Chicago White Sox
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Posts posted by Chicago White Sox
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7 hours ago, stinky said:
Heard. Mostly dreaming. No clue what else he'd mean by payroll flexibility. Maybe more minor league deals, but is that really payroll flexibility?
I’d assume that “payroll flexibility” at this point means we have a few million in the budget for in-season additions (think Houser signing last year).
Honestly, I think the roster is mostly locked in other than working through the zero option guys (Sosa vs. Mead | keep Lee or 2 catchers) and possibly adding another arm to the LH bullpen mix. IMO, Benintendi is here to stay until someone comes out and demands his playing time. Braden could be that guy later this year if Andrew’s defense remains a complete drag on his overall value.
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35 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:
Probably not the greatest idea for them to take on the enigma of Dustin May...
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Really embarrassing look for Getz.
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49 minutes ago, Jake said:
I think we can all agree that if his strikeouts don't go back up and his walks don't go back down, he's probably going to stink
Yes, which is why he cost $600k over the league minimum. This is a cheap roll of the dice that buys your young arms some time if needed.
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30 minutes ago, DoUEvenShift said:
4 times??? How the hell has no one in the media asked him to clarify at this point
Unfortunately, the only reporter worth a damn is Fegan and unsure if he’s even there when these comments were made.
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34 minutes ago, fathom said:
Good to see people on X questioning why Getz keeps saying Acuna is a switch hitter
I caught that in his interview and figured he must have confused him with Baldwin or something. Does he keep saying it? Seems like you should probably know the handedness of a player you just acquired.
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1 hour ago, WestEddy said:
Feels like he won’t be going on the 60 DL which is fantastic news. Will be interesting to see where Thorpe is at.
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2 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:
"Hahn couldn't develop a prospect to save his life."
Somehow having 5 position players as league average or better as young players isn't as good as having... two.
Getz then gets credit for developing Teel and Vargas who spent no time or very little time in the minors but Hahn doesn't get credit for his guys because they were acquired or too high of prospects ha.
I said it elsewhere, but if Montgomery is as good as Anderson in his first 6-7 years with the White Sox that would be a huge win.
Nothing you've presented aligns with the reality of the situations. This rebuild is in a worse position than the prior rebuild at the same point - both pitching wise AND offensively. Hahn made better trades than Getz to rebuild the roster. The White Sox have the 2nd most projected losses again in 2026. Brooks Baldwin being cited as some proof of concept is also wild.
Candidly speaking, I can’t keep up with all your spin. What five players were league average hitters and when into their career? How do these data points conflict with what I literally just laid out in a simple to understand fashion? And development doesn’t end in the minors, which is sort of a massive point I’m making by listing off a bunch of rookies who produced in year 1 (and who got better as the season progressed). This current group of bats is far less talented than the previous one, but performed relatively the same (or technically better) in year 1. That latter point is a factual, math-based conclusion that can’t really be debated.
And for the millionth time, I never commented on where this rebuild stands vs. the previous one. The previous had far more talent. Again, if you weren’t being a total snowflake about all things Chris Getz, you’d acknowledge the reason it failed is the elite guys never consistently reached their ceilings (before breaking down) and the next tier of hitters failed to develop at all with us. This revisionist theory that our player development function wasn’t absolute garbage under Hahn is some of the most insane s%*# I have seen in my years on this site.
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1 hour ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:
The 2019/2020 team had pitching.
For CWS to say he hadn't seen young guys come up and contribute right away under Hahn is just blacking out a reality that occurred 6 years ago!
The 2019 team, that won 72 games, got 4.2 bWAR from TA, 5.1 bWAR from Moncada, a 116 OPS+ from Eloy, a 5.4 WAR from Giolito, with Cease showing great strike out ability and Reylo existing. They also had Madrigal and Robert in the wings to come up as a plus prospect and an elite one.
The following year, they won the division, and on a per 160 basis, they had the following WAR totals (obviously 2020 has a bit of an asterisk across the league):
3.16
7.29
2.79
8.26
1.86
4.12
5.5
5 of the above were 27 or younger. Those are JUST the position players.
