Dick Allen Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Coop doesn't even go talk to him when he is getting hammered. Maybe Kaplan knows something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Abreu Posted September 10, 2015 Author Share Posted September 10, 2015 QUOTE (GreenSox @ Sep 9, 2015 -> 08:28 PM) Melky was an awful signing. His career numbers were nothing special anyway and a decline is no surprise. What I don't understand is why Ventura coddles him and DHs Garcia, the younger player who needs the work. Ventura probably thinks Melky is the better player. Melky is better than Garcia... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Abreu Posted September 10, 2015 Author Share Posted September 10, 2015 QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ Sep 9, 2015 -> 08:29 PM) ERA approaching 5. Â At this point I'm rooting for him to sit on the bench the rest of the year. Let Johnson get his innings. Hell, give them to Frankie. Just bench this guy. Agreed. Why start him? RV said they're gonna try and get Montas some starts. I don't think we'd have a 7-man rotation, obviously, so someone's sitting, and I think it should be Samardzija. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Sep 9, 2015 -> 08:29 PM) Well, I wouldn't say his bad pitching this year is entirely due to strikeouts. I think it's mostly his command. Â Anyway, it wouldn't be a drastic spike in his K/9. It would still be subpar by his (former) standards. Â His command is garbage. He leaves the ball up and over the plate on his "splitter" way too often. Doesn't split. Reminds me of Contreras at times. Probably would be better served trying to improve his changeup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Sep 10, 2015 -> 01:29 AM) Coop doesn't even go talk to him when he is getting hammered. Maybe Kaplan knows something  No doubt in my mind there's some truth to that story Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beautox Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 sometimes you run hot..lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Sep 10, 2015 -> 01:29 AM) Melky is better than Garcia... Â They both have massively sucked this year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Abreu Posted September 10, 2015 Author Share Posted September 10, 2015 QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 9, 2015 -> 08:33 PM) They both have massively sucked this year Garcia has massively sucked this year. Â But with Melky, we knew what we were getting defensively. Offensively, has he underperformed? Yes. But has he massively sucked? No. He has been excellent with RISP and his .271 batting average is at least respectable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Samardzija deserves credit for doing his best to get the Sox a top ten pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Sep 9, 2015 -> 08:35 PM) Garcia has massively sucked this year. But with Melky, we knew what we were getting defensively. Offensively, has he underperformed? Yes. But has he massively sucked? No. He has been excellent with RISP and his .271 batting average is at least respectable.  Melky has sucked. If we're going by BA as the metric than Garcia is a whopping 2 points lower. They both have sucked. Right there is fugging 4-6 WAR that the team really f***ing needed and did not get. Instead they got negative WAR. Hard to figure how hard some of these guys suck.  Makes me want to change the manager ya know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 9, 2015 -> 08:35 PM) Samardzija deserves credit for doing his best to get the Sox a top ten pick. Â The should just DFA him that would be awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ Sep 9, 2015 -> 07:58 PM) The answer is simple: cut bait on the guppy. The expected 2.5 WAR from the draft pick over the course of his career simply is not worth the very good chance that Shark accepts the QO. You keep highlighting this "expected 2.5 career WAR" draft pick, which is a terrible way to look at draft picks. We get it, most draft picks amount to nothing. But occasionally, a guy drafted in the comp round ends up a 10 WAR player or even a 20 WAR player. This isn't a bell curve with 2.5 as the mean. It's a skewed distribution, but one with some big payoffs if you select the right player. And a significant part of that payoff is the surplus value a good pick provides, which is the lifeblood of successful organizations. By treating all WAR the same and ignoring the financial cost to acquire said production, your logic basically devalues draft picks of all rounds, with maybe the exception of the 1st overall pick. Â Also, there is almost no chance Shark accepts the QO. He won't get the seven figure deal he was hoping for, but some team will offer him a James Shields contract. Scouts have always loved the arm and there is always one GM willing to do something stupid in free agency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Sep 10, 2015 -> 01:35 AM) Garcia has massively sucked this year. But with Melky, we knew what we were getting defensively. Offensively, has he underperformed? Yes. But has he massively sucked? No. He has been excellent with RISP and his .271 batting average is at least respectable.  Melky is 144 out of 153 in fWAR. Avi 145th. Melky has a worse offensive rating than Avi as well. I stand by my statement that they both suck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ Sep 10, 2015 -> 01:36 AM) Melky has sucked. If we're going by BA as the metric than Garcia is a whopping 2 points lower. They both have sucked. Right there is fugging 4-6 WAR that the team really f***ing needed and did not get. Instead they got negative WAR. Hard to figure how hard some of these guys suck. Â Makes me want to change the manager ya know? Â And especially the GM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Abreu Posted September 10, 2015 Author Share Posted September 10, 2015 QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ Sep 9, 2015 -> 08:36 PM) Melky has sucked. If we're going by BA as the metric than Garcia is a whopping 2 points lower. They both have sucked. Right there is fugging 4-6 WAR that the team really f***ing needed and did not get. Instead they got negative WAR. Hard to figure how hard some of these guys suck. Yeah, but Garcia has been terrible all around. We didn't think he'd be the worst defensive outfielder in baseball, or whatever