beck72

I'd like to see the sox sign a SS like Cliff Pennington, someone who can hit for avg, has speed and plays good defense I like the "Baseball Analysts" take on him comparing him with Russ Adams.--------- "The least-known player of the group is Cliff Pennington, known as a scrappy player that impresses scouts and statheads alike. Pennington has great contact skills, runs well, and shows very good defense up the middle. What power he has shown this season is unlikely to transfer over much professionally, though he could very well be hitting 30 doubles a year in the Bigs. I might go as far to say that Pennington is the most likely of the group to be a league-average player across the board in the Majors, as Cliff looks to be everything Russ Adams was coming out of college. "

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 11, 2005 -> 03:53 PM) I know he will stick with him, and that is kinda the right decision, but I still think we are expecting too much out of Dye, and he will be a bat off the bench by the end of the season. Sort of like Jay Payton We'll agree to disagree then. I think Dye has a lot left in the tank, and will have some big RBI's this yr. Dye had a great first half last year, hitting near .300 with good power. He tailed off at the end, esp in mid-August when he hurt his hand. He's very capable of carrying a team when he's hot. The Sox don't need him to carry them. They just need him to battle at the plate and play solid d. He should do both pretty soon.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 11, 2005 -> 03:50 PM) Agreed, thats how its going to unfold, I would like to see someone get some starts out there to see if maybe there can be a little bit of improvement. The only guys who would see some time in RF are Timo and maybe Carl. The ceiling isn't very high for either of them there. Dye is more likely to turn it around then to have them hit better than .250 or play strong defense, respectively. Anderson would likely only see time if an injury would occur to one of the sox starting OFers.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 11, 2005 -> 03:41 PM) I dont see how his 2004 season was solid, with his high strikeouts and low avg. And that season was just another decline from 2000. I believe there was only one other team who wanted him, and it was a last place team that was trying anything to get out of the gutter. As far as fluke injuries go, injuries are injuries, and some people are injury prone, look no further than across the city. I have seen several pazy plays from him already this season and a lack of fundamental and situational baseball. I just think its time to give someone else a shot and let him think about it, because you never know, someone might prosper when given a chance. (brian roberts) Dye was signed early in the offseason, right after the A's declined arb with him. He'd likely have gotten a lot of interest if he had waited to sign. A pitcher with poor mechanics may deserve the tag "injury prone", or someone who has the same recurring injury happen season after season. This is far different than an OFer who breaks his leg, hand or misses time due to injuries on different parts of the body

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 11, 2005 -> 01:36 PM) JUst because he is a vet, doesnt mean he will perform. He will perform as he has been performing, which is declining in the end of his career. So if you say he will stick with Jermaine because he is a vet, that doesnt mean much to me, Mike Jackson was a vet last year, were you preaching to stay with him? It doesn't matter what I'd do or you'd do. Ozzie is going to stick with Dye for a long while, because he's a proven hitter who's going through a slump. If it's more than a slump, then Dye won't see much time after the allstar break. And Jim H addressed the age issue. I think a month and a half is too soon to judge if a player is washed up. It's not like Dye's not 37 or 38, is slow, old and is overmatched on both sides of the field.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 11, 2005 -> 02:42 PM) Dye's best years were in KC, which is in the midwest. I dont need more months to evaluate Dye's performance, give me the lat 2 year to evaluate how effective he has been, or the last several to show his steady decline, whichever you like. You may not need more time to evaluate Dye. But the guy who makes the decisions is Ozzie. And he'll give him time to work through his slow start, like he has with Rowand, Crede and PK, as long as he doesn't have more brain cramps in the field. So you're stuck with Dye getting the majority of time in RF until at least the all star break

QUOTE(Indywallin @ May 11, 2005 -> 01:13 PM) Bring up Anderson or put Ozuna/Harris out there. Certainly doesn't help matters that Rowand is off to another slow start. Just keeping it real. Your scenarios are just not going to happen. Ozzie will stick with the vet who has proven himself over a number of years as he should over a AAA prospect or a utility guy. That's keeping it real

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ May 11, 2005 -> 01:14 PM) How much better would that franchise look if they hold sold the farm to get Randy Johnson for the playoffs? Sometimes you have to sieze the bull by the horns, especially if you aren't a big market team who can afford to wait a year. How would Wagner have looked last night? Just sayin. If the sox had a guy like Wagner, Hermanson would have worked the 9th, possibly the 10th last night. With a closer, Hermanson would see more work, not less. And getting a guy like Wagner wouldn't cost the sox their farm system. Just one top prospect. that does make a difference, if the Sox had to trade 2 or 3 top guys instead of only one.

