Roe and Garry Listeners

[mreye]

Chcago Tribune

 

Long story, sorry.

 

 

 

 

RADIO SILENCE

14 months ago, GARRY MEIER left the airwaves in a contract dispute. He says he's happy with his decision and is planning his return. But has his time run out?

 

By Patrick Kampert

Tribune staff reporter

Published March 22, 2005

 

 

For someone who has been off the air for more than a year, radio personality Garry Meier still attracts attention.

 

As he walks across the lobby of the Four Seasons hotel on a recent evening, he's recognized by a middle-age man who introduces Meier to his teenage sons and reminisces with him about Meier and Steve Dahl's infamous "Disco Demolition" event in 1979.

 

"You think people are going to forget and, thank God, they haven't," said Meier, 55, seated at a table in the lounge. "It's gratifying when people stop you and compliment you because you're a part of their daily life for a long time. You feel like you know them and they know you. It's a nice exchange."

 

The last time most people caught a glimpse of Meier, he was lashing out at his former employer, WLS-AM 890, and Roe Conn, his afternoon talk-show partner of eight years, in an interview last June with Bob Sirott on WTTW-Ch. 11's "Chicago Tonight."

 

Though his trademark intensity came through on several occasions in discussing the series of events that brought his successful Chicago radio career to a halt -- sources say he turned down a guaranteed five-year contract worth more than $7 million a year because his bitterness toward WLS and Conn -- he claims he is not looking back.

 

I was happy with the decision last year, and I'm even happier with it this year," he said.

 

It was Meier's second radio partnership to dissolve. In 1993, he ended a 15-year friendship with Steve Dahl and left the lucrative "Steve and Garry" franchise after Dahl made disparaging comments about Meier's wife, commercial real-estate broker Cynthia Fircak, while the couple were on their honeymoon.

 

Some radio insiders say WLS bungled the Conn-Meier negotiations by taking Meier off the team in January 2004, five weeks before his contract was set to expire, setting up an awkward situation in which Conn remained on the air and on the payroll.

 

Meier says the station's bosses, who no longer are with the company, complicated matters by refusing his pleas for face-to-face meetings, relying instead on occasional faxes, e-mails and phone calls to negotiate. Finally, in June, the Conn-Meier team imploded.

 

"I like things to be organic," Meier explained. "When there are that many obstacles, it seems to me to be a sign not to sign [the contract]."

 

Meier, who dabbled as a radio solo act and as a WGN-Ch. 9 correspondent after he left Dahl, admits he works best as part of a team.

 

"It's a lot easier to do when you're bouncing off somebody else," he said. "It's more natural."

 

Michael Harrison, publisher of Talkers magazine, says the growth of the news-talk format remains a hot trend in radio and that Meier's name and reputation should help him get back on the air.

 

But he says radio personalities can't afford to be off the air for too long, and Meier's exile has stretched to 14 months.

 

"It's very difficult in show business if you fall off the radar screen for a while because of our cultural short-term memory," Harrison said.

 

Conn says Meier was terrific to work with -- "the greatest counter puncher ever in radio"-- through their eight-year partnership.

 

"On the air, he's a consummate professional, just a pleasure to be around," Conn said. "When it came down to how we do our business, we obviously look at that in two totally separate ways."

 

Longtime radio executive Harvey Wells, who ran WXRT and WSCR for years and now heads Newsweb's "Nine FM" stations, said Meier was seen as the "good guy" in the Dahl meltdown. But, he added, the second breakup may not be as easy to explain away.

 

"I believe the audience may not view his departure from Roe the same way as they viewed his departure from Steve," Wells said.

 

Wells said Meier would fit well on any talk station in town, or on a music station's morning show, which tends to be more talk than tunes. But even though both sides are far apart, Wells says a reunion with Conn would be the most logical way out of this situation.

