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On 5/14/2021 at 1:57 PM, StrangeSox said:

FWIW here's the CDC's actual guidance page

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/fully-vaccinated-guidance.html

 


Here's the linked underlying scientific data they're basing their guidance on, which appears to have been last updated on April 2nd:

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-briefs/fully-vaccinated-people.html?CDC_AA_refVal=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cdc.gov%2Fcoronavirus%2F2019-ncov%2Fmore%2Ffully-vaccinated-people.htm

 

Here's their conclusion:

 

 

I think they screwed the pooch on this one. In effect, they want Americans to go on the honor system. IOW, how, exactly does one ABSOLUTELY KNOW that someone else is "fully vaccinated?" How does a business KNOW, FOR SURE that that customer is vaccinated? Most folks who moronically assign a political meaning to masking are the types to refuse vaccination/lie about getting one.

They could/should have differentiated between public spaces and private spaces for maskless gatherings, OR put in language urging businesses to maintain mask guidelines, without MANDATING them. We're only at ~35% fully vaccinated, which means that there are still plenty of fat fuck 'muricans for COVID to feast upon. And to create new variants.

 

At best, this is only going to create confusion and "mask Karens" everywhere. At worst, this can fuck up our progress on this pandemic.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Two-Gun Pete said:

I think they screwed the pooch on this one. In effect, they want Americans to go on the honor system. IOW, how, exactly does one ABSOLUTELY KNOW that someone else is "fully vaccinated?" How does a business KNOW, FOR SURE that that customer is vaccinated? Most folks who moronically assign a political meaning to masking are the types to refuse vaccination/lie about getting one.

They could/should have differentiated between public spaces and private spaces for maskless gatherings, OR put in language urging businesses to maintain mask guidelines, without MANDATING them. We're only at ~35% fully vaccinated, which means that there are still plenty of fat fuck 'muricans for COVID to feast upon. And to create new variants.

 

At best, this is only going to create confusion and "mask Karens" everywhere. At worst, this can fuck up our progress on this pandemic.

Most of the Karens have been scared to death by the "experts" the past 13 months. Now that the experts are saying it's OK to discard the masks and the masks are 100 percent not needed if u are vaccinated, the Karens for some reason have become the experts. They don't want to shed the masks.

I know COVID is really bad; I get it. But this all has been handled so poorly. If you are vaxxed you don't need a mask, period. ... Out of all my shake my head in disgust moments during COVID, I'd like to know what the hell happened to the flu bug. Is it gone forever? Were there literally no flu cases/deaths this past winter? Makes u wonder if we've had weird viruses for years now since the flu apparently has been taken care of. Never a word about a case of flu anymore.

Edited by greg775

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18 minutes ago, greg775 said:

Most of the Karens have been scared to death by the "experts" the past 13 months. Now that the experts are saying it's OK to discard the masks and the masks are 100 percent not needed if u are vaccinated, the Karens for some reason have become the experts. They don't want to shed the masks.

I know COVID is really bad; I get it. But this all has been handled so poorly. If you are vaxxed you don't need a mask, period. ... Out of all my shake my head in disgust moments during COVID, I'd like to know what the hell happened to the flu bug. Is it gone forever? Were there literally no flu cases/deaths this past winter? Makes u wonder if we've had weird viruses for years now since the flu apparently has been taken care of. Never a word about a case of flu anymore.

This was amongst the most ignorant of all of the covid conspiracies.  Did anyone stop and think that the things being done to prevent covid, such as masks and social distancing,  would have a major reduction affect on the way less virulent flu strains? It seems really obvious if you pull your head out the Q-niverse.

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5 hours ago, greg775 said:

 Never a word about a case of flu anymore.

Well little buddy SS stepped up and offered an Ivy league presentation on the subject.  Ol' Tex will tell y'all what my grandpappy told me when I was just a Lil Tex . . . when you gotta slop the hogs,  dig a well,  and plant the back forty before breakfast, you ain't got time to notice the outhouse needs a paintin'.