QUOTE(rangercal @ May 11, 2005 -> 12:58 PM) Prediction : sox 8 tb 1 Sounds good to me

QUOTE(rangercal @ May 11, 2005 -> 12:45 PM) well... it is Tampa and accounted for almost 1/4 of our losses so far. Any team can lose a game like Monday's, after travelling cross country, sweeping another team, having less energy, and playing like s***. Last night's game was a matter of the Sox gift wrapping TB a win with 9 walks and 1 hit batter. My bet is the Sox look better today and this too shall pass

QUOTE(Dick Allen @ May 11, 2005 -> 05:19 AM) Next year Dye will be worse than Jason Giambi currently is. No non-steriod using player deserves to be tagged with the "Jason Giambi" label.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 10, 2005 -> 08:35 PM) Backing a young player who hasnt lived up to his potential is one thing, thinking that an aging veteran will bounce back to his year 2000 potential is another. I am backing a former allstar completely healthy for the first time in years, who works hard and plays the game right. Dye's ability to post decent numbers even when he's not 100% shows me he's a guy to stick with. If you don't, fine. To each his own

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ May 11, 2005 -> 08:44 AM) I take your point. You guys really want to win now, and I don't blame you. I'm just looking out for the future because I don't want us to be in the bottom half of this division (although I don't think that's going to happen). A team to look at through all of this is Minny. Now they haven't really made any big deals at the deadline (remember last year Kubel for Benson), and they keep winning the division. Joe Mauer, Jason Bartlett, Jesse Crain and Justin Morneau show how important it is to have good, young players. Gives you so much more flexibility with the makeup of your team. On the flip side, Minny hasn't been able to get to a world series with their non-deals at the trade deadline. though Minny's consistency is something to admire, not taking some risks has its drawbacks.

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ May 11, 2005 -> 02:58 AM) Its kind of ironic that Konerko has a long looping swing where his hands are up around his head. And now Dye who was a great fastball hitter last year, has a nice long looping swing where his hands are high up. They kind of remind me of Crede and Borchard last year both with long looping swings. This pull baseball crap is getting old. Line drive swings are fine. Line drive swings dont slump as much. I find it ironic that Konerko changed his swing for more power in his contract year. Too bad Ross Gload is hurt or we could start benching these guys. Bring up Anderson to play RF and bench Dye. Bring up McCarthy and pull Contreras into the bullpen so he can walk people in mop up games. Release Shingo. We dont need to stick with another Koch/Jackson because he will get it. We pitched Jackson last year into August. Glad to see no one is making too much out of two straight losses

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 10, 2005 -> 08:37 PM) Yeah cause Dye never played in the midwest that it may take a guy from a warmer climate some time to adjust to hitting in Chicago isn't so crazy. If Dye is hitting .200 come July in more ab's, then your points may be more valid. A month and half of baseball is too soon to judge a players' performance. Just like I'm not waiting for Garland to win the Cy young in May, we shouldn't look to cast Dye in the Jason Giambi scrap heap

QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ May 10, 2005 -> 08:19 PM) Until another midseason approaches where Sox are near or atop of the division, and then this attitude changes. Again. In two years we'll be holding this same exact debate about "prospects being prospects" and "having to win now." If Williams is intent on modeling an organizational philosophy in-line with Minnesota, you simply don't trade solid prospects for three month rentals. Any else ever in awe when Minnesota continually promotes prospects will instantly contribute to the team? Well, they tend to develop talent. And not trade them away every midseason to "push them over the top." Minnesota also has shown they are a player or two away from getting to and winning a world series. They don't like to trade their minor league talent during the season and it probably has cost them

I started the "Joe Crede Support Group", and he turned into the hottest sox hitter. So I'm starting the "Jermaine Dye Support Group". He hasn't had the best start. But neither has a few other guys on the sox. Let's give him the benefit of the doubt like we are with the guys we know better. Just a reminder, Dye: signed with the Sox for less money than he could have made elsewhere, because he was a man of his word; overcame a serious injury to get back; has postseason experience; can play sides of the ball, with some good pop; and is by all accounts healthy. If he still sucks come June or July, we'll disband. But either way, he's a member of the Sox for the next two yrs. Go Jermaine!