That team also had Giolito, CROCHET, Cease, Reylo, and Dunning. All who had more promise as pitchers than anyone the Sox have today with the exception of Smith who is on par with Reylo. Repainting right now as being more promising than 2019/2020 is hilarious.Good lord man. Again, my posts have been entirely on hitting development and here you go rambling off about WAR and pitching. It’s amazing how clearly I could lay out a point about how wrong you were about the speed at which the big four hitters from the previous group developed and you just completely ignore it and keep trying to move the goalposts. This is just comical at this point.
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1 hour ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:
You stand by a comment that was wrong. OK, you do that.
"Hahn never had success with prospects when they came up." Wrong.
This current iteration of the White Sox is in no way better or more promising than the previous group.
JFC pal…now you are just making up talking points I never said.
My quote was “Hahn couldn’t develop a prospect to save his life” and was a general statement implying we sucked at hitting development during his tenure. I’m not sure what there is to debate there…you have said as much during multiple rants against the org over the years and is a widely accepted truth. And that doesn’t literally mean zero prospects became useful major league hitters, but using the trio of Moncada/Eloy/Luis who were truly elite prospects when acquired and did not require much development isn’t the feather in the cap you think it is (especially when they all eventually crashed & burned out). Now, Tim Anderson is probably the best single example of a player development win under Hahn, but as I showed in my post above that actually took much longer you tried to let on.
I also have no idea where this “the current group is better or more promising than previous group” claim came from. I never once said that and please show me the receipts of me saying anything like that. Now, I did factually prove that these four rookies in this group put up a higher aggregate wRC+ than your four guys in their first seasons with the Sox despite lesser pedigrees . That doesn’t mean I think they will end up better players or they are even more promising than your group. It just means they came up and were more productive right out the gate, even more so when you account for talent levels. And again, when you add in Vargas & Sosa who made big strides last year, there is a higher volume of young guys who can actually hit. The previous rebuild literally failed because no one beyond the four you mentioned could supplement the core despite big draft capital invested into Collins, Burger, Sheet, Vaughn, & Madrigal.
It’s just wild to me how people get this triggered over the slightest compliment to Getz. I am no homer and have said time & time again that the jury is still out on Getz and he may end up being a bad GM. At the same time, it’s already apparent that he is a massive upgrade over Hahn because of investments he’s made to the infrastructure and bringing a bunch of outside voices. That’s a low bar to climb, but not necessarily an easy one when you inherited a completely incompetent org from top to bottom from your predecessor.
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1 hour ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:
Eloy first 170 games was 3+ WAR and 45 hrs.
Moncada was 8 war over first two seasons.
Robert was 6-7 over his start.
Anderson was at 4 WAR per 160 for like 5 years.
I won't even go into the pitching.
Your representation of the past vs the current isn't a reality.
You just listed three consensus top 5 to 10 prospects that were all legit 60+ FV type guys (plus a 55 FV guy in Anderson). Beyond moving the goalposts by citing WAR when we are talking exclusively about hitting development, you are also taking a multiyear view to help your narrative in certain cases. That being said, let’s break this down objectively on a like for like basis so we can all see what reality is.
Rebuild #1:
- Jimenez: Yr 1 = 115 wRC+ (504 PA) | Yr 2 = 138 wRC+ (226 PA)
- Moncada: Yr 1 = 105 wRC+ (231 PA) | 97 wRC+ (650 PA)
- Robert: Yr 1 = 99 wRC+ (227 PA) | Yr = 155 wRC+ (296 PA)
- Anderson: Yr 1 = 98 wRC+ (431 PA) | Yr 2 = 79 (606 PA)
- Weighted Avg: Yr 1 = 105 wRC+ | Yr 2 = 106 wRC+
Rebuild #2:
- Montgomery: Yr 1 = 129 wRC+ (284 PA)
- Teel: Yr 1 = 125 wRC+ (297 PA)
- Quero: Yr 1 = 95 wRC+ (403 PA)
- Baldwin: Yr 1 = 92 wRC+ (328 PA)
- Vargas: Yr 2 = 101 wRC+ (569 PA)
- Sosa: Yr 2 = 100 wRC+ (544 PA)
- Weighted Avg: Yr 1 = 108 wRC+ | Yr 2 = 101 wRC+
So right off the back, Montgomery & Teel were more productive in their rookie seasons than any of the four guys mentioned from the previous rebuild. The only one of the big four you named who was well above average was a highly advanced all bat prospect and even he wasn’t as good as Colson or Teel. Meanwhile, Robert & Anderson weren’t really that much better than Quero or Baldwin. Overall, the four rookies in my group provided a higher wRC+ than the four guys in your group during their first seasons despite being much less regarded prospects overall.