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9 hours ago, Two-Gun Pete said:

I think they screwed the pooch on this one. In effect, they want Americans to go on the honor system. IOW, how, exactly does one ABSOLUTELY KNOW that someone else is "fully vaccinated?" How does a business KNOW, FOR SURE that that customer is vaccinated? Most folks who moronically assign a political meaning to masking are the types to refuse vaccination/lie about getting one.

They could/should have differentiated between public spaces and private spaces for maskless gatherings, OR put in language urging businesses to maintain mask guidelines, without MANDATING them. We're only at ~35% fully vaccinated, which means that there are still plenty of fat fuck 'muricans for COVID to feast upon. And to create new variants.

 

At best, this is only going to create confusion and "mask Karens" everywhere. At worst, this can fuck up our progress on this pandemic.

Agreed.

 

Some states like North Carolina had created a tiered incentive system where the state reopening was based on vaccination levels. It created obvious rewards for vaccine hold outs. The day after the CDC made their change, North Carolina lifted all masking and capacity restrictions. Now there's no incentive for the hesitant to get vaccinated.

Many suburban Chicago towns are lifting masks. So are some big national chains. And if there's some bad variant that pops up that we need to counteract, it'll be extremely difficult to reverse this.

Lots of downside, and little upside at a point when barely more than a third of the country is fully vaccinated and 49 million people still aren't even eligible for months. Hell, they didn't even wait for five or six weeks after general availability for 16+.

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12 hours ago, greg775 said:

handled

 

11 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

This was amongst the most ignorant of all of the covid conspiracies.  Did anyone stop and think that the things being done to prevent covid, such as masks and social distancing,  would have a major reduction affect on the way less virulent flu strains? It seems really obvious if you pull your head out the Q-niverse.

If the flu has reduced this much I'm surprised nobody has suggested masks during flu season and social distancing cause the flu is a killer as well. I know a woman who died of the flu after getting dehydrated (a couple years ago) leaving 2 young kids. So fricking sad.

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Posted (edited)
19 hours ago, greg775 said:

Most of the Karens have been scared to death by the "experts" the past 13 months. Now that the experts are saying it's OK to discard the masks and the masks are 100 percent not needed if u are vaccinated, the Karens for some reason have become the experts. They don't want to shed the masks.

Greg, you clearly have no clue, or are (once again) deliberately pretending that you have no clue. So, here, I'll help you:

Look up "Mask Karen" here

7 hours ago, greg775 said:

If the flu has reduced this much I'm surprised nobody has suggested masks during flu season and social distancing cause the flu is a killer as well.

Greg, remember how you lost your shit about wearing a mask a year ago? Remember how you bitched about how "you couldn't breathe" with a mask?

Remember how you whined about social distancing, and not being able to go to your favorite places at the beginning of the pandemic?

Now, multiply that across millions of ignoramuses who b**** about "mah freedums," and you tell us how that would work for flu seasons. After all, the assholes on your favorite network tell you how your freedums are being taken away by radical leftist socialists all day. (And deliberately make you stupider.)

Edited by Two-Gun Pete

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7 hours ago, greg775 said:

 

If the flu has reduced this much I'm surprised nobody has suggested masks during flu season and social distancing cause the flu is a killer as well. I know a woman who died of the flu after getting dehydrated (a couple years ago) leaving 2 young kids. So fricking sad.

After watching how people have responded to being asked to wear a mask when a rampant fast spreading Covid was crossing the United States, how well do you think it would go over to recommend the same thing for the yearly flu?  Better?

I have seen people who are high risk wearing masks prior to the pandemic.  People let them do it, nobody was harassed, it was fine. 

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7 hours ago, greg775 said:

 

If the flu has reduced this much I'm surprised nobody has suggested masks during flu season and social distancing cause the flu is a killer as well. I know a woman who died of the flu after getting dehydrated (a couple years ago) leaving 2 young kids. So fricking sad.

The rest of the world masks up during flu season and illness, especially the far East. Americans get pissed when you ask them to wash their hands.  Guidance has suggested things like this forever,  but our freedom to kill people is way more important. 

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20 hours ago, greg775 said:

Most of the Karens have been scared to death by the "experts" the past 13 months. Now that the experts are saying it's OK to discard the masks and the masks are 100 percent not needed if u are vaccinated, the Karens for some reason have become the experts. They don't want to shed the masks.

