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Josh Donaldson called Tim Anderson "Jackie"


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Posted (edited)
27 minutes ago, Heads22 said:

It really doesn't matter what anyone besides those involved think, and only Donaldson knows the true intent. But he also lost the benefit of the doubt a while ago.

Exactly.  This can be an inside joke or played off if Donaldson didn't have a history of being an incredible asshole.

You take the history of this jagoff and realize there is no defense.  He's made his bed with his prior actions so now it's time for MLB to step in.

 

Edited by Harry Chappas
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1 minute ago, Boogua said:

Yup, I thought it was definitely messed up and racist when I first heard about it, but then heard about the 2019 thing. Obviously still a stupid comment, especially in today's climate, but I can't be sure it was 100% racist like the mind readers here. Lump me in with the "dumb Latino" crowd if there is one.

Also, be careful, opinions like this are "telling on yourself". Whatever that is supposed to mean. 

By this argument we will never have racism because only that individual knows what's really truly in their heart...we have actions, and consistent ones over time, but that's not proof, either.

I'm sure Curt Schilling can pontificate for hours on the subject of what makes him not a racist but an cancel culture patriot.

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This is all over nothing.  No punishments bc its over nothing.  Just 2 hot heads doing what they do best and trying to get under guys skin.  It sucks that the world blows up nothing into something but that's the way it is now.  

They both need to shut up and play baseball 

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11 hours ago, greg775 said:

It's not like he has one topic in his show. It's not like he goes out there an hour and hits one group and one only. He goes after all sorts of groups as part of his COMEDY ACT. People need to chill out. Comedy is comedy. People can turn the channel, not buy tickets or walk out. 

I'm trans. For so many years of my life, there wasn't a day that went by that I didn't think about killing myself. Gradually, I stopped socializing altogether and just sort of let my friendships fade away, because I wanted to hurt as few people as possible when I left.

It's not necessary that a comedian "goes after" someone like me. Everyone I cared about already did that, without knowing it, when I was growing up. It was just one of those things that was acceptable to mock. The only time I ever saw another person like me, it was on trash TV like Springer and presented as a freakshow. I never had to wonder how people felt about me, because eventually they volunteered their feelings through a hurtful joke. My friends, teachers, bosses, even my siblings and parents.

I'm not saying Chappelle can't make trans jokes or should be "canceled" for doing so. I'm just asking, why do it? Why punch down? It's hack comedy, and it emboldens bigots to continue viewing people like me as subhuman.

The Josh Donaldsons of the world have always been there, and probably always will be. But I never dreamed that there could be so many Yasmani Grandals. People willing to stand up for me, or at least, give me the basic human dignity we all should be afforded. So, if given the choice, why not be a Grandal?

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15 minutes ago, ChiSox said:

Imagine citing Jason Whitlock in any argument.

Lots of people here apparently just can't help telling us who they are.

I agree, but not in the way you're implying. 

Imo, by not seeing race in everything it shows a lack of racism.  

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Just now, Polar Bear said:

This is all over nothing.  No punishments bc its over nothing.  Just 2 hot heads doing what they do best and trying to get under guys skin.  It sucks that the world blows up nothing into something but that's the way it is now.  

They both need to shut up and play baseball 

LOL.  Both sides.  Two hot heads.  Totally equivalent.

If you a PoC this wouldn't be your position as someone on the receiving side of it.

Now we're simply circling back to the "just shut up and play" argument that dates back to Kapaernick and LeBron.

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1 minute ago, caulfield12 said:

By this argument we will never have racism because only that individual knows what's really truly in their heart...we have actions, and consistent ones over time, but that's not proof, either.

I'm sure Curt Schilling can pontificate for hours on the subject of what makes him not a racist but an cancel culture patriot.

Not sure I agree with this. There are provable hate crimes (the Buffalo guy being the most recent one). There are clearly racist words. I even acknowledged if the 2019 thing never happened it would have definitely seemed racist. Busting someone's balls who compared himself to one of the most important figures in sports history seemed like trash talk. It could have been 100% with racist intent, but I don't know that and won't act like I know that.

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4 minutes ago, shoeless_joe21 said:

I'm trans. For so many years of my life, there wasn't a day that went by that I didn't think about killing myself. Gradually, I stopped socializing altogether and just sort of let my friendships fade away, because I wanted to hurt as few people as possible when I left.

It's not necessary that a comedian "goes after" someone like me. Everyone I cared about already did that, without knowing it, when I was growing up. It was just one of those things that was acceptable to mock. The only time I ever saw another person like me, it was on trash TV like Springer and presented as a freakshow. I never had to wonder how people felt about me, because eventually they volunteered their feelings through a hurtful joke. My friends, teachers, bosses, even my siblings and parents.

I'm not saying Chappelle can't make trans jokes or should be "canceled" for doing so. I'm just asking, why do it? Why punch down? It's hack comedy, and it emboldens bigots to continue viewing people like me as subhuman.

The Josh Donaldsons of the world have always been there, and probably always will be. But I never dreamed that there could be so many Yasmani Grandals. People willing to stand up for me, or at least, give me the basic human dignity we all should be afforded. So, if given the choice, why not be a Grandal?

