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Pandemic Realignment: Sox in the Cactus League West

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4 hours ago, Y2Jimmy0 said:

4 playoff teams doesn't make any sense financially. The playoffs are expanding and this is the trial balloon. My guess is 7 playoff teams in each league. Three 1st round series and a bye. The owners need the television revenue that extra playoffs will provide if they carve 60-70 games off the schedule and don't have fans in the stands. Less playoffs isn't an option. 

I'm cool with this for sure. My point was that I feel there's no need for divisions if we'd be going with Cactus and Grapefruit leagues. Everyone is already extremely close to each other. Take the top 4, 6, 7, whatever of each league and have a playoff, then have the Cactus League champion play the Grapefruit League champion.

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8 minutes ago, WilliamTell said:

I'm cool with this for sure. My point was that I feel there's no need for divisions if we'd be going with Cactus and Grapefruit leagues. Everyone is already extremely close to each other. Take the top 4, 6, 7, whatever of each league and have a playoff, then have the Cactus League champion play the Grapefruit League champion.

I agree with you. Everybody in each league plays each other as equally as possible. The top  7 or 8 in each league make the playoffs. This is alot but they have to keep fans watching all year to make money. 

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1 minute ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

I don't think this will hapen. Too many teams will lose too much money. 

It's going to be like that for all the major sports. There's rumors going on now that the NHL for example may have to drop the salary cap numbers significantly because of the revenue they'll lose with this virus (they likely won't finish out their season/playoffs and possibly beginning of next season).

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23 minutes ago, SoxAce said:

It's going to be like that for all the major sports. There's rumors going on now that the NHL for example may have to drop the salary cap numbers significantly because of the revenue they'll lose with this virus (they likely won't finish out their season/playoffs and possibly beginning of next season).

If there's some way to make this work, the union and the owners will get to choose rapidly between figuring out a way to make the revenue split work or having 0 revenue while they discuss it.

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Maybe consider picking up the season around July 1 just as it was scheduled..  Allow up to 10,000 fans in with two seat spacing between them.

Honor 6 ft. personal spacing in all lines for concessions and in the washrooms.

Fans get checked in at the gate only if they have current, verified, negative Corona tests.

I know, stupid idea..but the Arizona/Florida  thing is even dumber.

I just read that McCann, Keuchel  and others do not like the idea of being quarantined away from family. That's another issue.

Maybe this season is toast and people just cannot come to grips with that yet.

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2 hours ago, tray said:

Maybe consider picking up the season around July 1 just as it was scheduled..  Allow up to 10,000 fans in with two seat spacing between them.

Honor 6 ft. personal spacing in all lines for concessions and in the washrooms.

Fans get checked in at the gate only if they have current, verified, negative Corona tests.

I know, stupid idea..but the Arizona/Florida  thing is even dumber.

I just read that McCann, Keuchel  and others do not like the idea of being quarantined away from family. That's another issue.

Maybe this season is toast and people just cannot come to grips with that yet.

It was the minute shit hit the fan in North America. We can only hope that the NFL/NHL/NBA run this fall. I've yet to see an MLB proposal that doesn't have serious issues. 

I find it hard to see how any league could operate before August, and that's if everything goes perfectly. It's hard to envision the NFL running just because of the number of people involved. It's going to be hard to see pro sports return until large gatherings are allowed again, because even with no fans, to run pro sports involves enough people for it to be a large gathering. 

Edited by Jack Parkman

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The NFL can play games with no fans because the TV money is so large.  Small market baseball teams would lose millions because the TV revenue doesn't come close to meeting payroll.  The only way it could work is if teams agree to revenue sharing or players take a severe pay cut.  Neither is going to happen.  

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5 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

The NFL can play games with no fans because the TV money is so large.  Small market baseball teams would lose millions because the TV revenue doesn't come close to meeting payroll.  The only way it could work is if teams agree to revenue sharing or players take a severe pay cut.  Neither is going to happen.  

If you could find a way to get these leagues going right now, you could do a rapid negotiation with the major networks for the content and, with so little competition on the airwaves (HORSE Still needs Bird and Jordan), there's a fortune to be made. 

