Batting Average Leaders

[flavum]

Memba when batting average mattered?

 

9 AL batters are hitting over .300, and two of them are Abreu and Eaton.

 

Gillaspie still 10th at .293.

 

Abreu and Eaton are 5th and 10th in OBP.

[cabiness42]

Batting average does still matter, it's just not as important as we thought it was. If you have an AVG above .290, the chances are you also have a pretty decent OBP and/or SLG. Yeah, the hypothetical guy who hits .300 but it's almost all singles and never walks wouldn't be terribly valuable, but that isn't many, if any of the .300 hitters out there.

 

You also can't fill an entire team with TTO guys. Sometimes you have runners on base and need a guy who can just get a hit.

[greg775]

Memba when batting average mattered?

 

9 AL batters are hitting over .300, and two of them are Abreu and Eaton.

 

Gillaspie still 10th at .293.

 

Abreu and Eaton are 5th and 10th in OBP.

 

Batting average doesn't matter yet 100 percent of all announcing teams mention it out loud during broadcasts almost every at bat and SOME barely flash OBP on the screen. LOL.

[BaconOnAStick]

Batting average does matter. Balls in play can turn in XBH and errors. Walks don't score a runner from 2nd with 2 out.

 

Both have their place, but I'll take the guy batting .300 with a .350 OBP over a .250 hitter with a .375 OBP.

[chitownsportsfan]

Holy s*** Conor is 10th with a 292? Man, offense is sooooooooooooooooooooooo down.

[cabiness42]

Batting average does matter. Balls in play can turn in XBH and errors. Walks don't score a runner from 2nd with 2 out.

 

Both have their place, but I'll take the guy batting .300 with a .350 OBP over a .250 hitter with a .375 OBP.

 

Well, I would want to see their SLG before deciding between the two, although I will say that in building a team I'd rather have a few of each than all of one or the other.

 

[witesoxfan]

Batting average doesn't matter yet 100 percent of all announcing teams mention it out loud during broadcasts almost every at bat and SOME barely flash OBP on the screen. LOL.

 

Nobody has said batting average doesn't matter, but it's a very shallow statistic that doesn't tell a hell of a lot. It's like considering the quality of a living room set and coming to a conclusion based on the middle cushion of the couch.

 

This season, solely for the bat and the bat alone, would you have rather had a .260 hitter or a .300 hitter? You're response should not be "the .300 hitter!" but instead should be "What else have they done?" Because then I tell you the .260 hitter is Nelson Cruz, who just leads the majors in home runs, while the .300 hitter is Ben Revere, who doesn't walk and doesn't hit for power. Suddenly batting average has become a hell of a lot less important.

 

 

[Eminor3rd]

Batting average doesn't matter yet 100 percent of all announcing teams mention it out loud during broadcasts almost every at bat and SOME barely flash OBP on the screen. LOL.

 

Yeah, THAT'S a great piece of evidence right there, lol.

[oldsox]

Nobody has said batting average doesn't matter, but it's a very shallow statistic that doesn't tell a hell of a lot. It's like considering the quality of a living room set and coming to a conclusion based on the middle cushion of the couch.

 

This season, solely for the bat and the bat alone, would you have rather had a .260 hitter or a .300 hitter? You're response should not be "the .300 hitter!" but instead should be "What else have they done?" Because then I tell you the .260 hitter is Nelson Cruz, who just leads the majors in home runs, while the .300 hitter is Ben Revere, who doesn't walk and doesn't hit for power. Suddenly batting average has become a hell of a lot less important.

Batting average is both important and easy to understand, but no one is saying that Ben Revere is a better hitter than Nellie Cruz.

[The Mighty Mite]

Holy s*** Conor is 10th with a 292? Man, offense is sooooooooooooooooooooooo down.

 

IIRC There was only one player in the AL to hit .300 in 1968 and that was Yaz at .301. The next year they lowered the mound 6 inches.

Edited September 18, 2014 by The Mighty Mite

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

IIRC There was only one player in the AL to hit .300 in 1968 and that was Yaz at .301. The next year they lowered the mound 6 inches.