 

"I think the best thing that could happen is for somebody at WLS to sit Roe and Garry down in a room and try to put Humpty Dumpty together again," said Wells. "I think that would be best for the show and I think the audience would accept him far better. That's the absolute best and simplest way for Garry's career to get resurrected without much damage. Having to rebuild a third time would be very, very difficult."

 

Meier himself says he is not through with radio and hopes to stay in Chicago, his lifelong home, and has put together what he calls a "blueprint" for his return to "radio and other media."

 

"I'm going to be working this year one way or another," he declared, but he declined to be any more specific.

 

Break from Chicago

 

After the breakup with Conn, Meier left town with his wife (who now serves as his agent), and their 7-year-old daughter. They spent the summer traveling. Meier says the break, coming after a quarter-century of success as first Dahl's partner and then Conn's, was important.

 

"I have not been out of town that long in my entire life," he said. "So this was a definite departure from the old routine and it was great."

 

Meier said he had several offers after he rejected WLS' contract proposal but is glad he turned them down as well. Again, he declined to offer any other specifics on these proposals.

 

"When it all blew up last year, I thought, `The worst thing I can do now is react out of a rebound situation,'" he said. "The worst thing I can do is grab something to show people, `Oh, boy, I'm going to have a job.' I didn't want to do that. I wanted to take the amount of time necessary to make the right decision because this is going to be, conservatively, the next 10 years of my career."

 

Meier says the last 12 months have flown by, and he has grown accustomed to routines far from his broadcasting life.

 

Each day, he takes his daughter to school. He runs errands. He watches TV programs he has TiVoed from the night before and reads the papers, still mentally making notes about what topics would make for humorous radio with his rapier wit.

 

"The only frustration now is when you have things in the news that you want to comment on," he said. "I don't have a forumfor that. My daughter and wife and friends have heard the stuff but they're kind enough to keep listening and not complain."

 

Meier says he wants to keep his mind sharp for the next job, but insists there is no hurry.

 

"I know we're all very much geared to get the next job and keep on going," he admitted. "[but] as Lily Tomlin once said, `Even if you win the rat race, you're still a rat.'"

 

If the clock is not ticking, the meter may be.

 

Fired his agent

 

During the lengthy negotiations with WLS, Meier fired his agent, Todd Musburger, two weeks after Musburger negotiated a 10-year, $12 million offer that Meier turned down. (Conn says he rejected that deal as well because of certain conditions in the contract.) Musburger sued Meier to get paid for the hours he spent negotiating for the radio star. A year later, that case has not been settled. At a status hearing 10 days ago, Meier attorney Michael Pedicone officially withdrew from the case after he, too, was asked to step down by his client.

 

Musburger and Meier both declined to comment on the case.

 

Meier's friends say he's an original who is sometimes misunderstood.

 

"He is ferociously principled; he's brought new meaning to `lone wolf' in his principles. It seems to me he's made many eyes I know roll upward into their skulls," said Bill Zehme, godfather of Meier's daughter and author of "The Way Your Wear Your Hat; Frank Sinatra and the Lost Art of Livin'." "And I think he knows it. He finds his place in the firmament, and he understands it to be awkward, but he believes it's also proud."

 

Restaurateur Rich Melman, founder of Lettuce Entertain You Enterprises, says Meier is "honorable," and proved it when he chose principle over cash by walking away from millions.

 

"I admire his ability to stand up for what he thinks is right," Melman said. "I don't know a lot of people who would do the same thing."

 

After months of negotiations, Meier walked away from the aforementioned seven-figure deal. Conn and other friends failed to convince Meier to come back. Conn eventually signed, a move Meier found traitorous. His rejection of the megabucks deal astounded friends and industry observers.

 

"I think, professionally, more than a few of his friends doubted his sanity in persevering with his cause as righteously as he has," Zehme said. "Money seemed not to be an option for him over honor. It's sort of breathtaking."

