ESPN Insider

[Steve Bartman's my idol]

ESPN Insider's Buster Olney is reporting that the Fish are now approaching the Sox about A.J. Burnett, and would be asking for Brandon McCarthy in return. The trade could be expanded with Damaso Marte going to the Fish and the Fish including another player.

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(Steve Bartman's my idol @ Jul 22, 2005 -> 05:50 PM)

ESPN Insider's Buster Olney is reporting that the Fish are now approaching the Sox about A.J. Burnett, and would be asking for Brandon McCarthy in return. The trade could be expanded with Damaso Marte going to the Fish and the Fish including another player.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Maybe we can include Uribe for Alex Gonzalez

[SoxFanForever]

Timo for Cabrera im sure

[The Ginger Kid]

Timo for Cabrera im sure

[maggsmaggs]

McCarthy for A.J. straight up I would do. But no Damaso, no Anderson. He's gonna be a rental player. As the top free agent pitcher, the Yanks, the Sawks and even the Tigers will easily outbid us. I say McCarthy OK, anything else NO.

[AddisonStSox]

That's it...I just can't stand it any more. I have to do it.

[WHarris1]

Timo for Cabrera im sure

Timo and Willie for Cabreras and Castillo is what I heard.

 

Lemme go ask my carwashers sisters uncles daughters roomates pimp which is where I hear this.

[SoxFanForever]

Timo and Willie for Cabreras and Castillo is what I heard.

 

Lemme go ask my carwashers sisters uncles daughters roomates pimp which is where I hear this.

Man, I wish I had connections like that. It is pretty much straight from the horses mouth

[The Ginger Kid]

Timo and Willie for Cabreras and Castillo is what I heard.

 

Lemme go ask my carwashers sisters uncles daughters roomates pimp which is where I hear this.

 

I think that's Buster's source too

[AddisonStSox]

Rather than start another thread or something, I'm just going to throw this scenario out there:

 

If, by some grace of God, the Sox can center a deal for Burnett around Brandon McCarthy and Damaso Marte, then sign a lefty the likes of Embree or someone else off the scrap heap, would you make the move?

 

IMHO, Burnett+Embree>>>McCarthy+Marte

 

I'm going for broke in 2005.

[beck72]

ESPN Insider's Buster Olney is reporting that the Fish are now approaching the Sox about A.J. Burnett, and would be asking for Brandon McCarthy in return. The trade could be expanded with Damaso Marte going to the Fish and the Fish including another player.

 

I think another ESPN writer [stark?] wrote that Philly would trade Wagner for AJ Burnett. If the sox did that, maybe. I don't think Burnett pitching every 5th day, being the 4th best SP on the team [maybe 5th], throwing maybe every 4th playoff game, won't take the sox past the first round. A guy like Wagner would though

Edited July 22, 2005 by beck72

[SoxFanForever]

Rather than start another thread or something, I'm just going to throw this scenario out there:

 

If, by some grace of God, the Sox can center a deal for Burnett around Brandon McCarthy and Damaso Marte, then sign a lefty the likes of Embree or someone else off the scrap heap, would you make the move?

 

IMHO, Burnett+Embree>>>McCarthy+Marte

 

I'm going for broke in 2005.

Embree is completely worthless. I'm sure we could trade for a better lefty.

[The Ginger Kid]

Rather than start another thread or something, I'm just going to throw this scenario out there:

 

If, by some grace of God, the Sox can center a deal for Burnett around Brandon McCarthy and Damaso Marte, then sign a lefty the likes of Embree or someone else off the scrap heap, would you make the move?

 

IMHO, Burnett+Embree>>>McCarthy+Marte

 

I'm going for broke in 2005.

 

I think Damaso is a dominant left hander who would be sorely missed in any run for the playoffs. I'd much rather lose Cotts before Damaso. When he's on he's virtually unhittable.

[AddisonStSox]

I think Damaso is a dominant left hander who would be sorely missed in any run for the playoffs. I'd much rather lose Cotts before Damaso. When he's on he's virtually unhittable.

 

Ultimately, that is the basis for this question. Would the Sox be in a better position to win a pennant race with a stronger SP starting every fifth day or a lefty-arm in the pen that, at times, could be invaluable with his ability to lock things down and bridge the gap to a closer.

[beck72]

I think Damaso is a dominant left hander who would be sorely missed in any run for the playoffs. I'd much rather lose Cotts before Damaso. When he's on he's virtually unhittable.

 

Damaso was unhittable one game this yr. And 2, 3 yrs ago. Last yr and most of this yr he hasn't been the same pitcher.

 

Cotts is young, cheap and has more upside than Marte.

[The Ginger Kid]

Ultimately, that is the basis for this question.  Would the Sox be in a better position to win a pennant race with a stronger SP starting every fifth day or a lefty-arm in the pen that, at times, could be invaluable with his ability to lock things down and bridge the gap to a closer.

 

given the ever evolving closer situation with the sox, and I'm not complaining about that since it's worked out just fine, I believe that it's going to be closer by committee in the second half to give Hermie a break now and again, with Cliff and Damaso taking the bump in the 9th on occasion. Works for me.

[AddisonStSox]

Damaso was unhittable one game this yr. And 2, 3 yrs ago. Last yr and most of this yr he hasn't been the same pitcher.

 

Cotts is young, cheap and has more upside than Marte.

 

Beck gets it.

 

If Neal continues to progress at the rapid clip he has been, does he somehow make Marte expendable in a deadline move? I don't know. I don't know if Kenny knows.

 

I'm not one for trade-talk, but this does offer a really, really interesting discussion.