When it came to year 2, Jimenez & Robert both performed extremely well in SSS’s that completely exceeded their career results thereafter (Jimenez 107 wRC+ and Robert 104 wRC+). Meanwhile, Moncada floundered a bit in year 2 and fell below league average while Tim experienced a significant drop off. This idea that both were awesome out of the gate is inherently false. As a comparison, Vargas & Sosa were better hitters last year than Yoan & Timmy were in their second seasons.
So yeah, I stand by my comment. A group of lesser prospects (and more of them) hit just as good or better than the guys you referenced. Obviously we will need to see what happens in year for Colson, Teel, etc, but right now my statement is valid and your depiction of the truth is far from reality. As is becoming far too common, your lazy drive by posts are not holding up when scrutinized. I truly miss the old Look at Ray Ray Run who put time & energy into his posts and would normally win these type of debates. Alas that person appears to be long gone.
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28 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said:
My only point was that it could very well be that those young players all developed because of the changes that Getz made, but I also don’t think we can just assume they would have failed if Hahn remained the GM.
For as much hate as Hahn gets, it is rather ironic that four of those key young players mentioned were acquired when Hahn was the GM.
Would they have all failed under? No way to know. But I think it’s fair to assume a lot more of them would have failed with the lack of useful analytics data throughout the org, little to no access to important modern player development equipment, and support from a terrible pro scouting group under Hahn.
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6 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said:
Because no one knows for sure if they would have failed as prospects without Getz taking over as GM.
What is it that you are arguing here? Like pick a specific point I’ve made and tell me where you disagree.
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28 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:
You've lowered the bar so low, the carpet can't even fit under it.
Can't give credit for improving above a level they should have never been at in the first place.
That said, getting excited for baseball.
Again, no idea what people are arguing here. I have never once suggested we were a world class hitting organization. But what I can tell you is I just the endured the entire Rick Hahn era where we couldn’t develop a prospect to save our lives and frequently signed bargain bin free agents to no success. Slater & Tauchman were relatively small wins, but signs that the infrastructure is hopefully improving and won’t just burn cash every time we sign a free agent. Same goes for the young bats like Colson, Teel, Baldwin, & Quero who came up this year and were effective right away as well as second year guys like Vargas & Sosa who made tremendous strides. I can’t remember a time when this many young bats came up and were contributors this quickly. Maybe that’s how it’s everywhere else, but it certainly hasn’t been the case here. Gives me some hope we may not longer be the most incompetent org in all of sports.
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16 minutes ago, SoxBlanco said:
Ha! Thanks for the mention. Nobody responded to my question about that phrase, so I’m going to assume it’s just a trendy phrase that caught on, similar to “I didn’t have that on my bingo card.”
There’s a non zero chance I’ll use it at some point.
I would have responded to your question, but honestly don’t know the answer. I just happen to use it quite a bit.-
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23 minutes ago, WestEddy said:
I think it's been bandied about in a few places that this move doesn't preclude a Canning signing. Fedde could certainly throw reasonable innings while Thorpe/Bush/Adams work their way back and Sandlin/McDougal/Schultz work towards a promotion. Canning might be on that same timetable.
I don’t know how we juggle both on the 26 man roster though. There just isn’t any room for another major league deal for the pitching staff outside of theoretically another LH reliever. Feels like this was an either/or thing with Fedde or Canning.
