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9/23 at Detroit Tigers

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QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Sep 23, 2015 -> 11:30 AM)
So Montas has one bad inning and now you want to give up on him as a starter? It's been clear that he's a big project and an unfinished product for a while now. Still too early to make that call. This board can be so reactionary at times.

Unless he can pull a 3rd pitch out of his ass, a good one at that, he doesn't look like a starter. He could probably live out of the bullpen successfully right now but once guys see 95-98 and his slider once it gets easier to hit the second time around. If he picked up a splitter or a change or even worked on a cutter he would be fine, but unless he gets another plus pitch he looks like a good set up guy, not a starter.

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QUOTE (flavum @ Sep 23, 2015 -> 07:32 PM)
Cabrera tradeable?

 

Throw maybe 3-4 million a year in, and don't see why not. Doubt the Sox do that though.

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QUOTE (Knackattack @ Sep 23, 2015 -> 06:33 PM)
Unless he can pull a 3rd pitch out of his ass, a good one at that, he doesn't look like a starter. He could probably live out of the bullpen successfully right now but once guys see 95-98 and his slider once it gets easier to hit the second time around. If he picked up a splitter or a change or even worked on a cutter he would be fine, but unless he gets another plus pitch he looks like a good set up guy, not a starter.

 

He throws hard, but it's not a deceptive fastball at all. He's going to have to learn to elevate it to be more effective if he's a closer.

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QUOTE (Knackattack @ Sep 23, 2015 -> 01:33 PM)
Unless he can pull a 3rd pitch out of his ass, a good one at that, he doesn't look like a starter. He could probably live out of the bullpen successfully right now but once guys see 95-98 and his slider once it gets easier to hit the second time around. If he picked up a splitter or a change or even worked on a cutter he would be fine, but unless he gets another plus pitch he looks like a good set up guy, not a starter.

 

I can see him at the back end of the bullpen, like a Kelvin Herrera type setup guy.

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QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 23, 2015 -> 07:32 PM)
And many of the same people who want to do a full rebuild...

 

Hope you're not including me in that segment. Full rebuild makes no sense when you have already started Rodon's clock and have a pretty weak farm system to start with. I don't see why they can't be competitive in 2017 if they can maximize Sale or Quintana's trade value for young, MLB-ready players (ie: Betts)

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QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 23, 2015 -> 01:23 PM)
Wouldn't be selling low at all on Montas and Johnson. For Johnson, there are teams out there that love their speedy guys who have good OBP. I don't think he's a good fit with the Sox going forward due to the need for improved defense. All it takes is one GM out there to think Montas can be a starter, and you can get very good value for him.

Micah failed to stick this season. You already have been ripping Montas for a little while. Why is that not selling low? If you thought they were good, you wouldn't want them traded. Do you really think you know something other teams don't?

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QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Sep 23, 2015 -> 07:37 PM)
Micah failed to stick this season. You already have been ripping Montas for a little while. Why is that not selling low? If you thought they were good, you wouldn't want them traded. Do you really think you know something other teams don't?

 

Montas was drawing rave reviews in the AFL for his velocity last year, and I didn't think he looked like a starter then. Just a feeling watching him pitch. As for Johnson, trading him would be due to a position of strength (in terms of possible assets going forward). Assuming the Sox bring in an upgrade at 3B, I'm fine with Sanchez at 2B going forward. There's always the outside chance Anderson ends up at 2nd as well.

 

I'm not the type of poster that thinks the Sox can get value for someone like LaRoche in the offseason, so they're going to have to trade guys who other teams actually like. The only one off-limits to me is Abreu, just because he's such a better hitter than anyone else in the organization.

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Micah has pretty outstanding minor league numbers and only 114 MLB plate appearances. He has value to a team that values offense over defense and while he may not be a centerpiece to a deal he could very well be a piece to add to maybe a Quintana trade to net us a 3b.

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QUOTE (Knackattack @ Sep 23, 2015 -> 01:44 PM)
Micah has pretty outstanding minor league numbers and only 114 MLB plate appearances. He has value to a team that values offense over defense and while he may not be a centerpiece to a deal he could very well be a piece to add to maybe a Quintana trade to net us a 3b.

If the Sox have to add Micah to Quintana, the 3B they get better be an All Star.

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These September out of contention performances mean nothing good or bad. Most players struggle initially in their major league careers. There are others that do good things as youngsters in September that they never do again, even with the White Sox. Jerry Owens, Brent Morel, Josh Fields...there are more.

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Jeeze guys, this is what development looks like. Remember Rodons 2 IP 13 ER game?

 

Montas should be developed as a starter for as long as possible. Pitchers acquire new pitchers quite often.

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QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Sep 23, 2015 -> 02:05 PM)
I do not remember Rodon giving up 13 er in 2 innings to be honest.

 

Rodon gave up 7 ER in 3 innings twice(STL and Pitt) and 8 ER in 3 innings(Yankees) this season, he hasnt been nails all season

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QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Sep 23, 2015 -> 12:10 PM)
Rodon gave up 7 ER in 3 innings twice(STL and Pitt) and 8 ER in 3 innings(Yankees) this season, he hasnt been nails all season

He was pretty inconsistent early but his past 7 starts have been damn impressive.

 

4-2, 6.88IP per start, 1.68 era, 45k/16bb

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I look for LaRoche to bounce back a bit next year. He never DHd, and his poor performance seemed to snowball. By all accounts he is a pro, and I think he still has it in him to have a decent year.

 

Just remember 2012. People were mortified the Sox had to pay AJ $6 million, what with Tyler Flowers waiting in the wings. He came up big, put up career numbers. LaRoche had a season like this several years ago, and bounced by nicely. Maybe it won't be as nice since he's a bit older, but he should be better next season.

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QUOTE (Knackattack @ Sep 23, 2015 -> 02:09 PM)
Yeah Rodon's worst start was 3.0IP/8ER against the Yankees

 

Which was the worst performance I've ever seen in my life. It was 2.5 hrs into the game and only in the 3rd inning.

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QUOTE (Knackattack @ Sep 23, 2015 -> 02:20 PM)
He was pretty inconsistent early but his past 7 starts have been damn impressive.

 

4-2, 6.88IP per start, 1.68 era, 45k/16bb

 

Right, my point isn't that Rodon isn't terrible, it's that young pitchers have bad games, and they don't always mean anything.

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QUOTE (Knackattack @ Sep 23, 2015 -> 02:20 PM)
He was pretty inconsistent early but his past 7 starts have been damn impressive.

 

4-2, 6.88IP per start, 1.68 era, 45k/16bb

 

I know, all i am saying (which i am reiterating what bmags said) is that sometimes young pitchers get lit up.

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QUOTE (Mike F. @ Sep 23, 2015 -> 12:47 PM)
So Montas was bad today? Didn't get to watch the game.

Just seemed to labor through the innings with a lot of long AB's, and the good hitters crushed him pretty hard.

Edited by Knackattack

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