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Fernando Tatis Jr. thread

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34 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

No offense, but the Tatis comparison to Mahomes is terrible. There are many casual baseball fans that don’t even know who Tatis is, especially if they follow an AL team. Every football fan knows Mahomes and many non-football fans have heard of him too.

Right, plus Tatis is playing where he is because of a really stupid decision by a Chicago team and Mahomes . . . well, never mind.

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2 hours ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

No offense, but the Tatis comparison to Mahomes is terrible. There are many casual baseball fans that don’t even know who Tatis is, especially if they follow an AL team. Every football fan knows Mahomes and many non-football fans have heard of him too.

Who would he be the, DeShaun Watson?  Russell Wilson?  Josh Allen? Dak Prescott?

Because those guys aren’t the face of the NFL, quite.  

Matt Rodgers?  He’s a well-established veteran who dates or marries celebrities and is creating his own quieter media empire.

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1 hour ago, caulfield12 said:

Who would he be the, DeShaun Watson?  Russell Wilson?  Josh Allen? Dak Prescott?

Because those guys aren’t the face of the NFL, quite.  

Matt Rodgers?  He’s a well-established veteran who dates or marries celebrities and is creating his own quieter media empire.

Why does he have to be any of those guys? Yes, Tatis Jr is an exciting young player but he’s far from a household name at this point in his career and MLB will be fine without him. Admittedly, I would find some enjoyment in the irony of a situation where he becomes a financial burden to the Padres if he can’t stay on the field. I never root for injuries but I’d feel much worse for Tatis Jr if he wasn’t just guaranteed $340M.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

Why does he have to be any of those guys? Yes, Tatis Jr is an exciting young player but he’s far from a household name at this point in his career and MLB will be fine without him. Admittedly, I would find some enjoyment in the irony of a situation where he becomes a financial burden to the Padres if he can’t stay on the field. I never root for injuries but I’d feel much worse for Tatis Jr if he wasn’t just guaranteed $340M.

Jersey sales would argue otherwise...

I will just say this.  #1, risk mitigation, 40-60% gets paid by insurance in the case of a catastrophic injury.

Point #2, this would be the excuse for the next 10-15 years for teams NOT to sign these deals, especially mid and small market teams.

Because giving that money to free agents who are older and declining eventually will never work in favor of the White Sox.

Edited by caulfield12

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Posted (edited)

Now JUSTgottaBELIEVE has reverse jinxed Joe Musgrove into throwing a no-hitter...amazingly, last franchise without a no-hitter.  Dates all the way back to 1969, 52 years.

The Mets were the other (last one to get one, Johan Santana), pretty incredible with all the stuff pitchers they’ve had. 
 

Also the Phillies went 8944 games without one, longest stretch in MLB history.

 

That’s now also 29 consecutive innings without a run scoring against him.  Musgrove grew up a Padres’ fan, local kid, idolized Jake Peavy and now wears his number 44.

Hit Gallo with a pitch that got away or it would have been a perfect game.

 

Giolito, Alec Mills the only no hitters last season.

Now 306 in MLB history.  Gabe Caratini has amazingly caught two of the last three, haha. Had game winning hit in last game and is useful depth with Nola out, the completely overlooked aspect of the Yu Darvish deal.

 

Edited by caulfield12

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

Why does he have to be any of those guys? Yes, Tatis Jr is an exciting young player but he’s far from a household name at this point in his career and MLB will be fine without him. Admittedly, I would find some enjoyment in the irony of a situation where he becomes a financial burden to the Padres if he can’t stay on the field. I never root for injuries but I’d feel much worse for Tatis Jr if he wasn’t just guaranteed $340M.

Nobody in MLB is a "household name" in America because the owners continue to run the sport like a tobacco company, no promotion, squeezing every last cent out of it while their old, dying and declining customer base are still alive, while despising their product and the athletes who play it.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/mlb/average-age-of-mlb-fans-is-terrible-news-for-baseball/ar-BB15tjyS

Edited by South Side Hit Men

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Posted (edited)
13 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Nobody in MLB is a "household name" in America because the owners continue to run the sport like a tobacco company, no promotion, squeezing every last cent out of it while their old, dying and declining customer base are still alive, while despising their product and the athletes who play it.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/mlb/average-age-of-mlb-fans-is-terrible-news-for-baseball/ar-BB15tjyS

I think they must be measuring or counting fans as someone who says baseball is their favorite sport...and not do they watch MLB but still favor NFL or NBA?   Certainly losing youngsters to things like esports and MMA/boxing/wrestling.  

it remains to be seen in terms of the fallout from the ASG decision...how many of those older, majority white male baseball fans are turned off by a largely political decision, or boycott.