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1 hour ago, Autumn Dreamin said:
Yeah, can't be mad at that number
The exact number I was predicting. $600k over the league minimum is nothing for a guy with a non zero chance of being a useful starter ( @SoxBlanco) who worst case scenario gives us a warm body to hold down the #5 spot until a young arm is ready for their shot.
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5 minutes ago, DoUEvenShift said:
Man I can't wait for the Sox to start winning again. The vibe has sucked here lately
I fully agree. Can’t make an objectively true positive comment about the White Sox without being called David Koresh.
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1 hour ago, southsider2k5 said:
Which was the exact point. Am I supposed to be impressed by a guy doing exactly what he is always done, except for one bad year? Oh. Ok. Wow. Amazing. We are as good as everyone else. We will be .500 in no time.
Keep moving them goal posts buddy…🤣🤣🤣
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1 hour ago, Dick Allen said:
What we are arguing is how much these hitting "geniuses" have to do with White Sox success. I think the numbers are pretty similar without them.
How many hitting prospects have come up and been productive for the Sox? And how many scrap free agent signings have worked out in the past? No one is calling them “geniuses”, but it’s remarkable improvement from where the org was and I’m shocked that people aren’t willing to admit it.
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53 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:
This is really what this victory lap is over? Getting a guy back to his career norms? Oh, ok. I guess when I read "fixed" it meant better than he had been, not the same. I guess that mean you "win" congratulations.
And yes, it has become a cult. Disagree and the insults start flying, which is exactly what happened here. It turned from talking about a dudes stats to name-calling, and then you got mad when you got it back.
You really are only allowed to have one opinion here anymore. Even sticking to stats it turned into this.
You just accused me of being in a cult. A moderator said this after I proved him wrong using numbers. Me saying you refuse to acknowledge when you’re wrong isn’t “name calling”. I’m not some snowflake and don’t really care about the bizarre cult comment…just shocked that a moderator is allowed to talk this way to posters.
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1 hour ago, WhiteSox2023 said:
Regardless of how Slater performed, Getz deserved all the mocking he received for making that statement. Let’s be honest.
Eh…does it sound ridiculous? Sure. Does it suck that our cheap owner created a financial situation where $1.5M signings could even be considered priorities? No doubt about it. But at the end of the day, why do I care what Getz says to players as part of his selling process? Making a free agent feel wanted is part of his job.
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7 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:
And with all that, they still were a bottom 4 offense in all of baseball.
What exactly are we arguing here? Yes, they sucked in the first half when a lot of the young guys weren’t up (or struggling) and instead they played a bunch of AAAA guys. Go look at where the offense performed in the second half as young guys further developed. I’m not giving out credit because I’m some homer…the front office actually put together a competent offense together July forward.
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15 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:
He put up almost the exact same season wide numbers. How is that unfair when compared to slicing out pieces that do work? We are looking at 79 ABs one season, 160 the next, which worked out almost identically overall, and you are mad we are not boiling it down even further to look only at one subset of his performance in which he put up 224/.290/.435/.726/, which is actually below his career line vs LHP with his .267/.357/.430/.787, and yet I am being unfair.
This is turning into a cult.
I have never in my entire life met someone who is incapable of admitting they are wrong about something as much as you. It’s actually comical at this point. And then making bizarre “cult” accusations? Like what in the f*** are we even doing here? When are the other mods going to step in and stop this nonsense?
Read the damn post. Very clearly stated what he we signed him up to do which is hit LHP. Him being forced to play against RHP was a function of injury and lacking minor league depth. There is a reason he cost us $600k over the league minimum in free agency and then commanded a top 20 org prospect at the deadline. You can try to spin this all you want, but the facts don’t lie. The Sox returned him to his previous form against LHP and were able to turn him a solid prospect. But keep being purposefully dense in a Hail Mary swing at winning the internet for the day.
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2026 Spring Training Thread
in Pale Hose Talk
Posted · Edited by Chicago White Sox
He’d be crazy to address it. There is no good reason for being confused on this four times and trying to walk it back will come off even more ridiculous. If it were me, I’d avoid the media for a couple of days and bank on the Sox beat writers other than Fegan lacking any backbone.