I know COVID is really bad; I get it. But this all has been handled so poorly. If you are vaxxed you don't need a mask, period. ... Out of all my shake my head in disgust moments during COVID, I'd like to know what the hell happened to the flu bug. Is it gone forever? Were there literally no flu cases/deaths this past winter? Makes u wonder if we've had weird viruses for years now since the flu apparently has been taken care of. Never a word about a case of flu anymore.

Probably because Covid is 4-6X deadlier...especially if you account for the new strains in India, South Africa, Brazil, Nepal, etc.

Australia had a strong initial response and still won’t have open borders until the middle of 2022.

India is undercounting or overwhelmed to a factor of 4-6 times publicly announced numbers, and will end up conservatively with 1.2-1.8 million dead at the slow rate things are going with vaccine production and distribution.

Remember, 70% of the world’s drugs are manufactured in India, and the Chinese halted flights of the critical vaccine ingredients into the supply chain for a number of weeks in order to protect their own pilots/crews/country-wide permeable borders.

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I went to a Wal-Mart and a local grocery store over the weekend after the "no-mask for the vaccinated" policy came out. Still saw probably 99% of the people wearing masks. 

I didn't see anything specific at Wal-Mart mentioning not needing to wear a mask but the grocery store had a small sign on the door saying they were recommended but not required if you are fully vaccinated. I think it's going to take a little bit of time for the news to get around to everyone and for people that have been wearing them all this time to actually stop wearing them.

I'm fully vaccinated and still wore mine. Of course there are plenty of people that seem to "forget" their mask and have continued to "forget" it for the past year now. At least according to my wife who works retail. So nothing will change for them.

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On 5/16/2021 at 9:32 AM, Two-Gun Pete said:

I think they screwed the pooch on this one. In effect, they want Americans to go on the honor system. IOW, how, exactly does one ABSOLUTELY KNOW that someone else is "fully vaccinated?" How does a business KNOW, FOR SURE that that customer is vaccinated? Most folks who moronically assign a political meaning to masking are the types to refuse vaccination/lie about getting one.

They could/should have differentiated between public spaces and private spaces for maskless gatherings, OR put in language urging businesses to maintain mask guidelines, without MANDATING them. We're only at ~35% fully vaccinated, which means that there are still plenty of fat fuck 'muricans for COVID to feast upon. And to create new variants.

 

At best, this is only going to create confusion and "mask Karens" everywhere. At worst, this can fuck up our progress on this pandemic.

Few questions:

Do you think those who are unvaccinated, given more time, would get vaccinated? aka - do you believe it's about opportunity?

If yes, how much more time should be given to have those people get a vaccine?

If no, what is the purpose? 

Aren't we trying to get towards herd immunity? There's several ways to reach that, one of which is people voluntarily taking a vaccine. The other is through contracting the virus and vaccines. 

Do you believe variants are obsolete in a scenario of high percentages of the vaccine?

 

My personal take:

You're only going to have a certain percentage of the population going out to take a vaccine. You can lead a horse to water, but when the CDC employees are only 60% vaccinated at this point? Do you really think you'll get more participation than that across the entire spectrum of the US when the CDC can't even get above 60%?

So at a certain point you say okay, we did our best, we gave an opportunity for those who wanted to take advantage. Those who don't we have more than ample hospital capacity, a plan of how to keep deaths low, and we need to open up and get life back to normal so we don't continue the irreversible economic issues that will ultimately come from this. Those people may contract, but it's just another avenue to herd immunity. 

In regards to variants - get used to it. Every strand will have variants and we live in a global world. Unless somehow you're reaching herd immunity across the globe (you're not) then it all makes it way around the globe. I mean, that's how covid started in the first place. If you have any borders open (you do, and you will) then eventually someone from India goes to the UK and someone from the UK to US. Or someone from China to Japan, Japan to Europe, Europe to Canada, etc. etc. etc. You're not stopping variants. This is life. We will have flu like shots to attack the top variants. 

