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Indians will be no more

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2 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I'm going to bow out because you clearly just have no idea what you're talking about and you'll just deny until you die which is your right to do. 

America's broken education system has produced denialist like you in bulk.

I’m glad there is at least something we agree on. Although in this case a most unfortunate circumstance

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Just now, ChiSox1917 said:

What your describing happened to multiple ethnic groups at that time and was driven by doctors thinking it was the best case for poor girls. It happened to a lot of black women and poor rural whites as well. Absolutely despicable for all involved, but it wasnt limited to native americans. 

In that case it's all good as long as it happened to a few whites. 

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2 minutes ago, ChiSox1917 said:

What your describing happened to multiple ethnic groups at that time and was driven by doctors thinking it was the best case for poor girls. It happened to a lot of black women and poor rural whites as well. Absolutely despicable for all involved, but it wasnt limited to native americans. 

It was a program of the Bureau of Indian Affairs. BIA didn’t have anything to do with poor whites or black women. More denial

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2 minutes ago, Vulture said:

How do explain the government paying for scalps and forced sterilization then?You’re the one distorting history in order to appease the cognitive dissonance rattling around your brain. Trail of Tears was a death March. What next, navies weren’t committing genocide because a lot of people died of exposure. Gtfo

Explained forced sterilization which was a widespread issue.

paying for scalps...well we were pretty much at war with them for 100 years. Any guesses how many colonists scalps they took too?

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Two great reads for someone who actually wants to learn about what our ancestors did and the genocide they participated in :

8rAAAAA=

Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee: An Indian History of the American West by [Dee Brown, Hampton Sides]

"Not Genocide" just the systematic destruction of an entire group of people and their culture.

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6 minutes ago, ChiSox1917 said:

Explained forced sterilization which was a widespread issue.

paying for scalps...well we were pretty much at war with them for 100 years. Any guesses how many colonists scalps they took too?

So death marches, deliberate infection of disease, scalp bounties, systematic forced sterilization and removal from land doesn’t equate to genocide to you. Got. I guess this your little way of making America great again

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I admittedly wasn't a big reader when I was a kid (meaning I couldn't read a book if my life depended on it). When I hit my twenties, I actually read the first book I recommended above and I became infatuated with not just Native history, but with non-fiction tales that exposed the lies sold to us in our broken educational system. Today I focus more on economics and finance, and the exploitation of all of us - by a very select few - but I'll never forget the book that made me realize that I had been sold a crock of shit in school as a child; no different than how North Korea teach propagated history to their citizens. 

IDK if you haven't figured it out yet, but citing your middle school and elementary school history classes as your basis of expertise has already told on yourself without anyone ever having to respond.

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8 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Two great reads for someone who actually wants to learn about what our ancestors did and the genocide they participated in :

8rAAAAA=

Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee: An Indian History of the American West by [Dee Brown, Hampton Sides]

"Not Genocide" just the systematic destruction of an entire group of people and their culture.

I read the Dee Brown book. Quite informative.

 

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5 minutes ago, Vulture said:

So death marches, deliberate infection of disease, scalp bounties, systematic forced sterilization and removal from land doesn’t equate to genocide to you. Got. I guess this your little way of making America great again

god, you and little ray sure have a one sided view of history

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2 minutes ago, ChiSox1917 said:

god, you and little ray sure have a one sided view of history

And you have a whitewashed Americanized view of history.

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17 minutes ago, Vulture said:

It was a program of the Bureau of Indian Affairs. BIA didn’t have anything to do with poor whites or black women. More denial

It was done out of HHS. The same agency that did it to poor whites and blacks. 

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I am somewhat conversant about the Iroquois and their fascinating history. Not only were they in on the very first meeting of the colonies to discuss forming a new country, the US Articles of Confederation was loosely based upon their own government. NYS could easily have turned French without their support. Many of them were eventually run off to Canada but their Seneca tribe runs three casinos in WNY. They are also fairly litigious with NYS about pressing their treaty rights. Our shared US history was often about conning them into treaties to move them out of the way of settlers and later breaking that treaty.

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Great day, this is long overdue. 

