beck72

QUOTE(Wedge @ Jun 2, 2005 -> 08:53 PM) I hope KW holds out to not include McCarthy. I'm not sure if the deal can get done, otherwise, however. Looking at the A's SP's in the minors, they'd want BMac. Besides Dan Meyer and his 6 + era in AAA, they have no one

A BIG factor to consider is--have the Sox had their fill of Joe Crede? If they have--after working with him and finally convincing him to make some changes--then getting a long term fix for a key position [where the sox don't have a Plan B--Josh Fields is probably two yrs away at best] does serve this organization for the short and long term

QUOTE(sox-r-us @ Jun 2, 2005 -> 07:19 PM) Honestly, who else would be interested in getting Chavez if Oakland did dangle him? Out of all of the contending teams this year as of now: AL: Not the Yanks with Pay Rod Not the Bo Sox with Mueller Not the Rangers with Blaylock Not the Angels with Dallas McPherson Not the Os with Mora hitting 0.297 Not the Twinkies with Cuddyer and with limited payroll NL: Not the Cards with Rolen Not the Braves with Chipper Jones Not the Marlins with Lowell Not the Giants with Alfonso hitting 0.328 (and the As would never trade him to Giants, it would hurt them big time with city popularity) Not the Cubs with Aramis Ramirez Not the Padres with Blum hitting 0.296 Not the LA Dodgers with Perez hitting 0.422 Not the Dbacks with Troy Glaus I just do not see anyone else seriously being interested in Chavez, hence we should use the leverage to our advantage. Hopefully, Kenny screws Beane who has to be desperate to trade him to us. well done. Not only are there few teams in need, they must also have the talent Oakland wants [most likely, a major league ready SP and position players]. If Beane does want to trade Chavez, the sox have to among those with the will and ability to get a deal done.

His laughing at Patrick's question "How's Moneyball look now?" was a direct hit at Beane. Chavez's comment along the lines of 'Travis Lee said the same thing to me last night' can't sit well in Oak. Beane can't have the face of the A's laughing at him. He won't last 'til the AS break there

Patrick callled him "one of my favorite guests--ask a question, get an honest answer"

Here's some thoughts/ info from the A's mlb.com board: ------------------------------------------ From: galraen 12:39 pm To: badogg (8 of 29) 37082.8 in reply to 37082.2 Whilst one should always treat anything written by a reporter with deep suspicion there might actually be a flicker of flame behind this smoke. Only a few weeks ago Chavy was asked if he would have signed the new contract if he's known that Huddy and Mulder were going to be traded, he said he no, he wouldn't have! A lot of his 'body language' speak of a person who is not a happy camper, this could be just down to his horrible form, or have other causes. I think he feels betrayed by the A's, and Billy Beane in particular. Where is the power righty Billy is supposed to have promised Eric he would get? Also bear in mind that there have been a lot of personel changes in the club over the last year or so, the 'chemistry' has inevitably changed, and I suspect Chavy no longer feels as comfortable as he would like.I also don't think he's comfortable with the 'team leader' tag others keep pinning on him, I don't think he likes or wants the role. I get the impression he's much happier being a follower than a leader. So it wouldn't surprise me if he does want out, but do I buy the bit about him fueling the trade rumours? I wouldn't believe a reporter who told me the sky was blue, I'd immediately go outside to check! I'll end with an old reporter sign-off No 30 (it means story not over, more to folow) --------------------------------------------- If he's not a "happy camper", it's more likely Beane will trade him sooner rather than later

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Jun 2, 2005 -> 05:50 PM) Plus his value is a bit lower when he isnt lighting it up. On the flipside, though, Beane could pull the trigger and deal Chavez before the deadline based on his past numbers, like Olney wrote. If Chavez has been struggling for over 3 months, it could mean chavez is hurt or in a really bad slump, which would certainly lower his value another factor, the earlier the trade happens the less money Oakland is on the hook for Chavez's salary this year.

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Jun 2, 2005 -> 05:50 PM) Plus his value is a bit lower when he isnt lighting it up. very true

QUOTE(Frankensteiner @ Jun 2, 2005 -> 05:35 PM) I guess I don't really understand the logic of adding a guy having a down year when the roster is full of guys having down years. Because most proven vets having down years will probably rebound---Dye, PK, Everett, AJ. Chavez is a proven vet who also is likely to rebound. But unproven guys like Crede, Uribe, [even Pods and Rowand fit into this category] may not. If the Sox can get a proven young guy who has superb defense, and can hit for power and avg from the left side, the sox would have one less question mark in their everyday lineup.

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Jun 2, 2005 -> 05:26 PM) Our BA is bad against righties because most of them throw our righties away and they are incapable of not pulling the outside pitch. Over most sox starters careers [with the exception of Everett] I think you'll find they have hit better vs LHP than RHP. FWIW, Maggs and Lee hit RHP and LHP equally well in years past. My biggest point was that Chavez would be a great improvement over Crede, esp. vs RHP--the type of pitchers the sox face the most [they have near 1200 ab's vs RHP and about 410 vs LHP]. The need is there this year. And it makes sense to try and improve in an area of need.