 

Basically to say -- open up. We can't treat the world as no child left behind. Everybody who wants a shot can go to CVS within 48 hours. It's accessible to everybody who is interested and those who haven't got it yet, aren't likely to get it. 

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Posted (edited)

We have something like 57% that has their first shot and several million people age 12-15 that just became eligible. It takes over a month from your first shot to be fully vaccinated. Why not wait until you're at least 5-6 weeks out from general availability so that everyone who wanted a shot right out of the gate had time to become fully vaccinated? Why not allow the incentivized reopening metrics that states like North Carolina had announced some time to work to see if they could convince the hesitant to get their shots to get the state as a whole to the next tier? 

 

11 hours ago, greg775 said:

 

If the flu has reduced this much I'm surprised nobody has suggested masks during flu season and social distancing cause the flu is a killer as well. I know a woman who died of the flu after getting dehydrated (a couple years ago) leaving 2 young kids. So fricking sad.

Here's the CDC data on the '19/20 flu season:

Final 2019/20 Flu Numbers

The final data on flu season 2019/2020 was released by the CDC in April as COVID-19 continued to spread throughout the United States.

Between October 1, 2019 and April 4, 2020, the flu resulted in:

  • 39 to 56 million illnesses
  • 410,000 to 740,000 hospitalizations
  • 24,000 to 62,000 deaths
  • 195 pediatric deaths

 

Compare to the 2021 season from October '20 until last week:

 

Hospitalization Rates - Hospitalization rates are the number of hospitalizations based on the number of positive cases. A total of 226 laboratory-confirmed influenza-associated hospitalizations were reported by FluSurv-NET sites in 14 states between October 1, 2020 and this week for an overall cumulative hospitalization rate of 0.8 per 100,000 population.

Pediatric Deaths - Pediatric deaths are the number of deaths of people under the age of 18. In 2019/20, there were 195 pediatric deaths. There has been one pediatric death during the 2020/21 season so far.

We absolutely crushed flu season last year with masking and distancing. There have been only 1,848 confirmed cases of influenza for this entire season.

Edited by StrangeSox

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, BrianAnderson said:

Few questions:

Do you think those who are unvaccinated, given more time, would get vaccinated? aka - do you believe it's about opportunity?

If yes, how much more time should be given to have those people get a vaccine?

If no, what is the purpose? 

Aren't we trying to get towards herd immunity? There's several ways to reach that, one of which is people voluntarily taking a vaccine. The other is through contracting the virus and vaccines. 

Do you believe variants are obsolete in a scenario of high percentages of the vaccine?

 

My personal take:

You're only going to have a certain percentage of the population going out to take a vaccine. You can lead a horse to water, but when the CDC employees are only 60% vaccinated at this point? Do you really think you'll get more participation than that across the entire spectrum of the US when the CDC can't even get above 60%?

So at a certain point you say okay, we did our best, we gave an opportunity for those who wanted to take advantage. Those who don't we have more than ample hospital capacity, a plan of how to keep deaths low, and we need to open up and get life back to normal so we don't continue the irreversible economic issues that will ultimately come from this. Those people may contract, but it's just another avenue to herd immunity. 

In regards to variants - get used to it. Every strand will have variants and we live in a global world. Unless somehow you're reaching herd immunity across the globe (you're not) then it all makes it way around the globe. I mean, that's how covid started in the first place. If you have any borders open (you do, and you will) then eventually someone from India goes to the UK and someone from the UK to US. Or someone from China to Japan, Japan to Europe, Europe to Canada, etc. etc. etc. You're not stopping variants. This is life. We will have flu like shots to attack the top variants. 

 

Basically to say -- open up. We can't treat the world as no child left behind. Everybody who wants a shot can go to CVS within 48 hours. It's accessible to everybody who is interested and those who haven't got it yet, aren't likely to get it. 

Look, in no way am I debating the medical science, as you appear to be doing here. Open? Don't open? Whatever the public health science says is, is what it should be.

 

I take issue with the shitty application of SOCIAL science with respect to this announcement:

1. NO ONE was privy to the decision, not even Biden, prior to the announcement. How, exactly are policies supposed to be INTELLIGENTLY crafted, with ZERO foreknowledge? How are state/county/local governments supposed to gear up? How are businesses supposed to adapt their practices? How is anyone supposed to know who is vaccinated?

