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TLR out for the year


chw42
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16 minutes ago, mmmmmbeeer said:

Harrison wasn't an awful choice for 2B in that he's a solid defender.  Not a great stick but, given the lineup we thought we had, we could absorb a bit less production from 2B.

Pollock for RF was not a bad pickup, at all.  Not a lefty but his L/R splits were pretty even.  Solid, professional hitter with good pop.  Bit of a health risk but filled a need.

Kelly has been a disaster but, as the 6th-7th inning guy, he was not a bad gamble to sign..

Josh Harrison’s last solid season was in 2017.

Pollock is 34, has a bad arm, and played less than a dozen games in RF. What woukd make Rick Hahn think it was a position he could play?

Kelly’s contract stated he couldn’t pitch in consecutive games over the first three months of the season. What other GM would take on that “gamble”, let alone for a second season at $2M more?

This wasn’t supposed to be a tanking team trying to fill out three key positions with mid 30s guys on their final contracts.

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22 minutes ago, mmmmmbeeer said:

Harrison wasn't an awful choice for 2B in that he's a solid defender.  Not a great stick but, given the lineup we thought we had, we could absorb a bit less production from 2B.

Pollock for RF was not a bad pickup, at all.  Not a lefty but his L/R splits were pretty even.  Solid, professional hitter with good pop.  Bit of a health risk but filled a need.

Kelly has been a disaster but, as the 6th-7th inning guy, he was not a bad gamble to sign..

We lost two lefties out of the pen, both late inning guys in Crochet and Bummer.  I don't think we appreciate how big of a hole these two injuries created.

AV was clearly supposed to DH this season but injuries have forced him into the OF.  Hahn had to plan on Eloy in LF.  He's a better OF than Vaughn and needed to prove he could stay healthy out there.  

Were you upset we had Yoan and Yas in the lineup on opening day?  I wasn't.  RH couldn't have predicted such awful seasons from two core LH pieces.

Gio? TA? Lynn? Luis's health? 

The opening day roster, on paper, did not have anyone screaming that this was destined to fail.  Injuries and underperformance have played an outsized role in the season's outcome.  A GM can only put so many contingencies in place...eventually, if holes keep appearing, the ship is going to sink.  Do I think he misallocated some money?  Absolutely (VV and LG, especially).  Should he have retained Rodon?  For sure.  But to imply this was a bad opening day roster is just hyperbole and revisionist.  The roster is the one reason the national press, the team, and fans all believed we would be a WS contender this season.

 

 

To be fair to Tex, he was actually super down on them from the get go.

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17 hours ago, Lip Man 1 said:

People that I trust were telling me last year, this was the plan... that's the reason Cairo joined the staff. He's next in line from what they've told me.

Assuming that happens it would be yet another time when the Sox didn't even bother to have a comprehensive search process and try to bring in "outsiders" who can look at the issues with fresh eyes.

Shoot me now

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27 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Pollock is 34, has a bad arm, and played less than a dozen games in RF. What woukd make Rick Hahn think it was a position he could play?

To be fair.... the same question should be asked of Vaughn and Sheets.

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1 hour ago, pcq said:

I do not see that great talent. Their playoff record suggests they were over-rated in my view. Granted the constant injuries have taken their toll.

On paper, the projection systems coming into the year still had this as a 90 win team (PECOTA was at 94 I looked this morning) and Fangraphs had them at a >90% chance at a playoff spot. There is talent here whether we see it now or not, and the dropoffs we've seen this year are rare enough that the projection systems didn't expect them. That's tellign. 

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4 minutes ago, Tnetennba said:

If this isn't an indictment of TLR sucking the life out of everything I don't know what is.

Also why the hell didn't the players have a meeting like this earlier. Why wait till there is a month left, you're 2 games under, and 5 games out?

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13 minutes ago, chw42 said:

Also why the hell didn't the players have a meeting like this earlier. Why wait till there is a month left, you're 2 games under, and 5 games out?

They have had player's meetings earlier this year after that disaster in K.C. where they lost three of four games.

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2 hours ago, Quin said:

To be fair to Tex, he was actually super down on them from the get go.

And that really was my gut, not my brain. It was much easier to see how things would go right. In fact, since I was in Illinois right before the season started, I have several losing bets now on the Sox winning division, AL, and WS. 

I think it you are going to blame Hahn for a terrible roster then Tony gets some credit for being this competitive with all the injuries and no depth. 

If you agree that Hahn put out a capable roster, even with the inevitable injuries, then Tony takes the fall. Which is where I'm leaning. 

Although @Balta1701 brings up the good point that Hahn has put together a roster that could win the division, but given the time and budget, should be much better. 

White Sox baseball, finding new ways to disappoint fans for over 100 years

 

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I wonder how much TLR had to do with the poor roster construction…

Wouldn’t be surprised at all if we didn’t sign a second baseman or right fielder in the offseason because Tony advocated playing people out of position.

He probably also is the reason for the Leury hard on.

We know he was responsible for the Kelly disaster.

On the other hand, we have Hahn and a decade of nothing burgers.

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9 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Hahn is not qualified to make managerial decisions, even for an organization as pathetic as the White Sox. He needs to be fired immediately, if not sooner.

So would you agree that any manager would have huge problems trying to win a division with a GM like that? 

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39 minutes ago, Texsox said:

So would you agree that any manager would have huge problems trying to win a division with a GM like that? 

Hahn has been, and continues to be the primary problem because he is not a capable leader, cannot properly evaluate talent, and has few strengths which align with his role. 

Tony has exacerbated issues between his involvement in the Leury and Kelly signings, and eschewing logic, facts, proper defensive alignment and players qualified to field their positions in favor of platoon advantages (real or imagined) and his 77 year old gut. 

A quality qualified GM should be hired and allowed to hire their choice of manager and staff, and not have Tony or Hahn hanging around as an "advisor" like Marley's / Jerry's ghost.

Edited by South Side Hit Men
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  • knightni changed the title to TLR wants to return this season
  • Quin changed the title to TLR out for the year

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