I would guess it’s not an insignificant number, looking at voting trends the last two elections and the Facebook response of baseball fans in my family that I know to be more conservative or Republican.


“I know that’s a pretty obscure question, but it turns out that we have the data to figure it out. In our Q1 2018 U.S. consumer benchmark survey, we ask about the sports that people like to watch on TV and we also asked about their political leanings. As you can see in the graphic below, baseball fans are decidedly more Republican than the general population.”

https://www.xminstitute.com/blog/baseball-fans-lean-right/

Interestingly, you wouldn’t know it from SoxTalk, where the average age is probably 28-36, right?

 

Heck, watching the Masters feed this weekend, I wonder how many of their beloved “patrons” as Jim Nantz always refers to them are currently unhappy with the club statements this past week and no Tiger Woods?  Having lived in Augusta for 2 1/2 years, I was a bit shocked they wanted to wade into the voting rights controversy.  Perhaps they are feeling the same pressure from sponsors like Mercedes-Benz and Rolex, but that in and of itself would be shocking that Rolex would want to take the same controversial stand, too.

Edited by caulfield12

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My article or comments related to the decline in baseball viewers were strictly baseball related. Both the comments and decline have nothing to do with politics. I appreciate the board’s owners’ commitment to keeping those conversations elsewhere.

From my article:

Quote

The inability to market stars has become even more evident in today's world. Someone like Patrick Mahomes has made himself into one of the faces of the NFL thanks to his success on the field and the way he is shown off by the league. Meanwhile, Mike Trout is a legend of the game playing in relative obscurity when it comes to his popularity nationwide among all individuals -- and he's literally based in Los Angeles!

This is the point I was making, as a rebuttal to @JUSTgottaBELIEVE ‘s comment that Tatis is not a household name.

As far as the all star game is concerned, I never had an interest in watching or attending any sport’s all star game, or other exhibition games. Passed on getting all star game tickets at both Comiskey and the Chicago Stadium (NHL).

It may have made sense in the 1930s and 1940s, when fans outside of a few major cities (Boston, Philadelphia, New York, Chicago and Saint Louis) were unable to see players from one league or the other. Games have been nationally televised since the 1950s, and with the garbage interleague games, fans can see players in person as well. It’s just another money making owner scheme, players are at risk of injury, really don’t care about it beyond any injury impact.
 

 

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^exactly why MLB won’t experience a significant decline in interest if a player like Tatis Jr isn’t on the field. Because there really isn’t one player in the MLB that has that type of impact, unlike say the NBA or NFL.

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13 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

^exactly why MLB won’t experience a significant decline in interest if a player like Tatis Jr isn’t on the field. Because there really isn’t one player in the MLB that has that type of impact, unlike say the NBA or NFL.

Because the owners have trashed the sport over the decades to the point of irrelevance. MLB used to be the King, "America's Pasttime" among America's three most popular sports. It has since joined horse racing and boxing into irrelevance, clinging to life support like our team's owner and manager. 

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1 hour ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Because the owners have trashed the sport over the decades to the point of irrelevance. MLB used to be the King, "America's Pasttime" among America's three most popular sports. It has since joined horse racing and boxing into irrelevance, clinging to life support like our team's owner and manager. 

Tennis...without the Williams sisters and Sampras/Agassi.

Golf is struggling without Tiger Woods.  NASCAR numbers down without a Gordon, Patrick or Earnhardt, and then the political aspects, again.

Pretty cyclical.  Things like X Games or skateboarding/parkour are growing in popularity.

 

All these things said, baseball generates more yearly revenue and the team values match up pretty closely with the NBA.

When LeBron leaves the league, there will be a vacuum just like when Bird/Magic retired, Michael Jordan left the game, etc.   I haven’t watched a full NBA game since Jordan’s last Bulls’ season.  But I’ll more than happily watch NCAA basketball, in the tourney especially.  College basketball is going to lose more top players to the development league, where nobody will hear their nanes until draft night.  Meanwhile, Luka Garza might go around pick 59.  The two games are becoming increasingly disconnected...more international, which means millions watching outside the US, especially here in China.

