ZeroHour

:headshake Old Shoe rears his head in the paper. Garcia MB Loaiza Garland and Shoe. Thats your rotation when he comes back barring trades. Diaz could pitch lights out Saturday and I would still put him/Rauch in the pen with Cotts, they are both young and should be stretched out of the pen properly. Sox handling of Cotts is excellent and he should be a quality starter as a result. Shoe earned his spot in April and May and lost it to injury. He was pitching poorly yes, but those starts alone shouldnt be enough to kick him out for Diaz or Rauch. Poor pitching on his return should, and his comments/the staff's current status should keep him on a short leash as well. If the team is going to put their faith in a kid in the rotation over him in the five hole, I wouldnt be suprised if it was both the correct decision and places Shoe on the block. Diaz/Rauch good starts vs Shoe's average starts is pretty close and if a kid gets the call, it would be because they believe they would do a better job. I dont think Oz plays favorites when it comes to winning, especially if you talk out of school. Again, barring trades this is all moot. We trade for another quality innings man and Shoe doesnt want to be in the pen, im sorry but He Gone. :finger I would feel just as comfortble with him gone and a kid in the pen (or the traded). -zerohour

Familiar with Bp, they do grat work and Woolner is one of my favorite author's. I myself am a pretty firm believer in the "no effect" school, but I am bringing this up because I cannot remember a season in which this has been brought up more. It seems everytime a bonafied cookie is served up, everyone knows it before it leaves the pitchers hand (mainly Garland in his few digressions). Woolner admits that the effect is not completely discounted and discusses that it may be "below the radar of detection". I dont think I myself can quantify it, but I think that it should be considered when evaluating Olivo's true value, even if a more traditional means must be used in this case. Like I said before, perhaps there is something were not fully seeing here at work.

While I do not have exact stats to back this up at this very moment, I think it should be considered that while Olivo's five-tool potential was given up for Garcia, his loss may actually benefit the overall pitching staff. I present a hypthetical example (see if it sounds familiar): Jon Garland/Neal Cotts/Schoney on the mound and/or Olivo behind the plate in a game situation, hitters count, and they throw a changeup. Eveyone knows they will throw the changeup, and everyone knows its going to get clobbered. You know it, Farmer knows it, Hawk knows it, especially the hitter knows it. Afterwards, everyone bemoans the horrible pitch selection. I think of Garland's last few starts where he gives up a cookie in the 7th inning. Not a conspiracy theory, just something to be considered. Im not on the Davis bandwagon or anything, but game-calling was brought to everyone's attention as a factor in Olivo's easy departure. Loaiza and MB have both said on the record that one of the reasons they pitch so quickly is because they trust Sandy. Whatever he puts down, they can throw with confidence because they trust his judgement. More to come, I dont know if stats are possible, but just wanted to put this one out there. -ZeroHour

Im not one to wildly speculate rotisserie style, but a few things come to mind with all these Atlanta rumors swirling. The Braves want to dump salary. Jones and Ortiz are not long for the Braves due to their salaries and the Braves lack of true contention, they will be moved. These facts combine to point to a "White flag" style deal. (This is the same team that oculd not afford maddux/glavine/sheffield in recent years.) I would not be suprised if any combination of Jones/Ortiz/Estrada came to the whitesox for a basket of prospects and cash. A better way to look at this is to think of 2003 Alomar and Everett on the same team. We traded 4 prospects and cash for both of them. Meanwhile, you have that same team WITH MAGGS....RIGHT NOW (pending). you have to believe that Maggs is in play still, but you also have to think that if Atlanta wanted to add payroll, we wouldnt be having this discussion in the first place. The Atlanta Maggs for prospects flip is also possible, but that opens up the multi-team pandoras box. lets not go there. Sound the gong. ZeroHour

Sorry, in my haste last night I kept typing Wilson instead of Davis. Rookie mistake, but still no excuse. However, I still feel that side is a wash. Ben Davis is a catcher the sox have had their eye on and had similar hype to Olivo 2 years ago. Being stuck inside Seattle's cavern behind their own personal Alomar* didnt do him any favors. The only thing that isnt clear to me is Davis/cash from Seattle. Why not prospects for Garcia straight up? Im only reminded of Atlanta's refusal to pay as big a share of Ortiz' contract. Maggs/Davis/cash for Ortiz/Jones/Estrada? Even if thats a pipe dream, you have to think KW is dead serious when he says he will do everything to resign Garcia, which even the staunchest whiner says makes this a good trade. ZeroHour *One last thing, I love Sandy, he calls a good game and can still swing the bat, but you could compare his PT situation to Wilson's in Seattle for the same reasons, despite their age.

Because you just might get it. We want a pitcher. We want an ace. We want him for free? Trade Maggs too. Do it. You cant make Sox fans any madder because you cant make them happy unti lyou win it all. Olivo and Maggs for Garcia/Ortiz/A.Jones. you hand that to me and I take it. Use the money to resign Garcia/Ortiz and youre locked in. Olivo for Wilson is a wash right here right now, giving you Garcia for two prospects. This brings us back to the win now/later argument. There are multiple scenarios yet to play out (also involving contracts). However, do you people honestly think management sits around thinking "Hmm, how can we screw our fans?" Give the customer what they want. We all said we wanted a a pitcher, and that pitcher was usually Garcia. Ill give up a twice a week catacher and a prospect for that. No more wondering if well try to win. Bring it Twins. Bring it AL. Bring it on.