What a post, thank you for sharing that

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18 minutes ago, shoeless_joe21 said:

I'm trans. For so many years of my life, there wasn't a day that went by that I didn't think about killing myself. Gradually, I stopped socializing altogether and just sort of let my friendships fade away, because I wanted to hurt as few people as possible when I left.

It's not necessary that a comedian "goes after" someone like me. Everyone I cared about already did that, without knowing it, when I was growing up. It was just one of those things that was acceptable to mock. The only time I ever saw another person like me, it was on trash TV like Springer and presented as a freakshow. I never had to wonder how people felt about me, because eventually they volunteered their feelings through a hurtful joke. My friends, teachers, bosses, even my siblings and parents.

I'm not saying Chappelle can't make trans jokes or should be "canceled" for doing so. I'm just asking, why do it? Why punch down? It's hack comedy, and it emboldens bigots to continue viewing people like me as subhuman.

The Josh Donaldsons of the world have always been there, and probably always will be. But I never dreamed that there could be so many Yasmani Grandals. People willing to stand up for me, or at least, give me the basic human dignity we all should be afforded. So, if given the choice, why not be a Grandal?

Bravo.  For the record THIS is bravery greg.

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Posted (edited)

The White Sox fanbase has changed...or we just always have had blinders on for those next to us in the crowd cheering for the same team.

It's one aspect of Reinsdorf's tenure that people can't quibble with...giving everyone opportunity regardless of race, religion or socio-economic background.

Edited by caulfield12
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23 minutes ago, shoeless_joe21 said:

I'm trans. For so many years of my life, there wasn't a day that went by that I didn't think about killing myself. Gradually, I stopped socializing altogether and just sort of let my friendships fade away, because I wanted to hurt as few people as possible when I left.

It's not necessary that a comedian "goes after" someone like me. Everyone I cared about already did that, without knowing it, when I was growing up. It was just one of those things that was acceptable to mock. The only time I ever saw another person like me, it was on trash TV like Springer and presented as a freakshow. I never had to wonder how people felt about me, because eventually they volunteered their feelings through a hurtful joke. My friends, teachers, bosses, even my siblings and parents.

I'm not saying Chappelle can't make trans jokes or should be "canceled" for doing so. I'm just asking, why do it? Why punch down? It's hack comedy, and it emboldens bigots to continue viewing people like me as subhuman.

The Josh Donaldsons of the world have always been there, and probably always will be. But I never dreamed that there could be so many Yasmani Grandals. People willing to stand up for me, or at least, give me the basic human dignity we all should be afforded. So, if given the choice, why not be a Grandal?

 

Forgive my ignorance, but I don't understand what trans means.  Google has a bunch of different meanings.

Is it someone that was born with both sexes or it someone that was born certain sex, but thinks they are the other?

Again, if this comes off as insensitive, I apologize.  Not my intention at all.  Sometimes the best way to end discrimination or perceived discrimination is by educating.    

 

If you'd rather not respond, I understand.  Maybe in a private message?

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11 minutes ago, Middle Buffalo said:

Donaldson should walk across the field today when TA’s stretching and talk to him about it. It’s pretty simple. If you do something wrong, own it, and make amends.

It's not going to happen without the Yankees/Boone orchestrating it as a PR gesture to quell a rising firestorm.

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34 minutes ago, shoeless_joe21 said:

I'm trans. For so many years of my life, there wasn't a day that went by that I didn't think about killing myself. Gradually, I stopped socializing altogether and just sort of let my friendships fade away, because I wanted to hurt as few people as possible when I left.

It's not necessary that a comedian "goes after" someone like me. Everyone I cared about already did that, without knowing it, when I was growing up. It was just one of those things that was acceptable to mock. The only time I ever saw another person like me, it was on trash TV like Springer and presented as a freakshow. I never had to wonder how people felt about me, because eventually they volunteered their feelings through a hurtful joke. My friends, teachers, bosses, even my siblings and parents.

I'm not saying Chappelle can't make trans jokes or should be "canceled" for doing so. I'm just asking, why do it? Why punch down? It's hack comedy, and it emboldens bigots to continue viewing people like me as subhuman.

The Josh Donaldsons of the world have always been there, and probably always will be. But I never dreamed that there could be so many Yasmani Grandals. People willing to stand up for me, or at least, give me the basic human dignity we all should be afforded. So, if given the choice, why not be a Grandal?

Thank you for sharing this.  

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15 minutes ago, Middle Buffalo said:

Donaldson should walk across the field today when TA’s stretching and talk to him about it. It’s pretty simple. If you do something wrong, own it, and make amends.

I agree but think Boone and LaRussa should accompany each player to meet somewhere pregame.  The managers (if players agree) can then tell their teams it is over as far as retaliation is concerned.  I don't want to see a situation where Donaldson gets off free, gets thrown at, and our player gets suspended.  

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1 hour ago, RG23SoxFan said:

Jason Whitlock isn't just some random black man, but whatever.  I never said his actions were acceptable.  Donaldson is a jackass and TA being pissed about the BS tag is justified.  Whether his Jackie comment was intended to be racist or not Donaldson should apologize.  Whether you or anyone else are 100% sure his comment was racist doesn't make it true.

