iamshack

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jan 13, 2011 -> 05:58 PM) I've seen numbers ranging from 1250-1400 in hours-worked for teachers in a given year. A 40-hour full-time job comes in at 2000 hours. Yeah, I just looked at my hours for last year. It was 2080 hours, and that's not counting all of them, honestly.

QUOTE (Harry Chappas @ Jan 12, 2011 -> 12:03 PM) I wish Chicago would open a land based casino though and gain the revenue that the citizens are pumping into other municipalities and states. I actually worked on this project when I was with the Mayor's Office about 5 years ago. They wanted to put it right over by the old Post Office I think it was, like Congress and Michigan Ave, I want to say? Not sure what the roadblock has been...

QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Jan 13, 2011 -> 02:35 PM) Hope it turns out good for you shack, if not I know you mentioned a different path you were interested in and hopefully and opportunity opens there. Thanks Russ. She just called me in and said it looks like she is finally getting a little movement. I said don't kill yourself. I'm not sure it's going to matter at this point. She said I know, but I will anyways. We'll see.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Jan 13, 2011 -> 02:37 PM) If you haven't already, you should definitely point out that example to them. I did and they are aware. Thing is, they don't care, because it comes out of your pocketbooks ultimately, not theirs. What happens is your utility company pays all its fuels and power costs, and then seeks reimbursement from the Public Utility Commission. The Commission then examines the case we present and adjusts our rates we are allowed to collect from you, the consumer, accordingly. So unless the PUC can clearly point out that I was negligent in how I called for our profile to be dispatched, we will be reimbursed accordingly. However, if I do an outstanding job, the rates of the consumer can actually be reduced. So basically, the public relies on the utility to hire good employees, but there isn't a huge benefit for the utility to do so, unless of course in the case of clear negligence, in which case they have to eat the increased costs. Pretty lame, eh? This is what happens with a quasi-governmental company.

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jan 13, 2011 -> 02:29 PM) Are the public stations all the way up to 480V or something? I'm not sure. This is just what Nissan claimed on its website.

And just to add some context to this for you guys, yesterday morning, almost immediately after I declined their initial offer and counteroffered, my biggest natural gas generator tripped offline. I basically spent $65k in the next three hours keeping the northern half of Nevada's power on. Had I not been as good at my job as I am, or been able to call in the favors I did because of the relationships I've formed, I could have easily spent double that amount. Also, if I had not been as fast as I had been, we could have gone into an emergency, been forced to shed load, and that would have REALLY cost us money in fines and public perception, etc. So after I did that, they come right back and start fighting me over a few thousand dollars over the course of a year? Just a bit ridiculous.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 13, 2011 -> 02:05 PM) All I ( and I think everyone else) is saying is that you don't control the deck. I know they haven't been honest, but they control the work environment. Be careful. Yeah, and I appreciate the advice. I wouldn't be asking for it otherwise. I hope no one mistakes my comments for being unappreciative. This is just the way I am though...I'm going to stand up for what I believe in, and I think I am being reasonable in doing so. The rest will sort itself out.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Jan 13, 2011 -> 01:24 PM) 2011 Jeep Grand cherokee Overland. Still loving it, Rock?

QUOTE (Palehosefan @ Jan 13, 2011 -> 12:50 PM) Problem is that even with 240V outlets, it would take something like 4+ hours, correct? Edit: just read about level 3 charging stations that could power a Nissan Leaf to 80% power in 30 minutes, that's a nice improvement. Yeah, the public charging stations will take about 15-30 minutes. The home charging stations will take 3-4 hours. Still impractical, but if you're buying an all-electric car, you are probably not the person most concerned about practicality.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 13, 2011 -> 12:34 PM) That isn't the extent of what you indicated you were going to do. That is correct. In a negotiation though, if you give me an offer, and I reject and counteroffer, and you reject my counteroffer, than that counteroffer is no longer valid. Secondly, when you're negotiating, a party is basically allowed to bluff once. If you call their bluff and they get caught, they lose and usually have to make a good faith effort to meet your request. However, if a party gets caught twice bluffing, that is an extreme show of bad faith and that is when the other party will usually walk away or actually increase their demands. It's the only manner in which to cause a detriment to bad faith in negotiations. I know you guys are saying that's all well and great, but a job is a job and you have to make a living. And I can understand that position. It's just not going to cause me to accept a position where the pros and cons come in around even.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 13, 2011 -> 12:58 PM) Its not Russia, but if you want to work there for any amount of time, it is for you. Company's don't care about you and your ideals. I have been there and done that. If you become difficult, you are replaceable. Don't plan on life being comfortable at this firm if you fight this fight. I would not characterize refusal to accept a job offer as "being difficult." You guys have to understand, I have been trained to be a trader. I make transactions all day, every day. I negotiate every single one of those transactions. That is my job. They trained me to evaluate all available information and make the best decision possible based upon a certain level of possible outcomes and risks involved. I don't see how this is any different, and they even admitted that they expected this from me. So simply because I am not willing to accept their initial offer, I am somehow the bad guy in this thing? If they actually had the stones to fire me, now THAT would be perfect cause for unlawful termination. Secondly, just to answer the question, because it has been asked, yes, I do have other options available to me.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 13, 2011 -> 12:18 PM) If I had the Leaf, I'd still have to have a second car if I wanted to do anything like drive to my parents (and probably 2/3 of the mileage on my current car is long-distance highway trips). Insuring 2 different cars for 1 driver doesn't seem like the best use of money to me. Not once they have public charging stations though, right?