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Jun 2, 2005 -> 05:21 PM) I know everyone loves Chavez because he has a great glove and has had a good stick. But where this season has he done a damn thing to warrant giving up our best prospects. I think most people around here think it would be one of Anderson or Bmac and another prospect in the top ten. One position player, one pitcher + Crede. For a guy of Chavez's caliber, locked up for four more years, top talent would need to be traded. Also, Chavez would be a good long term fit to go along with the sox young guys--Rowand, Uribe, and guys who may stay on a few more yrs--Pods, AJ, Iguchi. Chavez wouldn't just be a short term fix but part of the sox long term plans as well

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Jun 2, 2005 -> 05:20 PM) We would still have Bartolo No, we wouldn't have. Not for the kind of money Ana/ LA threw at him.

Per ESPN, as of today, in the AL vs. RHP, the sox are 13th in avg, 14th in OBP, 13th in SLG, 11th in Runs, and 12th in XBH. Even if /when Dye, PK, Frank, et al catch fire, most guys have hit lower vs RHP in their careers. Getting an everyday player who hurts RHP would help lift the Sox offense. If he's healthy, no doubt Chavez would be an improvement over Crede vs RHP.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Jun 2, 2005 -> 05:13 PM) that is exctly what we need, say yes to this trade If only we had a say

Who knows if this trade will work out, but Chavez is what the sox need. His numbers vs. RHP over the last three years [.293/.384/.554] would help the sox address their biggest weakness---hitting RHP. [Last time I checked, the so were 12th in the AL vs RHP---with a low avg, obp and slg--- and 3rd vs. LHP]. And good to great RHP is what the Sox would face in the playoffs if they make it there.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Jun 2, 2005 -> 04:16 PM) Ya, I agree with this now. At first when I heard this rumor I wanted Bmac to be untouchable and I still want to hold onto him if all possible but if we could get a guy like Chavez you have to go for it. I too was thinking BMac would be untouchable this year. But the Sox could get a 5th starter type and put him in AAA as the insurance policy for an injury to one of the 5 SP's. Right now, Robert Person, Jon Adkins or Sean Tracey aren't exactly options for winning games in the majors.

QUOTE(santo=dorf @ Jun 2, 2005 -> 03:58 PM) Chavez is not worth a $30+ million commitment and giving up some of our top talent. The sox have no LH power guys even close to the majors. If they can get Chavez, his bat and his defense at 3b are worth the big contract. Is Chavez worth is contract compared to other guys like Beltre, Mike Lowell, Troy Glaus? I'd say definitely yes. Would Chavez's contract fit better on the sox than what PK can probably expect to get in 2006? Esp with a JT Snow like option at 1b in Ross Gload, and some money can be used to sign AJ to a decent deal? IMO, yes. as far as the talent to be traded, Bmac would be the hardest guy to lose. But does he project as a dominating #1 SP? Probably not. He's solid, probably a #3.

A few things: *The sox won't go to a 4 man rotation. This wouldn't be an option *I would think Oakland needs more help with its everyday lineup than its pitching. Anderson might be as valuable for them as BMac

Oakland needs a guy like Brian Anderson [a RH batter who hits for power and avg, good OBP, and defense] even more than they need a guy like BMac. A deal like Crede, Anderson and Sean Tracey could get it done. No way would the asking price be the Sox top 2 prospects and a major league 3b man. A top prospect, another in the top 10, and Crede should be enough.

QUOTE(Milkman delivers @ Jun 1, 2005 -> 05:49 PM) "I signed this deal knowing i will be on a contending team, and once the A's become a non-contending team I expects to be dealt to a contender." Cmon, that doesn't sound like he wants to get out of there at all? It sounds like he knows that the A's won't want to pay his salary if they aren't a playoff contending team. Going by Mulder's and Hudson's deals, why should Chavez expect Beane to keep his even larger salary around if the A's aren't going to the playoffs for a few years?

QUOTE(sox-r-us @ Jun 1, 2005 -> 10:55 PM) Ok, but Macowiak has hit 0.244, 0.270 and 0.246 the last 3 years with 16,6, and 17 HRs So his #s over the years are no better than Vinny's. Maybe he too is playing over his head? You get Mackowiak with him playing vs RHP where his splits have been very good. And Crede stays for his defense

Looking at last yrs game log, Eddie was shut down for the rest of the yr right after the trade deadline. His last game was July 31st. Like they were shopping him and didn't get any takers. And his last 3 games he got lit up.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jun 1, 2005 -> 04:05 PM) I think almost anyone here would love to have Everyday Eddie in our pen. That said...I can't see it happening. Last year, the Mariners were even worse than this year, and there were 3 guys that they refused to consider moving: Jamie Moyer, Ichiro, and Everyday Eddie. If they weren't going to move him last year, I have a lot of trouble thinking that they'll move him this year. Although, if we could get him without giving up BMac or another outfielder (do they need a replacement for Reed yet?), then it would probably be a deal that I'd be pretty happy with. Wasn't Eddy hurt last yr at the deadline?

QUOTE(quade36 @ Jun 1, 2005 -> 03:59 PM) Don't give up on Vizciano or Shingo just yet. At least Shingo throws more than 1 pitch. Vizcaino hasn't been fooling anyone, from spring training on, esp with that slider on the outside corner. With other teams looking for bullpen help, someone may take a chance on Luis.

QUOTE(TheDybber @ Jun 1, 2005 -> 03:56 PM) Is he your set-up guy for Hermanson? Or vice-versa? Would Everyday Eddie demand to be the closer when he got here? If that situation was sorted out before he got here, I would take him. If Guardado had the attitude for being both a set up man and a closer, pitching whenever and where ever the sox needed him [coming in for tie games and for save situations, as co-closers with Dustin] they should try and get him. I'd bet KW would lean on AJ for advice/ insight on Eddie if it came that far.