 

Yep, Dan Patrick was talking about that today. They said the guy who finished 2nd had a .291 AVG.

[max power]

IIRC There was only one player in the AL to hit .300 in 1968 and that was Yaz at .301. The next year they lowered the mound 6 inches.

Were the NL and AL mound heights different? Because the NL was killin it.

[Jerksticks]

You OBP-only people need to accept the BA folks. Some people just find high BA hitters to be more exciting players to watch, especially in this current era of generally low average hitting.

 

Runs still need to be driven in.

 

 

[The Mighty Mite]

Were the NL and AL mound heights different? Because the NL was killin it.

 

Mound was lowered in both leagues. The NL back in those days was the better league, they won 19 out of 20 All Star games from 1963 to 1982

 

[witesoxfan]

You OBP-only people need to accept the BA folks. Some people just find high BA hitters to be more exciting players to watch, especially in this current era of generally low average hitting.

 

Runs still need to be driven in.

 

I don't think there is such a thing as an OBP-only person. I am a good baseball player person and I appreciate good baseball players. Just as apples come in different shapes, flavors, and colors, so can baseball players.

[witesoxfan]

Batting average is both important and easy to understand, but no one is saying that Ben Revere is a better hitter than Nellie Cruz.

 

But if you went by just batting average, which is what greg seems to be implying, then you'd have to assume Revere is a better hitter.

 

I've never said it was meaningless or unimportant, but there are most definitely more important and better statistics to use than batting average.

[Quin]

Jose Abreu and Adam Eaton are fun.

 

And we got those two and Avi for the price of Jake Peavy, Thornton, and Hector Santiago.

[Dick Allen]

I have always wondered why reaching on an error does not count as a time reaching base in regards to a player's OBP. He didn't make an out. He did reach base. Obviously, there isn't going to be much difference, but it doesn't make much sense.

[Eminor3rd]

I have always wondered why reaching on an error does not count as a time reaching base in regards to a player's OBP. He didn't make an out. He did reach base. Obviously, there isn't going to be much difference, but it doesn't make much sense.

 

It's because the fact that he reached base is credited to the fielder. The batter didn't "earn" the base.

[Dick Allen]

It's because the fact that he reached base is credited to the fielder. The batter didn't "earn" the base.

I understand that, but that is handled for the pitcher with their ERA, and for the batters batting average.If it is 3 and 2 and the pitcher doesn't throw a strike,you go to first and that is earned. If the pitcher makes a good pitch and you hit one to 3rd and the 3rd baseman doesn't throw a strike, and you are safe,that already goes against your batting average, but you are on base and you didn't make an out, so it should go towards your OBP. It isn't enough to make a big difference, but it really doesn 't logically make sense to me.

Edited September 18, 2014 by Dick Allen

[shysocks]

I read a thought in a blog a while ago that I'm going to paraphrase now: If you boil both of them down to just what they are, on-base percentage is far easier to understand than batting average.

 

Try explaining each of them to somebody who has never heard of baseball.

OBP: The number of times the hitter reached base (minus as the result of an error or drop-third-strike) divided by the number of times the hitter came up to bat

AVG: The number of times the hitter reached base (minus as the result of an error, drop-third-strike, walk, or hit-by-pitch) divided by the number of times the hitter came up to bat (minus times that resulted in a walk, hit-by-pitch, sacrifice bunt, or sacrifice fly)

 

The reasons anybody cites batting average more often is because they've done it for 100 years and it's one third of an imaginary piece of headwear known as the Triple Crown. It's actually pretty strange to make a distinction between at-bats and plate appearances, as batting average does.

 

Through the entirety of baseball history, a team's OBP correlates better with its runs scored than AVG. SLG, even better. This is a statistical fact.

Edited September 18, 2014 by shysocks

[ChiSox_Sonix]

I understand that, but that is handled for the pitcher with their ERA, and for the batters batting average.If it is 3 and 2 and the pitcher doesn't throw a strike,you go to first and that is earned. If the pitcher makes a good pitch and you hit one to 3rd and the 3rd baseman doesn't throw a strike, and you are safe,that already goes against your batting average, but you are on base and you didn't make an out, so it should go towards your OBP. It isn't enough to make a big difference, but it really doesn 't logically make sense to me.

