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I also don't trust Hahn to trade for players, or the organization to develop them. I frankly hope the Sox avoid "good players" altogether, and maybe think about burning down the stadium.

Fuck him.

no

this was always the plan, draft and collect high talent prospects while being fun-bad for a while, and then in a few years use that strategy as a way to put yourself into the comfortable financial position to sign guys like harper and other blue chip free agents and international signings did you think the Sox would turn into the marlins?

This is a long-time White Sox fan but a first-time poster. I am posting to express my dismay and how I disagree with the idea of non-tendering Avi Garcia. I don’t understand the why management would consider this on a guy who is under 30, and who is only one year away from batting .330. Other than Avi last season, when is the last time the White Sox had a guy bat .330? People on this forum dismiss that season, like it was some kind of fluke and this year we saw the “real” Avi. That seems illogical to me. I realize that for his first three years with the Sox he was a .250 hitter, but that .330 season was an entire season, not a hot month of July. He had 518 at bats that season, it seems to me that to carry that type of average over an entire season, that there has to be something there beyond luck and a hot streak. How can people accept that this season (when he was injured with various leg problems) is the “real” Avi; but that somehow his .236 average in 2018 in only 356 at bats is valid, and 2017 was a fluke. That seems completely illogical. And unless you believe he wasn’t injured and he and the Sox were just using that as an excuse, than that make the argument that .236 is the real Avi even more ludicrous. It will take 8 million to keep him. I say 100% pay it. It seems like a bargain to me, when you consider the potential he has to bounce back. Even if the the odds are small (which I completely disagree with), it still seems like a good bet when you consider the possible return. In the other thread, many people have commented that they don’t want him in our division because they don’t want to play against him 18 times because he has the potential to bounce back and be killing the ball again. It said in the MLB.com article that “he going through intense workout to get ready for a fully healthy return.” If this is true, which I think must be, I gotta believe we will see a healthy, trim Avi next year. And a healthy, trim(and motivated) Avi has the very real potential to hit at least .290 and hit 25 or so homers. Let’s talk about the money, the 8 million needed to keep Avi. When Nate Jones was resigned for 4.65 million, even though he has been hurt a ton the last two years and only pitched 42 innings in those last two years. The consensus on this board (which I agreed with) was, why not, 4.65 million is nothing, he’s worth the chance. If that is true, how can 8 million be a crazy amount to offer a guy who (once again) is under 30 and a year away from .330. The Sox paid 52 million for the Luis Robert because of his potential (which again, I agree with); but somehow, Avi’s potential (a year away from .330 and with 19 home runs this injured season) is not worth 8 million. That makes no sense. The Braves invested 23 million on Josh Donaldson who is 33 and this year batted .246 and had 8 homers in only 187 at bats because of injuries, but again, people think we should non-tender Avi rather than paying him 8 or so million. (I agree again) Everyone here wants the Sox to pay 35 to 40 million a year for Bryce Harper who batted .246 last year. Was .246 the real Harper? Of course not. So why is .236 for an injured Avi the real Avi? The Sox can certainly afford 8 million, this next year, so invest it in a player who, yes, was disappointing last year, but are our memories really that short???? Come on, let's pay this guy and give the White Sox a very real chance to get a very powerful bat back in the lineup.

People are on board with moving on because he's oft injured, is awful defensively and his 2017 performance was heavily inflated by his extraordinarily high BABIP.

Maybe I'm biased but I think Tim Anderson is better than Russell going forward anyway. Similar defense (if mid-May through the end of 2018 was no fluke then Tim is the better defender), similar offense (Tim with more power), and Tim with the big edge in speed/baserunning.

100% this / close thread.

Negative. I want to win, but I'm not ousting all-around great guy TA for a chronic wife-beater who is, at best, marginally better.

Zero interest in bringing that circus in.

Not sure what your definition of generational talent is. Machado so far is a .282 lifetime batter after 7 seasons. He is an excellent defensive player. Has never won an MVP. Machado usually is a Top 10 in AL voting before this season. I would say Mike Trout is the AL generational player right now and guys like Machado, Judge, Betts will be chasing him. I am not sure on Harper. His 2015 was a monster but his .249 average last year is a little concerning. If the Sox had 2 or 3 solid positional pieces in place already, I think it would be a better shot going for one of them. So one question, if the budget is $400 Mil, would you rather spend $400 mil on Machado or Harper or spread the risk and fill 3 or 4 spots with the $400. on the next tier down.

The best free agent he signed is a player you absolutely hate.

"It's not worth the circus" -People who buy tickets to and attend the actual circus

Replace depressing with awesome

Since he started playing again, Eric Reid has taken a knee at every game. Ron Rivera said it was no big deal and that's the end of it. No circus.

Which goes back to my point, why is Reuben Foster worth the media circus that comes with domestic violence?

Frank is my all time favorite, and he absolutely aged better, but to be fair, he would have played five to seven extra awful years too if he had that kind of contract.

Co-sign.

I wouldn't want him. Seems poor character is a trait he has, and I'd prefer not to have that on the Sox.

This. In this day and age, a guy with Avi's skill set is the opposite of in demand.

Welcome to the White Sox Bryce Harper!

Abreu is a better hitter than Hosmer. Case closed. Pay the man.

They will look like Julia Roberts in Pretty Woman when she goes out shopping on her own

I bet the majority of the biggest Kaepernick haters don't even know who Eric Reid is, that's whats weird about nobody signing him for so long. So much hatred became directed at Colin as the face of the "movement", any other protestors started being ignored, yet Reid was still blackballed by the owners for a while.