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51 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Tennis...without the Williams sisters and Sampras/Agassi.

Golf is struggling without Tiger Woods.  NASCAR numbers down without a Gordon, Patrick or Earnhardt, and then the political aspects, again.

Pretty cyclical.  Things like X Games or skateboarding/parkour are growing in popularity.

All these things said, baseball generates more yearly revenue and the team values match up pretty closely with the NBA.

When LeBron leaves the league, there will be a vacuum just like when Bird/Magic retired, Michael Jordan left the game, etc.   I haven’t watched a full NBA game since Jordan’s last Bulls’ season.  But I’ll more than happily watch NCAA basketball, in the tourney especially.  College basketball is going to lose more top players to the development league, where nobody will hear their nanes until draft night.  Meanwhile, Luka Garza might go around pick 59.  The two games are becoming increasingly disconnected...more international, which means millions watching outside the US, especially here in China.

Tobacco companies have also been able to generate significant revenue and cash flows for decades, as their customers die, and demand for their product decreases by raising prices.

Baseball has done the same, attendance declines offset by higher ticket prices, hanging on to RSNs and fleecing a dwindling customer base, not attracting the next two generations by shortsighted policies. Denying customers the chance to stream their product locally, ridiculous blackout policies across multiple states (Nevada, without a team, currently has six teams subject to blackout). Removal of all free broadcasts from TV, further ending exposure to all but a dwindling customer base.

The other three sports leagues sought to play as many games as possible during COVID, baseball owners simultaneously sought to cancel as many games as possible. The Commissioner trashing the World Series as a fight for "A piece of metal". Just a few examples of how the "stewards" of the game are destroying short and long term interest in the game.

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Posted (edited)
35 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Tobacco companies have also been able to generate significant revenue and cash flows for decades, as their customers die, and demand for their product decreases by raising prices.

Baseball has done the same, attendance declines offset by higher ticket prices, hanging on to RSNs and fleecing a dwindling customer base, not attracting the next two generations by shortsighted policies. Denying customers the chance to stream their product locally, ridiculous blackout policies across multiple states (Nevada, without a team, currently has six teams subject to blackout). Removal of all free broadcasts from TV, further ending exposure to all but a dwindling customer base.

The other three sports leagues sought to play as many games as possible during COVID, baseball owners simultaneously sought to cancel as many games as possible. The Commissioner trashing the World Series as a fight for "A piece of metal". Just a few examples of how the "stewards" of the game are destroying short and long term interest in the game.

Gambling legalization and MLB Advanced Media/BAM Tech are making up for some of that.

Luckily, outside of the country, no blackouts.

But there was always that issue in Eastern Iowa.  There is still the Fox Saturday games?  Actually, the Quad Cities they had many Cardinals and White Sox games on free t.v., but those same games weren’t available on cable or satellite.

We shall see what happens when T-Mobile comes after the cable companies...but the way young people consume baseball is constantly changing and evolving, more to phones, iPads and big screen tv’s at home.

Also, men are living longer and enjoying more leisure years in retirement than in the 1950’s and 60’s, so more time and resources to consume product.   Baseball is unique, providing twice as much live content as the NBA and 10x than football, and the costs are still much more reasonable than a 16-22/23 episode scripted television program.

Edited by caulfield12

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5 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Because the owners have trashed the sport over the decades to the point of irrelevance. MLB used to be the King, "America's Pasttime" among America's three most popular sports. It has since joined horse racing and boxing into irrelevance, clinging to life support like our team's owner and manager. 

Might as well just put them out of their misery and close up shop now since no one cares about baseball anymore. Surprising a multi-billionaire like Cohen would invest an enormous amount of money in an irrelevant, dying sport. 

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56 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

Might as well just put them out of their misery and close up shop now since no one cares about baseball anymore. Surprising a multi-billionaire like Cohen would invest an enormous amount of money in an irrelevant, dying sport. 

Based on the Melvin Capital episode, not sure if Cohen is brilliant, stubborn, both or neither...if nothing else, he’s making headlines for the team.

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7 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

Tennis...without the Williams sisters and Sampras/Agassi.

Golf is struggling without Tiger Woods.  NASCAR numbers down without a Gordon, Patrick or Earnhardt, and then the political aspects, again.

Pretty cyclical.  Things like X Games or skateboarding/parkour are growing in popularity.