[AddisonStSox]

given the ever evolving closer situation with the sox, and I'm not complaining about that since it's worked out just fine, I believe that it's going to be closer by committee in the second half to give Hermie a break now and again, with Cliff and Damaso taking the bump in the 9th on occasion. Works for me.

 

Yikes. Well, there, I'm going to have to disagree. If we are arguing Marte should not be involved in a deadline move because of his ability to close ballgames, I'm going to have to disagree. If you would argue his value rests in his ability to bridge to gap to the ninth inning, getting both RH and LH out, then I'd understand. But, I don't think you hold onto Marte because he can potentialy take part in a closer by committee situation.

[beck72]

If, by some grace of God, the Sox can center a deal for Burnett around Brandon McCarthy and Damaso Marte, then sign a lefty the likes of Embree or someone else off the scrap heap, would you make the move?

 

 

If the sox could deal for a LOGGY, like Scott Eyre or Ron Villone to replace Marte, sure. Prospects could probably be used to acquire this type of guy. But the Sox keeping Burnett?! That's where I jump off. The sox should move him for other pieces

[AddisonStSox]

If the sox could deal for a LOGGY, like Scott Eyre or Ron Villone to replace Marte, sure. Prospects could probably be used to acquire this type of guy. But the Sox keeping Burnett?! That's where I jump off. The sox should move him for other pieces

 

Alright, beck, then I pose to you the orignal question:

 

Do you think the Sox would be better suited to have a stronger SP taking the bump every fifth day in the midst of a pennant race or move said stronger SP for bullpen help, another bat, etc?

 

I mean, then we are thinking Wager>Burnett? Hmmmmmmmmmmmm...boy, I dunno. Tough one.

 

Personally, I'd rather have the stronger arm to get us to the later innings than rough it with our current starters.

[beck72]

Beck gets it. 

 

If Neal continues to progress at the rapid clip he has been, does he somehow make Marte expendable in a deadline move?  I don't know.  I don't know if Kenny knows.

 

I'm not one for trade-talk, but this does offer a really, really interesting discussion.

 

If the sox picked up another LHP who is lights out facing that one LH hitter [be it Garret Anderson, Ortiz, etc] it could make Marte expendable. Marte facing that one LH batter doesn't give me the confidence he once did. right now, Cotts gives me the same confidence as Marte coming in and shutting the opposition down--in the 60-70% range [not shut down, but very respectable]

[beck72]

Alright, beck, then I pose to you the orignal question:

 

Do you think the Sox would be better suited to have a stronger SP taking the bump every fifth day in the midst of a pennant race or move said stronger SP for bullpen help, another bat, etc?

 

I mean, then we are thinking Wager>Burnett?  Hmmmmmmmmmmmm...boy, I dunno.  Tough one.

 

Personally, I'd rather have the stronger arm to get us to the later innings than rough it with our current starters.

 

The sox probably won't have a real "pennant race", in that they won't be slugging it out to the end. Barring a total collapse, they'll make the playoffs. For that reason, having the stronger bullpen [and with Hermy's back problems, and no Shingo] adding to this area for a short series, where Wagner can pitch in 3, 4 games, IMO makes the Sox stronger. Burnett may only throw in 1 playoff game.

 

Burnett may not even be better than Jose or El Duque for one game. Maybe over the course of two months, he could be. But Burnett could and does get pounded. So he's no sure thing. Wagner, on the other hand is a sure thing.

 

So I'd like Wagner and another #1 or #2 type hitter who can take over at SS.

[AddisonStSox]

The sox probably won't have a real "pennant race", in that they won't be slugging it out to the end. Barring a total collapse, they'll make the playoffs. For that reason, having the stronger bullpen [and with Hermy's back problems, and no Shingo] adding to this area for a short series, where Wagner can pitch in 3, 4 games, IMO makes the Sox stronger. Burnett may only throw in 1 playoff game.

 

Burnett may not even be better than Jose or El Duque for one game. Maybe over the course of two months, he could be. But Burnett could and does get pounded. So he's no sure thing. Wagner, on the other hand is a sure thing.

 

So I'd like Wagner and another #1 or #2 type hitter who can take over at SS.

 

Excellent points.

 

I feel for Mr. Williams. I can only imagine what he is going through right now. Hopefully, he has one of these grand plans all figured out and all he needs is some time and cooperation to make it happen.

 

I just think he'd have an awfully hard time getting Burnett, the most coveted, attainable SP at the deadline, on the roster only to ship him elsewhere.

[beck72]

Excellent points.

 

I feel for Mr. Williams.  I can only imagine what he is going through right now.  Hopefully, he has one of these grand plans all figured out and all he needs is some time and cooperation to make it happen.

 

I just think he'd have an awfully hard time getting Burnett, the most coveted, attainable SP at the deadline, on the roster only to ship him elsewhere.

 

No doubt KW has a tough job. Yet one thing is for sure, he'll make a move or two. He doesn't seem the type to hold pat if he could do something to better the team. Even if the moves made fail in hindsight, any deals will be made that logically would better the team for the present.

 

The way I look at it, Wagner as a closer >>> than Burnett as a SP.

Wagner is lights out, say good night Gracie, here's the heat, try and hit it.

Burnett can be lights out.

 

What scares me more is that Burnett may be signed to a long term deal, like 4 yrs and $40 mill [and probably will be on the DL for 2 of those yrs]

[RockRaines]

Buster seemed to think that it would be BMAC for AJ straight up. If thats the case, see-ya BMAC in my eyes. I think he would prosper in the national league anyway. I think if we can do that, we still have more bargaining chips on the table to get Wagner etc. If it takes dealing JC to someone, we would do it and be MUCH improved. I honestly do not see BMAC as our #1 pitching prospect.