2. The whipsaw back-and-forth issuance of decrees is confusing to the public: A month ago, vaccinated people could gather in small groups unmasked. TODAY? We're all on the fucking honor system, and fuck any sort of burden of proof!

3. In society, we don't give out bonuses to citizens when they follow the rules, we PUNISH offenders, whether its a speeding ticket, all the way up to serial murder. But there's a burden of proof to penalize. With this stoopud fucking Honor System announcement, exactly WHO will fess up to being unvaccinated? WHO, exactly, will tell the truth?

What Dr. Walensky has moronically done is to punish those of us who follow the rules. Or young children, for whom no vaccine yet exists. Or for families who HAVE young, unvaccinated children. And what if there's a variant out there for which we now have neither a vaccine, nor treatment? HOW will Dr. Dumbass get the American populace to believe what the CDC is selling in the future?

Or if we have to go back to masking, HOW will Dr. Dumbass get the red hat types that watch what Greg watches to buy in? 

 

In effect, you're asking, "should we open up, yes or no?" I don't believe this is the right question to ask here. Instead, I believe that we should have asked, "HOW should we open up?"

 

For me, this harebrained announcement by the CDC will be seen as a major fuckup. Were I Biden, I would ask for Walensky's resignation, as well as the resignations of any of the imbeciles who helped her come up with this announcement, AND failed to inform Biden beforehand. NOT for political purposes, but for POLICY/messaging purposes, so that we as a people can model proper behaviors going forward.

Edited by Two-Gun Pete
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2 hours ago, StrangeSox said:

We have something like 57% that has their first shot and several million people age 12-15 that just became eligible. It takes over a month from your first shot to be fully vaccinated. Why not wait until you're at least 5-6 weeks out from general availability so that everyone who wanted a shot right out of the gate had time to become fully vaccinated? Why not allow the incentivized reopening metrics that states like North Carolina had announced some time to work to see if they could convince the hesitant to get their shots to get the state as a whole to the next tier? 

Totally agree with all of this.

Why wasn't there some "lead time" to release this announcement? Why wasn't the statement that Walensky gave more thoroughly vetted?

Masking has been a reasonably-effective measure that for some is a carrot, whereas a stick for others. Why not use this "carrot-and-stick" to get us further along in terms of vaccination rates?

 

Nope! Rip off that band-aid, and go with the time-tested Honor System!

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, Two-Gun Pete said:

Greg, you clearly have no clue, or are (once again) deliberately pretending that you have no clue. So, here, I'll help you:

Look up "Mask Karen" here

Greg, remember how you lost your shit about wearing a mask a year ago? Remember how you bitched about how "you couldn't breathe" with a mask?

Remember how you whined about social distancing, and not being able to go to your favorite places at the beginning of the pandemic?

 Now, multiply that across millions of ignoramuses who b**** about "mah freedums," and you tell us how that would work for flu seasons. After all, the assholes on your favorite network tell you how your freedums are being taken away by radical leftist socialists all day. (And deliberately make you stupider.)

Yeah I forgot about the breathing issue with the mask. I ended up pulling it down when applicable to get some good ol fashioned gasps of air. ... I wasn't necessarily advocating for masks during flu season, just thinking out loud that since flu has not been discussed it might be popular in the future to mask up.

I have done my part in telling a lot of people I had no symptoms after either vaccine shot (knock on wood) and stress NO SYMPTOMS. I am a fan of herd immunity thru vaccination.

Edited by greg775

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Posted (edited)
42 minutes ago, Two-Gun Pete said:

Or if we have to go back to masking, HOW will Dr. Dumbass get the red hat types that watch what Greg watches to buy in? 

There are people like me who watch FOX News who have gotten the vaccine (me, two shots) and mask up (me). ...