Nope, I'm standing my ground here. This entire process has been wrought with manipulation and deception on their end, and I am not going to be forced to accept a position simply because they don't want to pay me anywhere near my fair market value. 1) They manipulated my base salary in their offer and misrepresented the percentage raise I would be given 2) They told me the offer was non-negotiable and take it or leave it 3) I told them I was declining the offer then, at which time, they told me they expected me to negotiate because that is my job (I am a trader) and would try and increase their offer 4) They came back with the same offer 5) I then declined that offer 6) They now want to try and negotiate again Wtf game are we playing here? I am not asking for a figure that is even at the midpoint of the range they posted in the job description. They saw my background and actually changed the job description include duties which would utilize my law degree, however, they did not in turn change the pay range or make me an offer that is even in the middle of the range. I worked my ass off to get my JD, as well as the jobs I had whjile I was getting it, and I am paying that back every month in the form of student loans. If they want me to work on regulatory filings that require the knowledge amd training of someone with an advanced degree, and this was not in the original job description, then they have to show some good faith and at least show some consideration for that. They have shown nothing but bad faith in these negotiations, by misrepresenting the terms of the offer, as well as the character of their offer(s). I'm sorry guys, but I have some experience in negotiations, and you don't tell them something is your absolute final offer, and then when they reject it, say oh, wait a minute, it's not my final offer. That is called bad faith. I've done nothing wrong other than try to negotiate according to what is in my best interests. In no way should I be required to accept something simply because they want me to. This isn't Russia, is it Danny?

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jan 13, 2011 -> 10:02 AM) I don't think you'll find any competent scientist making claims of absolute truth. It's always about confidence intervals, p-values and the null. Yes, only the Sith deal in absolutes.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 13, 2011 -> 09:41 AM) If you really want to understand this topic and take some time on it, I can put together a primer on it, at whatever depth you want. I've got 2 weeks of undergraduate class in late April that I'm teaching on Climate Change. I appreciate the offer Balta, but I'm just not scientifically talented enough to understand it thoroughly.

I'm not smart enough to really contribute much to this debate, but I do believe that there were enormous climactic changes before humans, and there will be again after humans. And there clearly are some while humans are here. What we can do to change this is beyond the scope of my knowledge.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 13, 2011 -> 07:57 AM) Really, the idea that it's not 100% anthropogenic is the natural conservatism of the scientists writing the IPCC reports coming out. They can't establish firmly that it's 110% human fault, so they leave themselves a reasonable margin of error, and the mainstreaming of the results assumes that the conservative margin of error is the right one, not the alarmist side. Reality is...for the last decade in particular, we should have gone the other way. We're right now coming out of the deepest solar minimum in a couple centuries. The last decade should have been one of the coldest in the last century. Instead, it was the opposite. I can't establish to complete certainty that it's entirely anthropogenic, so don't mistake what I'm saying here...but I'd certainly disagree with a statement that it is "Likely" not 100% anthropogenic, because 100% of climate change being anthropogenic is certainly within reasonable margins of error. I get lost in all your brilliance here, Balta, and I mean that sincerely, but I think I understand what you are saying enough to be surprised that you feel this way. I agree with Y2H...it seems like we are flattering ourselves quite a bit here...

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 13, 2011 -> 08:58 AM) Answer 1: Honda Civic. Answer 2: Chevrolet Volt. You like the Volt a lot more than the Leaf, eh, Balta? Just more practical?

What jerks. Now they say they are going to try again. Whatever. I won't even take the counter offer I gave them yesterday anymore.

Ok, so I am not trying to flatter myself and keep you guys all entangled in my drama, but since I started this thread, and some of you have given me good advice, I figure it would be foolish to not finish the story... So they came back last night with the same offer, saying they could not get any movement whatsoever. I told them I wanted the night to sleep on it. Last night I was leaning towards declining the offer, but decided to wait to make a decision until I got some sleep. I awoke this morning with the same feeling as I had last night, so I am going to decline the offer this morning. Not only am I going to decline their offer, but I am going to retract my counter offer I made yesterday. I feel 100% confident that I am making the correct decision.

QUOTE (Tex @ Jan 13, 2011 -> 06:58 AM) Since this is the only going car related thread today does anyone look at any stats related to crime in choosing a car? A coworker had the rims stolen from his Texas Edition F250. I was not aware but they are $4,400 to replace new Highly sought after High rate of theft I just crossed off Texas Edition from my list. Tuesday he came out of his house to find his truck up on cinder blocks and the rims and tires gone. His house is 300 feet from the road and he was sleeping thirty feet from his truck when it happened. A couple months ago he found cinder blocks in the ditch outside his home, so he guessed someone was targeting him. He bought the wheel locks, but it turns out that you can buy kits to remove the locks at Sears or wherever auto parts are sold. LOL nice system. I wonder if they put those kits next to the locks. Hah, that cracks me up that their is a "Texas Edition."

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jan 12, 2011 -> 05:54 PM) Nicely done. Thanks. I just get tired of corporations trying to make it appear that since this is a bad job market, they can treat the employees they do have like garbage. I don't know about you guys, but my company seems to like to hold it over our heads. My boss even said offhandedly that he could replace us with people from the bus stop if need be. I doubt they will come back with what I counter-offered, but if they bump it up I will probably accept. This was more about principle than anything else.

QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Jan 12, 2011 -> 04:39 PM) Oh man, this was my perfect chance to use the line "Only the Sith deal in absolutes." Darnit!

QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Jan 12, 2011 -> 01:44 PM) Hmm. That's a tough one. I called their bluff. They are trying to approve more $

So they offered me the promotion this morning. Their offer came in higher than I expected, but still lower than I want. They are trying to strong-arm me by saying there are no negotiations. It is a take-it or leave-it offer. If I don't accept, they will simply offer it to the next person in line. I don't believe them, and this "no-negotiations" process ticks me off. I am thinking of calling their bluff.