 

All these things said, baseball generates more yearly revenue and the team values match up pretty closely with the NBA.

When LeBron leaves the league, there will be a vacuum just like when Bird/Magic retired, Michael Jordan left the game, etc.   I haven’t watched a full NBA game since Jordan’s last Bulls’ season.  But I’ll more than happily watch NCAA basketball, in the tourney especially.  College basketball is going to lose more top players to the development league, where nobody will hear their nanes until draft night.  Meanwhile, Luka Garza might go around pick 59.  The two games are becoming increasingly disconnected...more international, which means millions watching outside the US, especially here in China.

Golf, if measured by rounds played, had a resurgence last year, fueled by pandemic related safety concerns.  

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40 minutes ago, Stinky Stanky said:

Golf, if measured by rounds played, had a resurgence last year, fueled by pandemic related safety concerns.  

More referring to PGA ratings...but yeah, it’s one of the best social distancing, escape from reality options.

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Pretty cool Tatis took batting practice today and may be back next week. 

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On Sun Apr 11 2021 at 7:55 AM, flavum said:

Pretty cool Tatis took batting practice today and may be back next week. 

 

https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/sports/padres/story/2021-04-09/fernando-tatis-gwynn-dodgers-padres-world-series-bid

 

A lot of Padres' fans have been targeting the upcoming Dodgers series this weekend.  That night be too ambitious, but hard to imagine him missing it if there's any way for him to be on the field. 

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Here's why you need to have QUALITY depth.

Padres have lost Nola (starting catcher), Tatis, Morejon (very easily for the season if he needs surgery) and now Snell.   Trent Grisham was out the first week, and is now the hottest hitter in baseball upon his return (the little-noticed Brewers deal with Zach Davies for Urias/Lauer/$$$ or player to be named later.)  That's not even mentioning Pham almost dying in the offseason stabbing outside a strip bar...and quite clearly not 100% himself if you look at his numbers.

 

They've now had two games in the span of a week that the entire bullpen has had to cover from the 1st or 2nd inning on.

 

Fortunately for them, they still have Dinelson Lamet (one more rehab start), Weathers and Gore backing up the starting rotation.  Very quietly, they're 8-3, but the first real test will be this weekend against the Dodgers.

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Posted (edited)

Back today off the 10 day DL.

Hitting second in highly anticipated rematch with the Dodgers.

 

First seven hitters for the Dodgers range from 974 ops all the way up to Turner’s 1.321...crazy.

 

Edited by caulfield12
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Tatis is on pace for 54 homers and 189 errors...for this year at least, the Dodgers are just too good, and they’re even playing without Bellinger.   It’s going to take Lamet, Clevinger and Gore all pitching at peak in 2022. 

For the time being, it has to be LA versus the rest of MLB for the 2021 World Series title to get anything resembling a fair bet unless one of Bauer, Buehler or Kershaw gets hurt.

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Tatis with a HR in a five hour drama. 11-6 Dodgers at Petco. The Pods ran out of bodies with a player pitching and Musgrove in LF. Not many younguns want to spend five hours on a 12 inning ballgame. 

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Tatis is really forcing things defensively...he made a really exceptional stop in the hole, then threw it away trying to get a putout at second base and it led from a 2-2 tie quickly becoming a 4-2 deficit.

Sometimes, you just have to put it in your pocket.   But, when you have one of the best SS arms in baseball, these things tend to happen.  The other error was being in too much of a hurry to complete a DP.

He was one of the best statistically on defense last year, this looks like 2019 all over again.

Ultimately, he end up in CF when Abrams is ready...but being out of the action will drive him crazy.

 

By the way, Cronenworth as recently as the last couple of years was considered a legit two way player like Brendan McKay.  Quite a nit of legit pitching experience.  Very rare the Rays make a mistake trading such a valuable utility guy...that can even hit third in a loaded lineup like that.

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Posted (edited)
On 4/5/2021 at 11:17 AM, manbearpuig said:

Jealous of the teams with depth. You would think after years of sucking, they could have developed some bench options other than Engel.

It dips into ownership's  profit margin.

These owners are not sportsmen.

They are business men who figured out a way to make money owning sports teams

They revere Reinsdorf for that.

The native New Yorker doesn't give a damn about Chicago's fanbase except those that enrich him.

The Sox may not be stuck with the family too much longer but lordy I feel for Bulls fans.

Edited by GradMc

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