 

Same reason you don't credit for being on base when reaching via a fielder's choice. You only reached base because some unusual event occurred that allowed it, when otherwise the play would have resulted in you being out.

[Dick Allen]

I read a thought in a blog a while ago that I'm going to paraphrase now: If you boil both of them down to just what they are, on-base percentage is far easier to understand than batting average.

 

Try explaining each of them to somebody who has never heard of baseball.

OBP: The number of times the hitter reached base (minus as the result of an error or drop-third-strike) divided by the number of times the hitter came up to bat

AVG: The number of times the hitter reached base (minus as the result of an error, drop-third-strike, walk, or hit-by-pitch) divided by the number of times the hitter came up to bat (minus times that resulted in a walk, hit-by-pitch, sacrifice bunt, or sacrifice fly)

 

The reasons anybody cites batting average more often is because they've done it for 100 years and it's one third of an imaginary piece of headwear known as the Triple Crown. It's actually pretty strange to make a distinction between at-bats and plate appearances, as batting average does.

 

Through the entirety of baseball history, a team's OBP correlates better with its runs scored than AVG. SLG, even better. This is a statistical fact.

It is easier to find AB and hit totals for individuals in newpapers and box scores than plate appearances. I don't think anyone is disagreeing OPB not being important. But is is funny how offense has dropped.

 

 

Jim Thome, took a lot of grief around here. He was very streaky and station to station, and was on the team when some of this board became anti home run. But his first 2 years with the Sox would actually lead the league on OBP this season. His 3rd season would be top 25 and his last top 20, and that is with what would be maybe top 5 HR totals.

 

I don't think it is all steroids. I have said before, I think Bud deadened the ball a little to give the appearance his steroid policy is working. I think pitching is becoming even more specialized, which makes it harder to hit. The White Sox have played 5 nine inning games this season that took over 4 hours to finish. A lot of that is pitching changes, trips to the mound, batters taking their time,etc. They have to fix it. Generations attention spans are shrinking. Most 4 hour games on a Tuesday night suck,

[Dick Allen]

Same reason you don't credit for being on base when reaching via a fielder's choice. You only reached base because some unusual event occurred that allowed it, when otherwise the play would have resulted in you being out.

An out is recorded on a FC. All that other stuff is taken care of with ERA, and your batting average.

Edited September 18, 2014 by Dick Allen

[witesoxfan]

It is easier to find AB and hit totals for individuals in newpapers and box scores than plate appearances. I don't think anyone is disagreeing OPB not being important. But is is funny how offense has dropped.

 

 

Jim Thome, took a lot of grief around here. He was very streaky and station to station, and was on the team when some of this board became anti home run. But his first 2 years with the Sox would actually lead the league on OBP this season. His 3rd season would be top 25 and his last top 20, and that is with what would be maybe top 5 HR totals.

 

I don't think it is all steroids. I have said before, I think Bud deadened the ball a little to give the appearance his steroid policy is working. I think pitching is becoming even more specialized, which makes it harder to hit. The White Sox have played 5 nine inning games this season that took over 4 hours to finish. A lot of that is pitching changes, trips to the mound, batters taking their time,etc. They have to fix it. Generations attention spans are shrinking. Most 4 hour games on a Tuesday night suck,

 

Went to the Angels/Twins game on 9/5. It was a 4.5 hour game over 10 innings. It was over 4 hours to get through 9 innings. It was the least pleasant experience I've ever had at a baseball game and I love watching baseball live. The next night, it was a normal 9 inning game that lasted 3.5 hours and it was a fantastic game.

 

Yeah, the pace of the game needs to be picked up. It would make it much, much more entertaining.

 

One of the best games I was ever at was a game shortly after the all star break in 2010. Buehrle faced off against Pavano. The Twins won 3-2 and Konerko had a chance to drive in the tying run in the 9th (runner on 3rd, 1 out) but struck out or popped out. The game was finished in just over 2 hours. It was awesome.