When the guy starts off the podcast saying the Sox are in on Kluber, you know he’s full of shit.

Certainly true. He's signed some FAs - really only Robertson was of any quality. I don't really care if he signs some of these 2nd/3rd tier guys - i think it's a waste but it shouldn't do real harm. My fear is that he starts trading for veterans ....that's where Hahn is dangerous.

He's had very little success. I'll beat a dead horse but before the rebuild if this were under any other owner. He probably would have been fired.

Any specific reason why you don't trust Hahn to sign any free agents?

Yes. Overall my view is I don't trust Hahn to sign any free agents.However in this case I think to even get be a finalist he'll have to massively overpay. Overall besides that we don't have alot of good going for us this upcoming year.

To pursue two generational talents who are both only 26 years old? Well ok, I guess that qualifies as one point of view.

If they're as motivated as they sound, I could see them sending $10M per for 5 years along with Cano for a minimal return. Prorating Cano's deal to ~$14M per makes it palatable in the short term anyway. Then trade Haniger for a big return when someone blow you away - they don't need to trade him this offseason, he's controlled a long time.

Yes, I don't see it. It would be counterproductive. Might as well hang on to him and their top young guys, or just trade their young guys for max returns. Punting on good young players just to eat Cano's money will set them back years after they would have been done paying Cano anyway. They knew when they signed him the last 2 or 3 years were going to be painful in all probability. That's how these things work. It's a bonus when that doesn't happen. Just suck it up.

It is certainly intriguing BA, but I don't see the M's giving away their best trade chip to rid themselves of Cano.

We already know the White Sox aren't going to sign these guys. The problem the front office will have by letting all their interest in them leak out is not that they are now being cheap, but the top guys don't want the White Sox money. They think they have a better chance to win now and in the future elsewhere.

Bob Nightengale

Colin Kaepernick is a starting QB in this league. I can think of 10 teams off the top of my head that he could be starting for right now and be an improvement over the current starting QB situation.

Reuben Foster gets 33k from the redskins this week to NOT play while the nfl decides whether to suspend him or not i saw this on twitter and it is sad but true, if Kaepernick beat a woman instead of kneeling, he would still be in the nfl today. That is messed up

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. I don't see any reason to have Yolmer as the starting 3rd baseman moving forward. We know what he is at this point. A good utility guy. Not a MLB caliber starting 3rd baseman.

Listening to this podcast, I just can’t help but think Bob Nightengale just makes all this shit up.

That's not the problem -- it's the net gain. I would agree that Haniger is better than Moncada right now. But if you believe Moncada will improve, he's probably only a year behind him. That still makes Haniger better but, does it make him $100M albatross better? I think you're losing as much as you're gaining by giving up that coveted financial flexibility. If our young guys bust, it won't matter anyway -- we need to operate as if most of them will turn out useful.

You can multitask, and continue to develop a core of young players, and at the same time, pursue generational talents like Harper and Machado.

If we don't get Machado and Harper I'm gonna be pissed

I honestly expect the Sox will miss out on the big names and say oh well we decided to stay on the rebuild...

Our local TV deal expires at the end of this season. Another 100 loss season with no signs of improvements will literally cost us significantly. There are legit business reasons to spend some money this year that go beyond trying to compete in 2019. I’m actually shocked so many posters continue to ignore this factor and would happily support another tanking season. Regardless, I am certain the TV deal situation will have an impact on our decision making this offseason. At very minimum, they will bring in some vets (likely pitchers) to improve the on-field product and signal a willingness to spend in the coming years. Ideally, I truly believe their goal is to land a whale and another bridge piece or two. Ultimate loclal TV revenue is simply too important to go into negotiations with zero leverage and the Sox know this.

Because effectively signing Cano to a 5-year $120M deal when he is 36 years old is insane, just to acquire a frickin' reliever. That is the type of move that would completely kill any chance of the Sox signing a big FA when they're actually ready, and completely kill the rebuild if Cano fell off a cliff, which he very well may do in his ages 38-41 seasons. There is some level of $$ thrown in by Seattle that makes acquiring Cano at least worth entertaining / spit-balling about, but its at least $50M.

If they are good and were pushed out because a younger player is better, you can trade them, it's a fine use of money. I'm old enough to remember when this board kept guffawing at how untradeable verlander was, or stanton, or kemp or etc etc. You don't want to be bad and needing to trade expensive veterans for talent infusion. As it is, it really won't matter. 2 years ago ATL signed a bunch of veteran, decent pitchers in trying to drum up interest for their new stadium. The prospects weren't close enough. It was a waste of money. And the moral of that story is it didn't really matter and didn't stop any future moves and ATL is fine and had no issue finding spots for talented players.

BECAUSE ADDING VETERANS ISN'T "REBUILDING THE RIGHT WAY" AND ITS RESORTING TO THE OLD "KW TACTICS" AND "WINNING 5 EXTRA GAMES IS WORTHLESS". I don't necessarily agree with it, but those in that boat have at least been clear about it. Sign MM or Harper, or just suck again.

"Money talks." ~ Jesse Chavez, probably

I think the Sox should wrap Eloy in bubblewrap and put him in a case and display him on the concourse of GRF. Maybe rope it off so no one can get too close, so something can't go wrong. . Have him spend the next 6 seasons as a museum piece. No sense putting him out on the field. He might get hurt.

Hey guys. Appreciate the concern. I have been out working on a key political campaign and decided to stay off of the internet while it was going on. I think I’ve mentioned before that i have ambitions to run for office some day so this was a huge opportunity. Really bummed I missed so much but it looks like nothing has changed.