Josh is a redneck so I rule guilty. Tim has done a lot to mentor urban athletes in baseball so he deserves some credit. Maybe he lacks a little modesty. 

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, black jack said:

 

Forgive my ignorance, but I don't understand what trans means.  Google has a bunch of different meanings.

Is it someone that was born with both sexes or it someone that was born certain sex, but thinks they are the other?

Again, if this comes off as insensitive, I apologize.  Not my intention at all.  Sometimes the best way to end discrimination or perceived discrimination is by educating.    

 

If you'd rather not respond, I understand.  Maybe in a private message?

I’m not speaking for shoeless.  The term trans in general means a person is born as one gender, but identify or express themselves as the opposite gender.    Some trans people transition to the opposite gender (Katlyn Jenner, sorry if I misspelled her first name).  That’s the basics.  There is more depth to it.  
 

And shoeless…you are a strong person.  Thanks for sharing.  The world is a better place that you opted to stay around.

Edited by JTB
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3 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

The White Sox fanbase has changed...or we just always have had blinders on for those next to us in the crowd cheering for the same team.

It's one aspect of Reinsdorf's tenure that people can't quibble with...giving everyone opportunity regardless of race, religion or socio-economic background.

Have you ever been to Bridgeport? Evergreen Park? SoxTalk? There has always been a subcurrent of racism in both fanbases (Cubs and Sox). It's society, and many fans represent the lowest common denominator.

One of my last trips to Comiskey in 2019 (was in the club seats), had to summon security to kick out/ shut up this drunken asshole who kept screaming n-word, dropping the r for "as" in a sky box, some "clever" take on rapping. They didn't kick him out, but they did watch the box the rest of the game, and he thankfully STFU the remaining two innings.

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Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, JTB said:

I’m not speaking for shoeless.  The term trans in general means a person is born as one gender, but identify or express themselves as the opposite gender.    Some trans people transition to the opposite gender (Katlyn Jenner, sorry if I misspelled her first name).  That’s the basics.  There is more depth to it.  
 

And shoeless…you are a strong person.  Thanks for sharing.  The world is a better place that you opted to stay around.

Sex (external sex characteristics) and Gender are two separate things.  Transgender means more that a person's gender identity doesn't align with their body's sex.  Gender affirming surgeries align one's body with one's gender identity.  Gender is also a spectrum and many people don't identify with either binary, or identify somewhere in between.  There is more complexity for each individual than these simplified explanations.

Edited by Tnetennba
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5 minutes ago, JTB said:

I’m not speaking for shoeless.  The term trans in general means a person is born as one gender, but identify or express themselves as the opposite gender.    Some trans people transition to the opposite gender (Katlyn Jenner, sorry if I misspelled her first name).  That’s the basics.  There is more depth to it.  
 

And shoeless…you are a strong person.  Thanks for sharing.  The world is a better place that you opted to stay around.

I should probably end the conversation here because typically when someone like me asks questions, it ends badly.  But the topic was raised on a public forum so I'm going to use this opportunity to educate myself.

 

It's all very confusing to me.  If you're born a man, but relate to being a woman, doesn't that just mean you're a homosexual that dresses as a woman?  

Or can a man who feels like he's a woman still be attracted to woman meaning he thinks he's lesbian?  

Does sexual attraction have nothing to do with it?  

It sounds like a very difficult situation to be born into.  

Is therapy an option to help you cope or possibly (any word I insert here will come off as ignorant) fix these issues? 

 

 

I'm not sure I'll ever fully understand. 

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, Tnetennba said:

Sex (external sex characteristics) and Gender are two separate things.  Transgender means more that a person's gender identity doesn't align with their body's sex.  Gender affirming surgeries align one's body with one's gender identity.  Gender is also a spectrum and many people don't identify with either binary, or identify somewhere in between.  There is more complexity for each individual than these simplified explanations.

This was posted while I was typing and honestly, it leaves more questions than answers to me. 

Edited by black jack
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1 hour ago, RG23SoxFan said:

Jason Whitlock isn't just some random black man, but whatever.  I never said his actions were acceptable.  Donaldson is a jackass and TA being pissed about the BS tag is justified.  Whether his Jackie comment was intended to be racist or not Donaldson should apologize.  Whether you or anyone else are 100% sure his comment was racist doesn't make it true.

Don’t care what his skin tone is, anytime you take the side of Jason Whitlock, you’re on the side I don’t want to be on. He’s proven that time and time again. 

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9 minutes ago, black jack said:

This was posted while I was typing and honestly, it leaves more questions than answers to me. 

Your chromosomes determine your physical sex, male or female (with some very rare chromosomal abnormalities that make someone physically not binary, but that's a different discussion). Your brain and your hormones influence which gender you actually feel like you are and which gender you're attracted to. In the vast majority of cases, people feel like the gender that matches their physical sex (cisgender) and are attracted to the opposite sex (heterosexual). Some identify with the opposite gender (transgender) and some are attracted to the same sex (homosexual) and some are both.

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