 

"I turned down a good amount of money because it wasn't right. That's all," Meier said. "I know I sound odd to some people -- I'm sorry, but it's not the way I wanted to do it. Nobody has to pay my bills but me."

 

But when Meier takes a stand, there usually are others left in his wake who are befuddled as to what just hit them. Dahl talked about Meier on the air for years after the split, although he did not return calls for comment on this article. Now, Conn has joined that peculiar fraternity of spurned friends.

 

"I've talked to everybody in the aftermath of this, because I can't figure it out," said Conn, seated in a conference room at the WLS studios. "I still wonder about this. There are moments I will wake up and I'll go, `What happened?'"

 

Conn remains an admirer of Meier the broadcaster.

 

"I loved every minute that we were together on the air," Conn said. "Every day I worked with Garry, I walked away going, `Damn, that was funny.' It was a great run."

 

But he's hurt and angry about Meier the person.

 

"I feel betrayed," Conn said. "I've been very respectful of his memory, both publicly and personally. And I can say he has not been. Not only did he go on Channel 11 and was not respectful, but he's said things about me to many people who have then picked up the phone and called me -- which is something he should be very careful about."

 

Despite his partner troubles, broadcast executives still think Meier has much to offer Chicago audiences.

 

"Garry is a great guy and a special radio talent," said Larry Wert, president and general manager of WMAQ-Ch. 5 who once was Dahl and Meier's boss. "As a listener and a friend, I regret that he is not on the air right now. Heck, I still miss Steve and Garry."

 

Infinity executive Drew Hayes, who oversees both WBBM-AM 780 and WSCR-AM 670, added: "Garry has had two careers that most on-air personalities only dream about -- they dream about one, and he's had two. I would never bet against him to make it three."

 

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Roe and Garry: A duo's demise

 

The Roe Conn-Garry Meier partnership began to unravel in January 2004, when WLS-AM 890 pulled Meier off the air five weeks before his contract was set to expire.

 

One day, Meier says, he was euphoric. The "Roe and Garry" show had marked its eighth anniversary, and he thought he was on the cusp of signing the biggest deal of his career. And the next?

 

"The next day, I'm sitting in an office and they're telling me to leave my building pass on the table," Meier said glumly. "I just felt like total dog [manure]." Perhaps his bosses were concerned that Meier would have publicly aired his contract complaints on his show as he did in 1999 -- WLS took him off the air then as well, but only after his contract expired. But Zemira Jones, who was president and general manager of WLS at the time, says those tactics were company policy and that Meier and his agent had been told months before that he'd be silenced if no deal was reached as the deadline neared.

 

Whomever you believe, the move dealt a blow from which the Conn-Meier team never recovered. Meier turned down WLS' final offer in June 2004. WLS' execs would not last the year either--but not before the afternoon team was destroyed and the morning duo of Don Wade and Roma (who also were yanked from the air during contract talks) almost left for the reborn news-talk WIND-AM 560.

 

"I think that was absolute insanity by the old WLS management to do that to him," Conn said. "And, certainly, in terms of making a deal possible, it caused them no end of trouble."

 

`Protest Mondays'

 

It provided plenty of heartache for Conn as well. Because his contract expired four months later, he was still on the air and drawing a paycheck. But he insisted repeatedly on the air that he and Meier would be back together on WLS or some other station.

 

"I called it the `Roe and Garry Show,'" Conn said. "I took four protest Mondays off. We hit a [contract] bonus in that period of time -- the show shot back to No. 1 and Garry had been off the air save one day of that. And I went to the company and said, `We're done talking about anything unless you pay him that ratings bonus.'

 

"Garry didn't ask me to do that. I just knew it was the right thing."

 

But with Meier off the air, the duo's relationship became more distant, Conn said. After Meier fired his agent, Todd Musburger, he made his wife, commercial real estate broker CynthiaFircak, his new negotiator. Conn said he and Meier rarely had one-on-one discussions after that.

