 0 walks, 4 K's, and 99 pitches thrown. One stupid Robb Quinlan homer kept him from qualifying for a Maddux. And does anybody doubt that he would have come out to pitch the 10th if we hadn't scored that infamous run to walk off?

 

I remember watching that game, knowing his pitch count, knowing how well he was pitching, and having no doubt in my mind that he was coming out for the 10th. I would have been upset had he been removed from that game.

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QUOTE (shysocks @ Jul 18, 2014 -> 08:56 AM)
That's right. Damaso Marte has a World Series win, but Mark doesn't. Baseball isn't fair.

 

Buehrle's game against the Angels - the first of the four complete games - was perhaps the best of any pitching performance that postseason. 9 innings, 5 hits, 1 run, 0 walks, 4 K's, and 99 pitches thrown. One stupid Robb Quinlan homer kept him from qualifying for a Maddux. And does anybody doubt that he would have come out to pitch the 10th if we hadn't scored that infamous run to walk off?

 

William Perry and Matt Suhey have Super Bowl touchdowns but Walter Payton doesn't. Life isn't fair. :D

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QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jul 18, 2014 -> 09:06 AM)
DeWayne Weiss lol

 

Duane Weis

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Not to be confused with Walt or Al Weiss.

 

Wasn't that Buehrle World Series start the one with the terrible cold and rain that the Astros got out to the early advantage and he battled all night long to keep them in it...?

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QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 18, 2014 -> 09:30 AM)
Not to be confused with Walt or Al Weiss.

 

Wasn't that Buehrle World Series start the one with the terrible cold and rain that the Astros got out to the early advantage and he battled all night long to keep them in it...?

It was definitely a crappy night - I can picture all the ponchos in the shot of Scotty Pods' homer landing - but I don't think Buehrle coughed up a lead until a bit later in the game.

 

Nevermind. B-ref confirms he did give up one apiece in the 2nd and 3rd, then two in the 5th. He didn't have his best stuff but it wasn't too bad an outing.

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QUOTE (Tex @ Jul 18, 2014 -> 03:06 AM)
I know that Mark in the HoF is the longest of long shots but if I was taking someone who knew nothing about baseball into the hall of fame and told them why it's such a great game would you rather show them Clemens or Buehrle? Would you rather tell the story of Mark's career or Bonds? If we started valuing character and contribution to the game as much as gaudy stats, we'd start to get at the heart of why baseball is such a great sport.

 

In the modern age stats have become so much more important to the Hall of Fame, I think Mark has less of a shot than ever, unless he can stick around and win 300 games. He's in my HOF, but the only way he is going to Cooperstown is with a ticket.

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QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 18, 2014 -> 07:44 AM)
In the modern age stats have become so much more important to the Hall of Fame, I think Mark has less of a shot than ever, unless he can stick around and win 300 games. He's in my HOF, but the only way he is going to Cooperstown is with a ticket.

This is why I think you have to look at both. I think he's a borderline HOFer but he needs to get to 275. 300 and he is a shoe in, but if he can somehow stick around and win another 80 or so games to get to 275, I Think that is a pretty strong argument.

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QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jul 18, 2014 -> 09:46 AM)
This is why I think you have to look at both. I think he's a borderline HOFer but he needs to get to 275. 300 and he is a shoe in, but if he can somehow stick around and win another 80 or so games to get to 275, I Think that is a pretty strong argument.

 

Again, I love Mark, but no Cy Youngs, not a lot of ASG appearances, one ring, there just isn't a lot of the counting stats that voters go off of.

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QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 18, 2014 -> 09:55 AM)
Again, I love Mark, but no Cy Youngs, not a lot of ASG appearances, one ring, there just isn't a lot of the counting stats that voters go off of.

 

HOF voters loves playoff success and awesome as 2005 was, other than that he was one inning of relief and one bad start to show for on his playoff resume, that's it.

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QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jul 18, 2014 -> 09:02 AM)
HOF voters loves playoff success and awesome as 2005 was, other than that he was one inning of relief and one bad start to show for on his playoff resume, that's it.

 

 

2008?

 

Did he pitch at all in the 2000 post-season? Can't remember. For some reason, Bradford comes to mind more than Mark.

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QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jul 18, 2014 -> 08:02 AM)
HOF voters loves playoff success and awesome as 2005 was, other than that he was one inning of relief and one bad start to show for on his playoff resume, that's it.

That was in the series, he threw a complete game against the Angels. He has a no-hitter and a perfect game and when you look at his innings pitched, consecutive seasons with 10 or more wins, etc, and all of a sudden he joins some extremely elite company on those lists. We also have to remember in this day and age, it is extremely unlikely, imo, that we'll see really anyone else get to that vaunted 300 win number (is there anyone else with even a shot at it other then Buehrle, currently?), so if he can get even close to it, it will be impressive given the era he pitched in.

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QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jul 18, 2014 -> 10:09 AM)
That was in the series, he threw a complete game against the Angels. He has a no-hitter and a perfect game and when you look at his innings pitched, consecutive seasons with 10 or more wins, etc, and all of a sudden he joins some extremely elite company on those lists. We also have to remember in this day and age, it is extremely unlikely, imo, that we'll see really anyone else get to that vaunted 300 win number (is there anyone else with even a shot at it other then Buehrle, currently?), so if he can get even close to it, it will be impressive given the era he pitched in.

 

He needs 300 wins more than most because his other HOF credentials are so lacking. He doesn't have Cy Young awards. He doesn't have 10 AS appearances. He doesn't have 20 win seasons. He doesn't have tons of strike outs. Those things are all going to pull him down.

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