It's not good to pat yourself on the back on here, but say what u want about Greg, I like to be EDUCATED. For instance, I listen to Stern every day in the car and Howard is VERY VERY liberal and very much into masks/lockdowns, etc. I don't despise Howard for it. I enjoy listening to all points of view. I do. True I can't take The View anymore and can't take Cuomo's show or Lemon's anymore (just as many of you can't take Hannity or Tucker or the late Rush), but as I told everybody I at least call up the Fox News website AND CNN website every single day a few times a day to see the two different takes on the news. I find the differences remarkable and entertaining.

One of our problems in USA in my opinion is so many people REFUSE to consider discussing the other side of the fence. There are intelligent people who also are conservative. I know we can't get along in America anymore, that's long passed, but some of us think that's a BAD thing.

I recommend the vaccine.

Edited by greg775

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1 hour ago, Two-Gun Pete said:

1. NO ONE was privy to the decision, not even Biden, prior to the announcement. How, exactly are policies supposed to be INTELLIGENTLY crafted, with ZERO foreknowledge? How are state/county/local governments supposed to gear up? How are businesses supposed to adapt their practices? How is anyone supposed to know who is vaccinated?

2. The whipsaw back-and-forth issuance of decrees is confusing to the public: A month ago, vaccinated people could gather in small groups unmasked. TODAY? We're all on the fucking honor system, and fuck any sort of burden of proof!

3. In society, we don't give out bonuses to citizens when they follow the rules, we PUNISH offenders, whether its a speeding ticket, all the way up to serial murder. But there's a burden of proof to penalize. With this stoopud fucking Honor System announcement, exactly WHO will fess up to being unvaccinated? WHO, exactly, will tell the truth?

What Dr. Walensky has moronically done is to punish those of us who follow the rules. Or young children, for whom no vaccine yet exists. Or for families who HAVE young, unvaccinated children. And what if there's a variant out there for which we now have neither a vaccine, nor treatment? HOW will Dr. Dumbass get the American populace to believe what the CDC is selling in the future?

Or if we have to go back to masking, HOW will Dr. Dumbass get the red hat types that watch what Greg watches to buy in? 

 i'm just looking at the context clues of what is being told and how they enact. I'd highly doubt Biden isn't in daily contact in regards to this stuff.  State/County/Local and fed are separate. CDC is guidelines/recommendations. Each state has it's own rights and laws and rules they can try to enforce. Take marijuana for example. Federally not legal. State by states make their decision. CDC just says what they say and then the states can make their own rules. AKA how Texas has or how Illinois has. its based on local feedback from constituents, data, etc. (or ideally how it's supposed to be).

On point 2 - I wouldn't exactly take what they say at face value. The science and studies have been there to where what they are saying now is right. However, as a point to the rest of your post, what is the incentive if to get the vaccine if you don't take away the freedoms? So they take them away and try and tell you can have them back if you get the vaccine. That works for a good amount of the population, but they see the numbers. They know how many vaccines are going out the door and how many are being returned. At a certain point you have the amount of society that is going to get the vaccination, vaccinated. The other 30-40% aren't going to. Unless we go full on sci-fi movie, you're not getting those people. So it's basically do you lock down indefinitely trying to convince maybe another 10% to get it, or do you change course? They changed course because it is now convenient to change course. They've done what they can. It goes back to how they handled this in the beginning - they said no masks because they wanted hospital workers and front line workers to have the ability to get them. They told a lie they thought would help them, and then reversed case. This is no different. They gave the time for those who wanted to get the vaccination the ability to get it. now they know they're not going to get a significant increase, so it's time to open and do the rest by herd immunity. Is it confusing to the public? Yes sure. I'd say it is. was it handled right? hell no. why? well it's hard to get 300mm people on the same page. It's hard to get people to do their own research and make informed decisions. so people take the watered down version via news. unfortunately the water trickles down the pipe into red or blue for A LOT of people. which in turn makes it even harder to try and get people on a same page. so they resort to what i'd call "white lies". Basically just trying to help the most amount of people they can. 

The honor system? I mean, what's the other option? It's the lesser of the evil's right? You can do a smart phone, app, card, etc. Tell those who aren't vaccinated they can't go to the grocery store, a sox game, a concert without it. But the burden of proof on the gate keepers at these private businesses to enforce ... I don't see how that ends up going very smoothly. Forcing people to show their vaccination? It starts again turning into a sci-fi movie/black mirror episode. Look how well a mask went ... now you're telling someone they have to inject something into their body and show proof of it to go do every day tasks? That's not going to go well. If you want more divide that's the path. 