 

"Between January and May of 2004, I'd say I talked to Garry alone twice," Conn said. "Every other time, it was with Cynthia. I'd ask him out to lunch, and they'd both arrive."

 

Meier says his wife has been unfairly blamed for the demise of his partnerships with Dahl and, now, Conn.

 

"My poor wife, for no reason, took the brunt of all this," he said. "You talk to anybody that she negotiated with, I guarantee they will say nothing but good things about her."

 

Two Chicago station bosses said their dealings with Fircak were no different than their negotiations with other agents. But Conn says Fircak also stopped communicating with his agent, George Hiltzik, because she claimed that Hiltzik insulted her.

 

Conn said he spoke with Fircak several times a week between January and June. Negotiations came to a head in late May as Conn's contract neared expiration. Despite the emotional upheaval, sources say that Conn and Meier were each offered a five-year deal worth more than $7 million in guaranteed money, without some of the conditions that made an earlier 10-year, $12 million deal less appealing.

 

Conn wanted to take the deal. But Meier said he still didn't like some of the clauses and, more important, wanted the pay to be retroactive to January, when he was forced off the air.

 

"I believe [the Meiers] just didn't believe us," said Jones, who now is an exec with Radio One in Washington, D.C. ""Sometimes air personalities, because of bad experiences in the past, get caught up in thinking, `All managers are bad. All corporations are out to get you.'"

 

Bidding game

 

Meier says he wanted Conn to let his contract expire for a couple of weeks to drive up the bidding. But Conn says WLS contractually had the right to match any offer the duo brought them, and all were substantially less than the five-year WLS deal that was on the table.

 

They argued for a week. Conn said he told Meier, "If we don't take this, where will we go, what will we do?" Meier's reply, he said, was, "I don't know. But it's just not right. It's a toxic environment."

 

Conn says he and the Meiers were getting quite angry with each other at this point.

 

"I needed to have cooler heads prevail," Conn said. "I thought if we had professionals step in here, maybe they'll be able to come up with a bridge or a meeting or something."

 

Taking the offer

 

So he had his lawyer send a letter to Meier's lawyer, stating that Conn intended to take the offer and again asked Meier to come with him.

 

"I have needs in this too," Conn said. "He was asking me to be more loyal to his anger than to the realities of the situation, or to our staff, or to anything else. I needed to express to them that, `Now, I need you to be loyal to me.'"

 

Conn felt he'd proven his loyalty with his on-air declarations, his refusal to listen to solo offers, and with demanding that Meier get the bonus. Meier felt he'd proven his loyalty to partnerships when he quit a station after Dahl was fired. He expected the same in Conn.

 

Meier's response to the lawyer's letter, according to Conn, was a two-page, single-spaced missive, "during which he made assumptions and accusations that I thought were totally wrong and unfair."

 

Conn responded with a short note to Meier that he dropped off at Meier's condo.

 

"I sent him a letter, a very short one, once again asking him to reconsider, and asking him -- I'm paraphrasing here -- `Don't let a manager you don't like take you out of a job you do like.'"

 

Conn still hadn't signed the contract. For the next week, sources say, radio executives from other stations tried unsuccessfully to persuade Meier to take the offer.

 

Meier denies any intervention took place, but says he has no regrets about the way he handled the situation.

 

Conn eventually signed the contract. Meier did not. A week later, WLS' Jones was out of the picture. He says Meier's greed got in the way.

 

"We put a boatload of money in front of them," said Jones. "An old, wise accountant told me a long time ago that it's the fattest pigs that get slaughtered first--they try to get it all."

 

Meier begs to differ.

 

"If I'm so greedy," he asked, "why am I the one that didn't take it?"

 

An unfortunate ending

 

Conn says he and his on-air partners, Jim Johnson and Christina Filiaggi, are doing their best to rebuild the show. It remains in second place in its afternoon time slot, which is where the Roe-and-Garry team often finished, though its ratings share has dipped slightly from 5.2 to 4.7 without Meier.