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3 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

If you could find a way to get these leagues going right now, you could do a rapid negotiation with the major networks for the content and, with so little competition on the airwaves (HORSE Still needs Bird and Jordan), there's a fortune to be made. 

Shit, play the cards right and you could have some days where half the league is on national TV. When was the last time that happened for major league baseball?

People are content starved.

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11 hours ago, Jack Parkman said:

It was the minute shit hit the fan in North America. We can only hope that the NFL/NHL/NBA run this fall. I've yet to see an MLB proposal that doesn't have serious issues. 

I find it hard to see how any league could operate before August, and that's if everything goes perfectly. It's hard to envision the NFL running just because of the number of people involved. It's going to be hard to see pro sports return until large gatherings are allowed again, because even with no fans, to run pro sports involves enough people for it to be a large gathering. 

The season wasn't canceled as soon as this happened. Stop being ridiculous. There is absolutely a chance that there's no baseball this year. It's April 15th though and the owners and players are committed to playing. Like I've said, these guys aren't getting paid unless they play. I'm fairly certain they will play in some fashion. There won't be fans in the stands but that's obvious at this point. Canceling outright makes the least amount of sense of all these ideas and people are choosing to not read and pay attention to what's being talked about. 

11 hours ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

The NFL can play games with no fans because the TV money is so large.  Small market baseball teams would lose millions because the TV revenue doesn't come close to meeting payroll.  The only way it could work is if teams agree to revenue sharing or players take a severe pay cut.  Neither is going to happen.  

They wouldn't lose as much as they'd lose by missing an entire season. Players will be taking a cut on top of prorated salaries. And they'll take it because it's better than not getting paid at all. 

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6 minutes ago, Y2Jimmy0 said:

The season wasn't canceled as soon as this happened. Stop being ridiculous. There is absolutely a chance that there's no baseball this year. It's April 15th though and the owners and players are committed to playing. Like I've said, these guys aren't getting paid unless they play. I'm fairly certain they will play in some fashion. There won't be fans in the stands but that's obvious at this point. Canceling outright makes the least amount of sense of all these ideas and people are choosing to not read and pay attention to what's being talked about. 

They wouldn't lose as much as they'd lose by missing an entire season. Players will be taking a cut on top of prorated salaries. And they'll take it because it's better than not getting paid at all. 

With states now talking about how to get things going again, I'm starting to feel better about seeing baseball in some form this year.  It will be very different, but it will be baseball.  I think we can forget about fans in the stands.

I find it interesting that MLB has volunteered to be involved in the antibody testing.  I wonder if this is part of their plan to return to the field.

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10 minutes ago, Y2Jimmy0 said:
11 hours ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

The NFL can play games with no fans because the TV money is so large.  Small market baseball teams would lose millions because the TV revenue doesn't come close to meeting payroll.  The only way it could work is if teams agree to revenue sharing or players take a severe pay cut.  Neither is going to happen.  

They wouldn't lose as much as they'd lose by missing an entire season. Players will be taking a cut on top of prorated salaries. And they'll take it because it's better than not getting paid at all. 

Teams are losing revenue now but teams with bad TV contracts would lose real money under this scenario.  If a team has $100M payrolls and $50M in TV contracts they would lose $25M.  Sure the big market teams will be fine but teams like Tampa, KC, Oakland, etc can't do it and the players already said they will not take a pay cut.    

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22 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

Teams are losing revenue now but teams with bad TV contracts would lose real money under this scenario.  If a team has $100M payrolls and $50M in TV contracts they would lose $25M.  Sure the big market teams will be fine but teams like Tampa, KC, Oakland, etc can't do it and the players already said they will not take a pay cut.    

So you think they'd rather play no games and not get paid at all than take a pay cut to play some games? I'm pretty sure the players union will vote to play. We'll see though I guess 

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The league is going to make sure the league is taken care of. There will certainly be revenue sharing, but baseball will certainly get more requests for national games than is typical, and hopefully real advertising revenue would show up on networks for that.