he is. Whereas we knew Melky would be poor defensively. I guess it has to do with expectations. Â QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 9, 2015 -> 08:37 PM) Melky is 144 out of 153 in fWAR. Avi 145th. Melky has a worse offensive rating than Avi as well. I stand by my statement that they both suck. I refer you to my above comment about expectations and what we knew about their defense. They do both suck, but I guess my argument is that Melky sucks less. It may be a personal thing, though, as perhaps some of you expected Melky to come in as an average or good defender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 (edited) QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Sep 9, 2015 -> 08:37 PM) You keep highlighting this "expected 2.5 career WAR" draft pick, which is a terrible way to look at draft picks. We get it, most draft picks amount to nothing. But occasionally, a guy drafted in the comp round ends up a 10 WAR player or even a 20 WAR player. This isn't a bell curve with 2.5 as the mean. It's a skewed distribution, but one with some big payoffs if you select the right player. And a significant part of that payoff is the surplus value a good pick provides, which is the lifeblood of successful organizations. By treating all WAR the same and ignoring the financial cost to acquire said production, your logic basically devalues draft picks of all rounds, with maybe the exception of the 1st overall pick. Also, there is almost no chance Shark accepts the QO. He won't get the seven figure deal he was hoping for, but some team will offer him a James Shields contract. Scouts have always loved the arm and there is always one GM willing to do something stupid in free agency.  It's the expected WAR there's no other way to look at it. It's like saying "oh I expect THIS lottery ticket to really pay off!" If the Sox were getting comp pick after comp pick sure, then there is a coherent strategy but this is a one off thing and it comes at a very real cost -- overpaying a 1 WAR Shark when they are already approaching max payroll.  If the Sox committed to a full tear down and rebuild then HOLISTICALLY you could justify taking the comp pick as part of an internally coherent strategy but it's quite clear that is not the plan.  The only way to look at these things is through the expected WAR. Yea, they could hit the jackpot but the odds are stacked against them. In my risk assesment the odds of Shark taking the QO and f***ing them for 2016 is a greater risk than the upside of picking in the 40-50 range.  I mean WTF about the White Sox drafting in that pick range makes you think they are EVEN going to get that?  This is the last I will post on this. Draft picks are highly, highly over valued by most fans. If the Sox could sell the the pick they'd get about 12-15 million for it at absolute most, which reflects the value of the expected WAR perfectly. Edited September 10, 2015 by chitownsportsfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OmarComing25 Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 9, 2015 -> 08:35 PM) Samardzija deserves credit for doing his best to get the Sox a top ten pick. s*** we're 14th now? The damn Orioles are behind us now. Arizona has fallen off a bit the last two weeks too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OmarComing25 Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ Sep 9, 2015 -> 08:44 PM) It's the expected WAR there's no other way to look at it. It's like saying "oh I expect THIS lottery ticket to really pay off!" If the Sox were getting comp pick after comp pick sure, then there is a coherent strategy but this is a one off thing and it comes at a very real cost -- overpaying a 1 WAR Shark when they are already approaching max payroll. If the Sox committed to a full tear down and rebuild then HOLISTICALLY you could justify taking the comp pick as part of an internally coherent strategy but it's quite clear that is not the plan.  The only way to look at these things is through the expected WAR. Yea, they could hit the jackpot but the odds are stacked against them. In my risk assesment the odds of Shark taking the QO and f***ing them for 2016 is a greater risk than the upside of picking in the 40-50 range.  I mean WTF about the White Sox drafting in that pick range makes you think they are EVEN going to get that?  This is the last I will post on this. Draft picks are highly, highly over valued by most fans. If the Sox could sell the the pick they'd get about 12-15 million for it at absolute most, which reflects the value of the expected WAR perfectly. Just FYI the pick would be in the mid-to-late 20s range, not 40-50. Not that it would change your valuation of it that much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Sep 10, 2015 -> 01:45 AM) s*** we're 14th now? The damn Orioles are behind us now. Arizona has fallen off a bit the last two weeks too. Â Only good thing about not having a protected pick is it might avoid another disastrous free agent signing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Hey there's a HR for Tyler. Things happened. Woo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OmarComing25 Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Loved the fist pump by Brantly in the bullpen there. He looked so happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Yay homers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Nice HR by Saladino, who looks like he has a clue ... enough to be our utility guy next year. So the way it stands in the infield, it should be new guy at third, new guy at ss, Micah at second if he can field, and Abreu at first. Saladino is our utility guy and Beckham and Sanchez should be traded/cut. If we can't find a ss, we keep Lexi and it's new guy at third, Lexi at short, Micah at second. Saladino plays both 2B and SS giving Lexi a lot more days off than this season. But I like Saladino as our utility guy. He's earned it. Sorry, Sanchez can't hit a lick and Beckham blows. Â Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Eric Cooper continues to be a disgrace. No clue how he was picked for WS last year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 (edited) Carlos Sanchez just isn't a big league hitter. Needs to find a way to avoid so many weak ground balls Edited September 10, 2015 by fathom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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