 

"Everybody's stepped up and everybody's working really hard," Conn said.

 

During the mornings, as he prepares for the show in his office at home, Conn says he's surrounded by memorabilia of the "Roe and Garry" show, including a national honor, the Radio & Records News/Talk Industry Achievement Award, that the duo won as 2003 talk-show hosts of the year. He thought about taking the souvenirs down, but decided it was a nice reminder of a meaningful part of his life.

 

"It's funny," he said. "I'll sit there on the phone in the morning and I've got this picture of Garry looking back at me."

 

-- Patrick Kampert

[The Critic]

Interesting how Meier fought every attempt by Conn to protect him from himself.

That contract was insane money for a second banana.

He may find another job, but I doubt he'll find anywhere near that much money.

[Kid Gleason]

Well, he'll find a ton more of the money if he went back with Dahl. I myself would start listening to Dahl again if Garry was back. Those guys were amazing together. I never listened to Conn though, so I am not too sure what that was like. But honestly, hasn't Garry always seemed a little loopy to all of us?

[The Critic]

Well, he'll find a ton more of the money if he went back with Dahl. I myself would start listening to Dahl again if Garry was back. Those guys were amazing together. I never listened to Conn though, so I am not too sure what that was like. But honestly, hasn't Garry always seemed a little loopy to all of us?

I liked Garry much better with Roe, but that's mostly because I never understood the appeal of Steve Dahl.

He bores me to tears. That whole CKG lineup is just sorry now, IMHO. I used to like Stern, but it sounds like a rerun now. Same with Matthews, but amplified - I can't tell when a show is live or a "best of" from 10 years ago. And I get seriously angry when my wife leaves the radio tuned to CKG ( she likes Stern ) and I accidentally hear some of the Afternoon Dead Air Festival.

If Steve and Garry ever reunited, it may well be lucrative, but it would be SUCH a desperation move by both of them. I wouldn't listen.

[Rex Kickass]

Coho lips and Garry oughta reunite by retiring. Neither of them seem to have anything resembling entertainment left to contribute.

[Kid Gleason]

I know Steve is boring as lint, but back in the day he and Garry were great.

 

Matthews? Hated him at first, then fell in love with him, and now I have no time for him. I pretty much got REAL tired of his schtick also. Jim got real tiring.

 

Stern? Never liked him.

 

I will take any of those guys though over Mancow ANYtime. One of my buddies knows (knew) Mancow very well, and he confirmed every single suspicion I ever had of Mancow being a complete dick.

 

But, I would LOVE to have a certain Johnny B. back on the airwaves around these parts. Johnny was the best, and his stuff still kills me. You can find some websites with clips on them, including the final broadcasts that lead up to the daparture.

[mreye]

But, I would LOVE to have a certain Johnny B. back on the airwaves around these parts. Johnny was the best, and his stuff still kills me. You can find some websites with clips on them, including the final broadcasts that lead up to the daparture.

I never got the whole Johnny B thing. I never could stand to listen to him. To each his own, I guess.

 

I really would like to see Roe and Garry back together. Roe's show seems to be lacking something since Garry left.

[The Critic]

I know Steve is boring as lint, but back in the day he and Garry were great.

 

Matthews? Hated him at first, then fell in love with him, and now I have no time for him. I pretty much got REAL tired of his schtick also. Jim got real tiring.

 

Stern? Never liked him.

 

I will take any of those guys though over Mancow ANYtime. One of my buddies knows (knew) Mancow very well, and he confirmed every single suspicion I ever had of Mancow being a complete dick.

 

But, I would LOVE to have a certain Johnny B. back on the airwaves around these parts. Johnny was the best, and his stuff still kills me. You can find some websites with clips on them, including the final broadcasts that lead up to the daparture.

Johnny B just got let go by his LA station after just one year.

FWIW, CKG management claims not to be interested in signing him.