The financial stuff to overcome doesn't seem like much of a hurtle because there isn't much alternative. It is what it is now, the keeping players and employees healthy is much more difficult than the revenue splits.

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22 minutes ago, Y2Jimmy0 said:

So you think they'd rather play no games and not get paid at all than take a pay cut to play some games? I'm pretty sure the players union will vote to play. We'll see though I guess 

All players take a paycut?  Even Dodger players when the organization makes $1B in TV revenue?  

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2 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

All players take a paycut?  Even Dodger players when the organization makes $1B in TV revenue?  

Their pay will be scaled by what percentage of the season they play.  I am sure their revenue deals will be as well.

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7 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Their pay will be scaled by what percentage of the season they play.  I am sure their revenue deals will be as well.

Of course but the Dodgers will still make tons of money while small market teams will lose tons.  I guess there's a chance for a compromise but if history tells us anything it's that these guys are really bad at compromising.  

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28 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

Of course but the Dodgers will still make tons of money while small market teams will lose tons.  I guess there's a chance for a compromise but if history tells us anything it's that these guys are really bad at compromising.  

That is always the case.  This won't change that either way.  But Dodgers players will get the same cut that Tampa players will and vice versa.

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On 4/12/2020 at 2:10 PM, demonbluess said:

Traditionalist but this would be so much fun for 1 season.

I think given the unique circumstances of what is going on, I am 100% good throwing the traditions out the window and doing something unique this year. Heck, could turn into a thing where every 10 years MLB has a one-year shake-up type of deal.  I still think NBA should throw out its traditional format to some hybrid March Madness style format (with a caveat I would not have the final 4 a one-game elimination).  

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1 hour ago, Y2Jimmy0 said:

The season wasn't canceled as soon as this happened. Stop being ridiculous. There is absolutely a chance that there's no baseball this year. It's April 15th though and the owners and players are committed to playing. Like I've said, these guys aren't getting paid unless they play. I'm fairly certain they will play in some fashion. There won't be fans in the stands but that's obvious at this point. Canceling outright makes the least amount of sense of all these ideas and people are choosing to not read and pay attention to what's being talked about. 

They wouldn't lose as much as they'd lose by missing an entire season. Players will be taking a cut on top of prorated salaries. And they'll take it because it's better than not getting paid at all. 

Agreed with you and MLB has deep coffers, they can figure something out. I would suspect sports will see upticks in ratings as well and globally you could see a resurgence in baseball if they could pull it off and truly be one of the main distractions for a nation going through a unique event.  

Wouldn't any of us do the same? 

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10 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

That is always the case.  This won't change that either way.  But Dodgers players will get the same cut that Tampa players will and vice versa.

Are the Dodgers owners also taking a paycut?

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2 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

Are the Dodgers owners also taking a paycut?

I'm not going to defend billionaires but yeah. They aren't getting the close to 40% of revenue that they would otherwise from attendance, concessions etc. 

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I guess I just don't see how you could keep the players and staff healthy. I also don't think that playing games in Arizona and Florida in July and August without having domed stadiums is possible due to the weather in both spots (heat/humidity in AZ, rain in FL)

All it takes is for one person to get sick again and sports are shut down yet again. It's more likely than not that they attempt to play but someone gets sick a week or two into resumption and then the remainder is canceled. 

Read this article about why Sports aren't coming back any time soon: 

https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/04/10/sports-arent-coming-back-soon

Edited by Jack Parkman

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I think one thing being overlooked is the popularity baseball can gain, and stands to lose out on by not playing at all.  People talking about owners losing money by paying players' salaries while not gaining gate revenue are correct, but only in a short-term outlook. 

The gains from playing this season, especially when the presence of baseball on TV during these unusual times will certainly be  a major draw, will far outweigh the short-term losses of playing a single season with no gate revenue.  Playing baseball on TV this summer will help grow the sport for the long-term.

From the players' perspective, there are certainly some obstacles that make this quarantined season scenario unappealing, but the fact is that these guys will play when push comes to shove if it means getting paid vs. not getting paid at all.

I think with Fauci's comments today, combined with a desire of the MLB and MLBPA to play, that we will have baseball this season, albeit an unusual season.

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