Hopefully they'll go back to being the spiders and name the park after Sochalexis

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1 minute ago, ChiSox1917 said:

It was done out of HHS. The same agency that did it to poor whites and blacks. 

Bureau of Indian Affairs is what I am in fact referring to

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5 hours ago, Texsox said:

They should be the Cleveland Catholics. Have a priest as a mascot. During big moments have him come out with incense and Latin chants. Maybe recreate the crusades. Can you imagine him giving last rites during the 9th inning! That would be so awesome. Pope races during the 7th inning stretch. He could offer communion before the closer comes in. 

Dancing nuns as cheerleaders. 

"Terry Francona is taking Shane Beiber to the confessional after that shot to center . . ."
 

Just make sure that mascot stays away from the bat boys.

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5 hours ago, ChiSox1917 said:

Should Minnesota be forced to change the name of their football team that portrays nordic people of the past as warrior driven vikings, when in reality many were peaceful farmers?  How is that portrayal of a people any different than portraying Indians as great warriors? Do you think cleveland picked that name to demean natives? 
 

I dont care what hypersensitive, constantly offended people say or think. I cant imagine living life constantly worrying about that. Seems like an awful life. You act like all native americans are offended by the name, but even with the more offensive redskins name at most half were.  

It seems like you're the one that's the most "hypersensitive" here. For some reason you're offended. I can't fathom why. 

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5 hours ago, ChiSox1917 said:

I dont care what hypersensitive, constantly offended people say or think. I cant imagine living life constantly worrying about that. Seems like an awful life. You act like all native americans are offended by the name, but even with the more offensive redskins name at most half were.  

So why do you care what the team is called? 

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1 minute ago, Angel Hernandez said:

They will ban any DVD sales of Major League from now on.

Red herring; slippery slope fallacy rolled into one. The Cleveland Indian name wasn’t banned. “They” in this case is the Cleveland mlb franchise. Last I checked they have neither the means nor the authority to ban anything.  Please try to apply a minimal amount of rational thought at least

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Wow this is an intense thread. Finally caught up! If they want to change their name, let them. I too love their C and hopefully that stays. I wouldn't mind a color change since so many teams already rock the navy and red. (Red Sox, Braves, Nationals, Cardinals, Twins.) Go back to being the Cleveland Naps. Use Rip Van Winkle or some wizard like guy sleeping as your mascot. The perfect mascot if you have a bad team.

 

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1 hour ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I'm going to bow out because you clearly just have no idea what you're talking about and you'll just deny until you die which is your right to do. 

America's broken education system has produced denialist like you in bulk.

This guy really said "And hell america is easily one of the least racist in comparison"

The entire countries initial economy was built on racism. That racism existed well into the 1950's legally. I'd say give this book a read, but we know that won't happen:

61hJg5rSBNL._SX323_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg

Yeah, some people have invested so much of their lives in certain beliefs, when truth is presented, they become defensive of those beliefs because they can't be wrong, otherwise it was all a waste.  I got out of that way of thinking a long time ago thankfully. 

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48 minutes ago, supernuke said:

Just make sure that mascot stays away from the bat boys.

That's the Mascot Race for prizes!

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"I always think there's a vocal minority who basically needs to have a view to sound smart, and most of the time they're pretty fucking stupid. to be honest with you. Ya know the loudest people are never the smartest people, um, the ones that want to be heard because they want attention for some other set of reasons that come from their own psychology and insecurity. I think that anybody who spends the time to learn about anything always comes off as pretty moderate and boring because they tend to come to a balanced perspective. the more you learn, the more confusing things are so that the more, almost more conservative in the presentation of the facts one is. its when your just starting to learn about something and you think you can be heard that you start to spout off and frankly to the people who know more ... you sound like a dumbass"

- Chamath Palihapitiya

 

Again, I'll leave that there for ChiSox1917... it seems incredibly odd that you are so triggered by this whole conversation and think almost the whole thread can be summarized by this quote. 

 

On a separate note, I may use this as my "footer" for my profile. And may go post this in Slam under Covid and Election topics. I may even get it tattooed on my ass as a reminder. This is yogi berra type knowledge and insight. so simple, yet so profound. 

 

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Why don't we hit pause on this thread? This is really more Buster territory than baseball. 

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