At the end of the day, those who are vaccinated should feel good that they are vaccinated. They've protected themselves. People can't worry about what others did. the data and facts are out there and if you aren't vaccinated the risks are clear. everybody is an adult and we're never going to all row in the same direction. Just not how life works. so you take solace in your decision and move forward. For kids? I mean what's the risk? mask them if you'd like, but go look up harvard studies ... kids aren't spreading very much, the overwhelming majority will have no symptoms, some will have few symptoms. And very, very, very few will get sick enough to go to a hospital - about 80 per million. That number is about 500 per million of adults who are vaccinated (CDC) will end up in the hospital post covid vaccine (post 21 days out -- so not people who had covid before their vaccine shot). So just looking at it as a math equation - unvaccinated children are actually more safe (both are generally thought not to transmit very much, both are generally mild symptoms, kids much less hospital/sick rate) than vaccinated adults. 

These aren't arguments against what you're saying. You're free to have your thoughts - my points are we just need more people going on the CDC websites, pulling the data, and making their own informed decisions of what's best for their own families. trying to hammer others into submission has never worked in a very diverse society and this will be no different.

Eventually we move on.

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My high school of just over 3,000 students has their graduation at the Alamo Dome. We were just informed that the [previous announced restrictions of each graduate being limited to six mask wearing guests has been lifted. We will have unlimited seating without masks. 

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13 hours ago, StrangeSox said:

 

 

 

I never thought about that as a reason but that's definitely something we are really bad at in this country. It's sad that people can't take care of themselves simply because they are afraid they will miss work and/or lose their jobs because of it.

My company is amazing about taking time off for stuff and for the vaccine they basically said go get it and don't worry about taking time off for it. I got both my shots in the afternoon with no problem. I didn't have any symptoms but if I did I could've easily worked from home for a day or 2. I know a lot of people don't have that luxury.

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43 minutes ago, Iwritecode said:

I never thought about that as a reason but that's definitely something we are really bad at in this country. It's sad that people can't take care of themselves simply because they are afraid they will miss work and/or lose their jobs because of it.

My company is amazing about taking time off for stuff and for the vaccine they basically said go get it and don't worry about taking time off for it. I got both my shots in the afternoon with no problem. I didn't have any symptoms but if I did I could've easily worked from home for a day or 2. I know a lot of people don't have that luxury.

At an old job, I once had a partial seizure. I never lost consciousness, but I suddenly lost all focus in my eyes, slurred my speech and got extremely cold followed by immediate sweating and feeling like I was burning up. Like, all in a minute. A few minutes later the haze lifted and I was tired, but in a decent working capacity.

One editor got me some water and wanted me to go home, but the person above her had me stay because we were doing special coverage of a massive event. 

We don't value health in this country.

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Had my second Oxford Astra Zeneca jab yesterday no reaction to either , my wife has had her two Pfizer and so has my son as they work in the NHS , daughter 29 had her first Pfizer today .

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Posted (edited)
On 5/18/2021 at 11:45 AM, Quin said:

At an old job, I once had a partial seizure. I never lost consciousness, but I suddenly lost all focus in my eyes, slurred my speech and got extremely cold followed by immediate sweating and feeling like I was burning up. Like, all in a minute. A few minutes later the haze lifted and I was tired, but in a decent working capacity.

One editor got me some water and wanted me to go home, but the person above her had me stay because we were doing special coverage of a massive event. 

We don't value health in this country.

Somebody told u to keep working. Awful. I wish u could sue and win. That supervisor was wrong and out of line. Sad.

Edited by greg775

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On 5/17/2021 at 8:14 AM, southsider2k5 said:

The rest of the world masks up during flu season and illness, especially the far East. Americans get pissed when you ask them to wash their hands.  Guidance has suggested things like this forever,  but our freedom to kill people is way more important. 

Do you have any statistic for this? I'd be interested in reading it to see how we compare to other countries. Is it common in Europe and South America?

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