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I like Joc more than Adam but is there really a significant enough amount of difference between them to warrant people being upset? If so, what is it? I'd rather spend my negative energy being upset we aren't likely going to significantly upgrade our rotation. 

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3 hours ago, EloyJenkins said:

The division has a ton of lefties. Sox mash lefties. Eaton hits lefties decent. Joc is the worst player in baseball against lefties.

I like Joc as a platoon, but people are making this sound like sox missed out on Springer. It's almost comical at this point. 

You just lost your own argument.  We don’t need a RF who can’t hit LHP (plus we have Engel), we need one who can crush RHP.  And Joc has been way better at that than Eaton historically.

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50 minutes ago, RagahRagah said:

I like Joc more than Adam but is there really a significant enough amount of difference between them to warrant people being upset? If so, what is it? I'd rather spend my negative energy being upset we aren't likely going to significantly upgrade our rotation. 

Over the last year, Joc was 0.4 fWAR better (although both were bad). Over the past 2 years, Joc was 1.0 fWAR better. Over the last 3 years, Joc was 1.8 fWAR better. While there is no guarantee when you're playing the weak part of the FA market, there has been a significant difference consistently over the last 3 seasons, since Eaton's major leg injury.

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My guess is that the White Sox offered both 1 year $7M.  Eaton took it and Joc waited 2 months to take the deal.  I assume Joc wanted multiple years and a higher AAV and caved today.

If Joc was offered a full time role than good for him.  Joc has his ring so this is the best situation for him to face LHP and get a bigger deal next year.

Everyone can piss and moan how great Joc is but this is a nothing deal that only a Sox message board would be up in arms about.

Joc is so awesome he got a one year $7M deal.

When Eloy goes on the DL Eaton can play against LHP and have some success Joc cannot.  In late August this board would b**** and moan about how bad Joc is against LHP and what an idiotic move this was.

 

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The "let's have a mediocre guy who can play against lefties AND righties instead of a platoon of guys that can crush one each" argument was lost before most of us were even born.

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2 minutes ago, Harry Chappas said:

My guess is that the White Sox offered both 1 year $7M.  Eaton took it and Joc waited 2 months to take the deal.  I assume Joc wanted multiple years and a higher AAV and caved today.

If Joc was offered a full time role than good for him.  Joc has his ring so this is the best situation for him to face LHP and get a bigger deal next year.

Everyone can piss and moan how great Joc is but this is a nothing deal that only a Sox message board would be up in arms about.

Joc is so awesome he got a one year $7M deal.

When Eloy goes on the DL Eaton can play against LHP and have some success Joc cannot.  In late August this board would b**** and moan about how bad Joc is against LHP and what an idiotic move this was.

 

There's wisdom in this post, which is that we don't know what the dynamics of negotiations were. Signing for x dollars in early December does not equal signing for x dollars in late January. The White Sox have been heavily rumored to be involved in both trading and signing Joc at different points; it's unlikely that they didn't make an attempt.

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2 minutes ago, Eminor3rd said:

The "let's have a mediocre guy who can play against lefties AND righties instead of a platoon of guys that can crush one each" argument was lost before most of us were even born.

from the sounds of it Joc doesn't want to be platooned. If you're Rick Hahn, that should be a deal breaker.

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1 minute ago, Dick Allen said:

from the sounds of it Joc doesn't want to be platooned. If you're Rick Hahn, that should be a deal breaker.

Very possible.

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2 hours ago, A-Train to 35th said:

All the drama being played out by this signing makes me laugh.

I've switched mindsets. Instead of being upset and confused as to why others are upset, I'm just going to be facetious.

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If it's true that he doesn't want to br platooned, then there's really nothing to be upset about.

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5 hours ago, EloyJenkins said:

I am willing to put up some sort of bet (not a ban bet) that Eaton will outperform Joc this season. Not homeruns, obviously, but if Joc is played everyday on the Cubs his numbers are going to be horrid. He is a platoon guy people. 

The last season in which Eaton had a higher fWAR than Joc was in 2016. Granted they've been close a few times, but recent production and age certainly points to Joc being a better player.

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54 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

from the sounds of it Joc doesn't want to be platooned. If you're Rick Hahn, that should be a deal breaker.

Why? 

The trash we have trotted out in RF is still worse than a guy who will hit well 70 percent of the time and hit poorly 30 percent of the time when we play lefties and we kill lefties anyway so the world isn't going to end if there is one guy in the lineup who won't do anything. You can put him 9th against lefties who cares.

