Dick Allen Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 02:01 PM) This is the kind of guy that the Sox bullpen needs though. Another thread talked about leadership, Duke has done it all from a pitching standpoint. As a rookie, he looked like he was going to be the real deal, but eventually bombed as a starter then bombed in his transition to the bullpen, but kept working at it and is now getting some pretty good results. The bullpen is going to be pretty young next year, and someone who has the perspective of handling a lot of adversity can be a good leader for that group. Hes a solid bullpen arm, can go multiple innings if needed, and throws left handed. The contract is not large by the context of what other players have been getting or what I think they will continue to get in FA. Why was a certain former White Sox closer and his projected $3.8 million 1st year arb contract considered expensive, but Zach Duke 3 years $15 million, not much of a gamble? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 08:05 PM) Why was a certain former White Sox closer and his projected $3.8 million 1st year arb contract considered expensive, but Zach Duke 3 years $15 million, not much of a gamble? It's a great point, because time never changes, personnel never changes, and everything in the world is always absolute. So the most important thing in the world is trying to accuse someone of a message board of being inconsistent by comparing two vaguely similar circumstances over and over in every thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy the Clown Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Why was a certain former White Sox closer and his projected $3.8 million 1st year arb contract considered expensive, but Zach Duke 3 years $15 million, not much of a gamble? It should be noted that said former closer was exactly a league average reliever last year. How much do you think O.O WAR is worth? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 White Sox signed LHP Zach Duke to a three-year, $15 million contract. Not bad for a guy who was a non-roster invitee to spring training this past season. Duke had a terrific year for the Brewers, posting a 2.45 ERA and 74/17 K/BB ratio over 58 2/3 innings. The White Sox are obviously betting that he can duplicate that success. He'll help set up in Chicago. Per Rotoworld Hope he does not regress. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donny Lucy's Avocado Farm Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 I'm a little late to the thread here, but all I gotta say is, "Nicely done." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 QUOTE (Andy the Clown @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 02:28 PM) It should be noted that said former closer was exactly a league average reliever last year. How much do you think O.O WAR is worth? He was 1.7 in 2013 when he had to be moved. Duke was 1.3 last year and it got him $15 million for 3 years. Interesting Steamer has them both at 0.3 next season. Looks like he would have been a bargain to hang on to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 I'm a fan of this signing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheTruth05 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Dan Hayes @CSNHayes 52s52 seconds ago Rick Hahn: "We're on to the next one now." Says they're going to address other needs, including more bullpen help. #WhiteSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy the Clown Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 He was 1.7 in 2013 when he had to be moved. Duke was 1.3 last year and it got him $15 million for 3 years. Interesting Steamer has them both at 0.3 next season. Looks like he would have been a bargain to hang on to. So, you're irritated that the Sox dumped an overvalued reliever at precisely the right time? Steamer projections aren't very useful on Duke; Steamer doesn't know about the changes in skill that allowed Duke to improve significantly in 2014. Steamer is pretty instructive on Reed, given the large sample size there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 02:34 PM) He was 1.7 in 2013 when he had to be moved. Duke was 1.3 last year and it got him $15 million for 3 years. Interesting Steamer has them both at 0.3 next season. Looks like he would have been a bargain to hang on to. Except that the White Sox also got a prospect in Davidson. He looks like a bust at this point, but he's still here. If he hadn't, you wouldn't be singing this tune. He did, so you're singing the hindsight card. If the Sox traded Jake Petricka or Daniel Webb for a similarly talented prospect, I hope the Sox make that move again. Those guys aren't even expensive and I'm hoping they'd make a similar move if it presented itself. If this move flops in year 1, you are going to see people saying that they wished the Sox wouldn't have given him that 3rd year. The idea behind the move - bringing in a lefty reliever - is a worthwhile move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 QUOTE (TheTruth05 @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 02:37 PM) Dan Hayes @CSNHayes 52s52 seconds ago Rick Hahn: "We're on to the next one now." Says they're going to address other needs, including more bullpen help. #WhiteSox How's that Beckham trade coming along? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Of course it's expensive. They decided to outbid another team for a guy that appears to be a reliable LHP out of the pen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 02:39 PM) Except that the White Sox also got a prospect in Davidson. He looks like a bust at this point, but he's still here. If he hadn't, you wouldn't be singing this tune. He did, so you're singing the hindsight card. If the Sox traded Jake Petricka or Daniel Webb for a similarly talented prospect, I hope the Sox make that move again. Those guys aren't even expensive and I'm hoping they'd make a similar move if it presented itself. If this move flops in year 1, you are going to see people saying that they wished the Sox wouldn't have given him that 3rd year. The idea behind the move - bringing in a lefty reliever - is a worthwhile move. The problem is, the replacement for relievers "about to become expensive" is signing relievers who actually are more expensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigHurt3515 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 QUOTE (RockRaines @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 02:39 PM) Of course it's expensive. They decided to outbid another team for a guy that appears to be a reliable LHP out of the pen. Wait, who are you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 02:42 PM) The problem is, the replacement for relievers "about to become expensive" is signing relievers who actually are more expensive. This isn't the case at all. Nate Jones was a replacement for Addison Reed, he was far less expensive. Scott Downs was a replacement for Matt Thornton and he bombed, so they went with other guys throughout the rest of the 2014 season. Zach Duke is a replacement for Scott Downs. Also, I do believe you're wrong if you are insinuating that Belisario or Duke were somehow the replacement for Addison Reed. I think they were planning on signing Belisario anyways and Duke is going to take on a totally different role. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Scott Merkin @scottmerkin 8m8 minutes ago Duke said he's friends with Scott Podsednik, who speaks very highly of the White Sox organization Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 02:53 PM) Scott Merkin @scottmerkin 8m8 minutes ago Duke said he's friends with Scott Podsednik, who speaks very highly of the White Sox organization And we found our everyday left fielder for 2015!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Dan Hayes @CSNHayes 19m19 minutes ago Hahn said that Don Cooper had lunch with Zach Duke a while back. Coop was impressed with Duke and changes he has made. Hahn: Losing Nate last year left a hole in terms of guy who can come in & get big K. Certainly on list of things we're hoping to address. Zach Duke: I just feel like the athletes are there for this team to be successful (along with other additions). #WhiteSox Rick Hahn said #WhiteSox had to stretch to get Zach Duke deal done but bc there were limited options on LHP relief market, had to to do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 This signing looks good for he Sox. Basically $5M a year so we have a lot of money left for salaries and signings Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 It's pricey, but worth the risk I think. He's a groundball pitcher, which is what the Sox want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 02:52 PM) This isn't the case at all. Nate Jones was a replacement for Addison Reed, he was far less expensive. Scott Downs was a replacement for Matt Thornton and he bombed, so they went with other guys throughout the rest of the 2014 season. Zach Duke is a replacement for Scott Downs. Also, I do believe you're wrong if you are insinuating that Belisario or Duke were somehow the replacement for Addison Reed. I think they were planning on signing him anyways. I really don't want to get into the Reed stuff again, but he was making slightly over minimum and Jones was already on the roster, so whoever was his replacement , probably cost more in 2014 and probably 2015 as well. I really honestly hope this Duke signing works out, but I just know it won't. There are too many red flags. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 02:56 PM) I really honestly hope this Duke signing works out, but I just know it won't. Well, I'm glad we have that solved. Better move on to 2016. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 02:57 PM) Well, I'm glad we have that solved. Better move on to 2016. No. He will just be dead money like Keppinger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peppers312 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 signing a left-handedm ground-ball, relief pitcher for $5M a year is a steal compared to Miller who will want 4 years/$40M. i'm OK with this move Ricky Hahn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 18, 2014 -> 03:03 PM) No. He will just be dead money like Keppinger. He's younger than Keppinger. And I don't see any evidence that duke simply doesn't want to play baseball anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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