Squirmin' for Yermin Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 16 minutes ago, almagest said: That scouting report sounds like Andrew Vaughn, and Manzardo is struggling in AAA. I don't get this at all. Civale is a solid #3 with good control having a great year. My guess is Cleveland panicked a little and will be bringing Manzardo up very soon to try to give their offense a shot in the arm. They're only a half game back of Minnesota, which would be the worst white flag wave of all time, so it can't be that. I believe this is the first year Civale has had a FIP under 4.... They cashed in high. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmmmmbeeer Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 So a team 1gb of 1st place dealt the best pitcher in their rotation due to market conditions, and get one hell of a prospect back in return. They know they aren't going anywhere, even if they win the division, so might as well capitalize on the market conditions. The Sox? 20 games under .500 and still hanging onto Aaron Bummer, much less Dylan Cease, for a long shot chance at a 2024 AL Central crown. At what point do we move away from talking about accountability for the Sox FO and move into talking about unbelievable incompetence? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 44 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said: Yeah but it's a 1st baseman. Real value comes from speed, defense and power, guys who have a shot at becoming 4+ WAR guys. TB knows this. It's the same reason Sox got catchers as the only non pitcher position players so far. Who got compared (Quero) to a much less developed Keibert Ruiz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mighty Mite Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 Why would the Guards trade one of their best pitchers, are they conceding the division to the Twins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 3 minutes ago, mmmmmbeeer said: So a team 1gb of 1st place dealt the best pitcher in their rotation due to market conditions, and get one hell of a prospect back in return. They know they aren't going anywhere, even if they win the division, so might as well capitalize on the market conditions. The Sox? 20 games under .500 and still hanging onto Aaron Bummer, much less Dylan Cease, for a long shot chance at a 2024 AL Central crown. At what point do we move away from talking about accountability for the Sox FO and move into talking about unbelievable incompetence? Cleveland has other pitchers to field a decent rotation, the Sox do not. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timmy U Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 1 minute ago, caulfield12 said: Who got compared (Quero) to a much less developed Keibert Ruiz. Huh? That would be an insane comp. Quero is smallish, hit over power switch-hitter with just an average arm but excellent instincts for the game. He may not succeed but he's not a similar profile to Keibert Ruiz. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tnetennba Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 6 minutes ago, mmmmmbeeer said: So a team 1gb of 1st place dealt the best pitcher in their rotation due to market conditions, and get one hell of a prospect back in return. They know they aren't going anywhere, even if they win the division, so might as well capitalize on the market conditions. The Sox? 20 games under .500 and still hanging onto Aaron Bummer, much less Dylan Cease, for a long shot chance at a 2024 AL Central crown. At what point do we move away from talking about accountability for the Sox FO and move into talking about unbelievable incompetence? Pretty sure we have reached this point. There is zero accountability in the org, so all we have to rail against is their near inconceivable levels of incompetence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tnetennba Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 Also, Cleveland just makes up pitchers out of thin air. They won't be lacking in that department. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Side Hit Men Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 31 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said: Yeah but it's a 1st baseman. Real value comes from speed, defense and power, guys who have a shot at becoming 4+ WAR guys. TB knows this. It's the same reason Sox got catchers as the only non pitcher position players so far. Too bad Hahn spent most of his resources acquiring DH/1B position players plus relief pitchers, also on the low fWAR side due to pitching 1/3 to 1/2 the innings of starters. Hopefully at least one of these guys turns out to be a legitimate minimum league average defensive catcher. White Sox Career fWAR to date Eight Total Players = 15.7 Total fWAR: 3 High Draft Picks (2 #1s, 1 #2); 1 High Trade Priority (Eloy) and two high priced FAs (Encarnacion $13M/season & Grandal $18.3M/ 4 Seasons). 2017: R1 Jake Burger (1.9), R2 Gavin Sheets (0.2), TR Eloy Jimenez (5.8); R5 Yermin Mercedes (0.1) 2019: R1 Andrew Vaughn (-0.7) 2020: FA Edwin Encarnacion (-0.4), FA Yasmani Grandal (4.8) 2021: FA Jake Lamb (0.0) It took nine seasons to derive the bulk of this fWAR (10.6 of 15.7 from Eloy's 5 seasons and Grandal's 4 seasons, pending the final two months of 2023). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 https://www.cleveland.com/guardians/2023/07/guardians-trade-aaron-civale-to-tampa-bay-for-first-baseman-kyle-manzardo.html Manzanardo dealing with an injury Curry Battenfield and then Quantrill next into the rotation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Side Hit Men Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 12 minutes ago, The Mighty Mite said: Why would the Guards trade one of their best pitchers, are they conceding the division to the Twins. Because there are only 6-8 teams that give a s%*# about competing, and the other 22-24 have owners that just want to pocket money and feign interest. First and second place teams in three of the six divisions have done little to nothing with just over 24 hours left until the deadline, and Cleveland actually making tanking trades with their dump of Rosario and now Civale. Wouldn't be surprised if the Twins dumped players also, they will likely need 71-72 wins to win this piece of s%*# division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 2 hours ago, Timmy U said: Huh? That would be an insane comp. Quero is smallish, hit over power switch-hitter with just an average arm but excellent instincts for the game. He may not succeed but he's not a similar profile to Keibert Ruiz. That came directly from Morosi on The Score. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 (edited) 2 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said: Because there are only 6-8 teams that give a s%*# about competing, and the other 22-24 have owners that just want to pocket money and feign interest. First and second place teams in three of the six divisions have done little to nothing with just over 24 hours left until the deadline, and Cleveland actually making tanking trades with their dump of Rosario and now Civale. Wouldn't be surprised if the Twins dumped players also, they will likely need 71-72 wins to win this piece of s%*# division. Cleveland hasn't tanked in over a decade. Rosario a FA at SS who hasn't hit all year long...now they have more insurance for Bieber/McKenzie/Quantrill. Edited July 31 by caulfield12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dominikk85 Posted August 1 Share Posted August 1 3 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said: Yeah but it's a 1st baseman. Real value comes from speed, defense and power, guys who have a shot at becoming 4+ WAR guys. TB knows this. It's the same reason Sox got catchers as the only non pitcher position players so far. A really good 1b still can be very valuable and he had been ranked top50 overall by most prospect ranks. But the bar is very high to be a true star at 1b you basically need 70 hit, 70 power or 80 power and 60 grade hit tool which is very rare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Side Hit Men Posted August 1 Share Posted August 1 14 minutes ago, caulfield12 said: Cleveland hasn't tanked in over a decade. Rosario a FA at SS who hasn't hit all year long...now they have more insurance for Bieber/McKenzie/Quantrill. They have been bottom sixth in payroll this decade, drastically increased with the extension to Ramirez to avoid a grievance with the union for failure to spend revenue sharing proceeds. 2022 was a solid year for them, this year and 2021 were mediocre (80-82 in 2021). 2020 is a bullshit farce season, none of the eight Central teams advanced in the 16 team playoff sham. Year Opening Day 26-man Year End 40-man CB Tax 40-man 2023 $ 89,424,629 (25) $ ( ) $134,977,010 (21) 2022 $ 68,238,900 (27) $ 69,080,715 (27) $ 91,592,881 (27) 2021 $ 49,694,300 (29) $ 53,010,498 (29) $ 62,212,834 (29) 2020 $ 36,186,740 (24) $ 36,441,612 (27) $106,794,252 (25) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timmy U Posted August 1 Share Posted August 1 You know who would really help Cleveland? Will Benson. Oops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timmy U Posted August 1 Share Posted August 1 Btw, anyone who throws on the Cleveland uniform is unhittable. Syndergaard has 4 shut out innings against the Stros. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted August 1 Share Posted August 1 5 minutes ago, Timmy U said: Btw, anyone who throws on the Cleveland uniform is unhittable. Syndergaard has 4 shut out innings against the Stros. Fantastic defense definitely helps. Sox probably score 5 runs on the Sox yesterday. Against Cleveland, 3 hits and 0 ER. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almagest Posted August 1 Share Posted August 1 7-2 Astros now. Guess he wasn’t that good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timmy U Posted August 1 Share Posted August 1 15 minutes ago, almagest said: 7-2 Astros now. Guess he wasn’t that good. Syndergaard gave up 1R in 5.1. Eli Morgan came in and got lit up. Some guy that just got off the IL named Yordan Alvarez hit a 3 run bomb to turn the game around. The Astros are coming tra la, tra la... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted August 1 Share Posted August 1 https://www.yahoo.com/sports/5-things-know-cleveland-guardians-203827296.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almagest Posted August 1 Share Posted August 1 I thought Bell would be leaving soon. Jean Segura though, YEESH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dominikk85 Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 Interesting deal. Manzardo had a very bad year after a monster year last season but I read that he had a shoulder injury bothering him since late June or so. So maybe if he can heal fully he can do better again and be the top hitting prospect he was. Civale also has injury risk and had worse seasons before. We will see how this ends up, did the guardians buy at the right time or did the rays sell before the ship has sunken completely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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