And I don't want to hear that we should not be starting a platoon player everyday in RF during the championship window. If we were really in "championship window mode"we wouldn't be starting someone like a 32 year old Adam Eaton (who is in deep decline) either so that argument has been waived. 

Edited by SoCalChiSox
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49 minutes ago, ScooterMcGee said:

I've switched mindsets. Instead of being upset and confused as to why others are upset, I'm just going to be facetious.

I think part of it is people are annoyed that we presumably aren't going to be making ANY more acquisitions so every signing made by someone else is one not made by us, lol.

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19 minutes ago, RagahRagah said:

I think part of it is people are annoyed that we presumably aren't going to be making ANY more acquisitions so every signing made by someone else is one not made by us, lol.

No this board had Joc as a great fit for the Sox for a couple of years.  You could see the angst on this coming from a mile away.

That fact he signed for the same as Eaton is the topper yet he signed for the same as Eaton so while Eaton may not be worth $7M a year, Joc isn't worth much more..

  

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Even if you weren't going to sign Pederson because of a platoon thing or whatever, Joc has been better than Eaton and is substantially younger. At the very least, Eaton should be paid less than Joc.

If Eaton was being paid $4 million instead of $7 million, there is money right there to be able to afford a back end pitching acquisition.

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3 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Even if you weren't going to sign Pederson because of a platoon thing or whatever, Joc has been better than Eaton and is substantially younger. At the very least, Eaton should be paid less than Joc.

If Eaton was being paid $4 million instead of $7 million, there is money right there to be able to afford a back end pitching acquisition.

How long were the White Sox supposed to wait to do this? 

My guess is Joc was looking at 2/$20M when Eaton signed.

Same thing with pitching, should the Sox have waited on Yu, Musgrove, Tallion.......maybe but they need to make moves that get done. 

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Just now, Harry Chappas said:

How long were the White Sox supposed to wait to do this? 

My guess is Joc was looking at 2/$20M when Eaton signed.

Same thing with pitching, should the Sox have waited on Yu, Musgrove, Tallion.......maybe but they need to make moves that get done. 

January 29th would have apparently worked fine. Still weeks before spring training. 

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11 minutes ago, Harry Chappas said:

No this board had Joc as a great fit for the Sox for a couple of years.  You could see the angst on this coming from a mile away.

That fact he signed for the same as Eaton is the topper yet he signed for the same as Eaton so while Eaton may not be worth $7M a year, Joc isn't worth much more..

  

I mean this is true. But people can't have it both ways. 

In October I would have told you that Joc Pederson can be had for something like 1/$8-10 million or 2/$16 million.

In december, Adam Eaton signs for essentially 1/$8, was told pederson sucks, and that he was trying for a big contract like $12 million+.

In late January, he signs for 1/$7 million.

The posters complaining about people complaining now were the same that tried to shut people up who complained then by saying he was going to be a lot more expensive.

I think Joc Pederson is good and a great complement to sox lineup. I understand how eaton came to be. I'm sorry that it hurts people's brains to point out that sometimes players are better than we have, yet still not perfect players. 

It reminds me of when every marginal upgrade to 2b from 2017-2019 we'd hear that Yolmer Sanchez does the same thing. The idea that someone can be better but but amazing just destroys peoples brains it is so complicated.

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33 minutes ago, RagahRagah said:

I think part of it is people are annoyed that we presumably aren't going to be making ANY more acquisitions so every signing made by someone else is one not made by us, lol.

Agree. its like some are out for blood for any move even if means trading away our best young talent. idiotic if you ask me. 230 career hitters who can't hit a lefty to save his soul is not something we should be whining about. And why would Peterson sign with us to platoon when he can sign with a team where he plays everyday. Smart on his part

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2 minutes ago, Harry Chappas said:

How long were the White Sox supposed to wait to do this? 

My guess is Joc was looking at 2/$20M when Eaton signed.

Same thing with pitching, should the Sox have waited on Yu, Musgrove, Tallion.......maybe but they need to make moves that get done. 

And 2/20 would have been perfectly reasonable given that we need a bridge to Colas/Cespedes who can at the same time be a key contributor to the first part of the window. 

 

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12 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

January 29th would have apparently worked fine. Still weeks before spring training. 

And then it would have been an absolute shitstorm meltdown once Toronto signed Springer, because you know those rumors would have been heating the imaginary hot stove up to the highest setting, because the Sox would have not signed a right fielder yet. And then after all the bs speculation, they sign Joc, oh my word, can you imagine what the response would be? My computer would explode.

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Apparently the Sox did offer Pederson first, he said no, they signed Eaton, and Joc lost 3 million dollars. 

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