QUOTE(JimH @ May 10, 2005 -> 07:43 PM) I don't think either Guillen or KW agree with you, especially since they signed Dye to a 2 year deal plus an option year. Dye's 2004 was decent, certainly not great, but he's got a better track record than a rookie. Nothing against Brian Anderson, many on this site know I like him and his potential. What you're suggesting though, is not how Guillen and KW operate, they show a great deal of confidence in their players and give them a chance to work through the tough times. I can safely say that if a solid, proven veteran is yanked after one month for a rookie ... this will have an adverse effect on the morale of other veterans. Personally I believe Dye has already had his career year (2000 - KC) but I also believe he will be a key cog in whatever success this team experiences down the line. As will Carl Everett, whom many on this site chalked up to less than worthless this past offseason. But I do agree, Dye needs to step it up. Well said. I too think Dye will come around. Anderson won't come near Chi, unless an injury happens or as a Sept. callup

QUOTE(qwerty @ May 10, 2005 -> 08:06 PM) .240 last three years against righties says it all to me. What I'm saying is Ozzie will stick with Dye, as long his defense improves.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 10, 2005 -> 07:57 PM) I dont understand where you can come up with Dye will be fine. He hasnt been producing the last few years, and is showing the signs of a serious decline. While we have a few players on our bench, and a SERIOUS propspect who is hitting over 300 with several hr's in AAA. Because Dye has performed well over the years, esp when healthy. By all accounts, he's healthy now. With the weather warming up, Dye's numbers will as well. Rowand, another CA guy like Dye, also has started slow in April and May. Playing in Chicago/ midwest in the spring may take getting used to.

QUOTE(santo=dorf @ May 10, 2005 -> 06:02 PM) Yeah I'd do it. We would get two compensation picks for Wagner leaving us at the end of the season too. Wouldn't the sox only get picks if they offered him arbitration? With his $9 mill contract, the sox wouldn't offer him arb.

QUOTE(sox-r-us @ May 10, 2005 -> 07:49 PM) Agreed 100%. Get a big bat somewhere....most likely at RF (trade Dye in the deal) or CF (bench Rowand as a late inning replacement/pinch hitter....too inconsistent) Frank Thomas. Rowand will come around, as will Dye.

QUOTE(ISF @ May 10, 2005 -> 07:46 PM) This is insane. We are 24-8, our pitching has been the best in the AL, we have 3 or 4 guys that can close a game, and we're talking about possible deadline deals for a closer? What in the hell do we need a closer for? Is there someone out there with a better ERA than 0.00? Hermanson was a bargain, and Takatsu is still doing ok. Marte and Politte both look very good. Spending 9 mil on a bullpen guy would be utter foolishness. It's about looking toward a playoff appearance, and getting the bullpen in the best possible shape to beat any team in a short series. The fact that the Sox have a versatile bullpen bodes well for the rest of the season. But, if the Sox had a chance to get an impact player, that would add to the team and the bullpen without disrupting the work these guys have done, a closer like Wagner could be a good fit. Few moves could be made that wouldn't disrupt team chemistry. This, IMO could be one of the few.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 10, 2005 -> 06:41 PM) who's to say that Anderson isnt better than Dye THIS year. Dye is finished, his decline has become more and more evident. Im sick of people saying that he is under pressure to perform with his new team, hmmmm seems to be killing gooch, spod, hermy, viz, AJ, Duque. Dye will be fine. Unless an OFer goes down to injury, anderson won't come near Chi. this year.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ May 10, 2005 -> 06:09 PM) For the first time in a long time, when KW put this team together in the offseason, I was feeling like he really was not only assembling a team for this year, but he was assembling a full plan for the next few years. He put Dye in RF on a very short and fairly cheap contract until Anderson was ready, and he put Podsednik in LF as a trial to see how he could do for little money and to hold the place until Sweeney was ready. In 2 years, our outfield was set up to look like Sweeney, Rowand, Anderson (I don't know the order), and that's a pretty good setup. Right now the OF looks like Pods, Rowand and Dye for the next two, maybe more yrs. Esp Pods, as he's the leadoff hitter/ catalyst. Pods stays near his numbers now and the Sox will probably sign him to a 2, 3 yr deal. That leaves out a guy like Anderson, with his RH bat. Sweeney is more likely to stick around for RF, after 2006 when Dye's contract is up.