TLAK
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Just for conversation. What team in the Central is gonna get the most good starts over a 162 game season?
The names below are orderd by Indians, Tigers, Twins, White Sox, Royals
#1
Sabathia, Verlander, Santana, Buehrle, Meche
#2
Carmona, Rogers, Bonser, Vazquez, Bannister
#3
Byrd, Bonderman, Baker, Contreras, Greinke
#4
Westbrook, Willis, Slowey, Danks, Davies
#5
Laffey, Robertson, TBD, Floyd, De La Rosa
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QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jan 5, 2008 -> 01:35 PM)Given that right now his trade value is equivalent to the value of a $4.5 million lottery ticket, that's probably true. His value can not go down from here.
Also factor in that Brandon Inge is on the block since the Tigers got MCabrerra. He is not the player that Joe Crede is and he is a $19 million commitment for 3 years but I bet the Tigers will either eat quite a bit of that, or take on somebody else's problem salary player in return.
Its going to be hard to get a lot for Joe Crede.
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At least a few of us are old enough to remember him. He clinched the pennant for the Sox in 1959, coming into a 4-2 game with the bases loaded and one out in the bottom of the ninth in Cleveland. On his only pitch, Vic Power grounded to Luis Aparicio who stepped on second to force Jimmy Piersall, of all people, then throw to first for the DP.
Rest in peace, Gerry.
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Here is a list of all the White Sox draft choices I can find that played in 2007.
Draft Dte Rd '07 Player
06/05/89 32 CLE Joe Borowski
06/05/89 01 TOR Frank Thomas
06/04/90 02 ARI Bob Wickman
06/04/90 05 SFN Ray Durham
06/03/91 18 SDN Mike Cameron
06/01/92 27 BOS Brendan Donnelly
06/03/93 02 TBA Greg Norton
06/04/96 13 BAL Chad Bradford
06/04/96 05 CHA Joe Crede
06/04/96 02 TBA Josh Paul
06/04/96 01 DET Bobby Seay
06/02/98 01 PHI Aaron Rowand
06/02/98 03 COL Josh Fogg
06/02/98 02 CIN Gary Majewski
06/02/98 38 CHA Mark Buehrle
06/02/98 01 SLN Kip Wells
06/02/99 03 WAS Jon Rauch
06/02/99 10 MIN Matt Guerrier
06/02/00 38 PIT Tom Gorzelanny
06/02/00 03 SEA Mike Morse
06/02/00 18 ARI Chris Young
06/02/00 10 CHA Heath Phillips
06/05/00 01 FLO Joe Borchard
06/02/01 12 TEX Chris Stewart
06/02/01 25 CHA Charlie Haeger
06/02/02 17 TEX Brandon McCarthy
06/02/02 20 CHA Boone Logan
06/02/02 25 OAK Jay Marshall
06/02/02 01 ATL Royce Ring
06/04/02 02 SEA Jeremy Reed
06/02/03 01 CHA Brian N. Anderson
06/02/03 02 CHA Ryan Sweeney
06/02/05 01 CHA Lance Broadway
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Here's how the boys did using my daily ERA formula. Each start is evaluated one at a time, then totaled. It is meant to show which pitchers give his team the most chances to win his start over the course of a year. And the downside is it shows how many times he gives his team virtually no chance to win.
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QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Dec 14, 2007 -> 07:29 PM)Btw, does it seem to anyone else like the A's got a bigger haul for Haren than they did for Hudson + Mulder combined?
Haren was in the Mulder trade, so they got all these guys + 3 years of Haren + Barton and Calero for Mulder. Then add what they got for Hudson: Juan Cruz, Dan Meyer, and Charles Thomas.
Trade good pitchers and you get alot back.
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Also from RotoWorld
Jason Tyner-OF- Twins Dec. 12 - 6:04 pm etTwins non-tendered outfielder Jason Tyner.
He's the only player the team is letting go. Tyner likely would have made less than $1 million in his first year of arbitration eligibility, but the Twins still didn't want him back. They could always change their minds later if they end up with a right-handed-hitting starting center fielder. Tyner hit .286/.331/.355 in 304 at-bats last season.
Hmmm...
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Joe Cowley visits with Ozzie Guillen in Sunday's Sun-Times:
"Q: Who is going to play second?
A: Right now, I'm looking to [Danny] Richar. But I have Juan Uribe to compete with him."
So no mention of Pablo, and as I mentioned above, if Uribe is still on the team you can expect to see him on the field quite a bit.
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Barring a trade I would expect Juan Uribe to get significant time at 2B, maybe 60 games. I thought he did a good job with the glove there in '04. Playing match ups with Richar and Uribe may get a little more out of them together than either could do as a full timer. Uribe will also get about 15-20 starts at SS as Cabrera's caddy (count the Sundays).
I think Ozuna stays an all purpose sub, occasional starts in LF-3B-2B against good righties but mostly a late inning pinch hitter and situational runner (Kong-Thome-JD-AJ). When Zoomer comes into the game something always happens -- its not always good but something happens.
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So they need $10 million to get Rowand. They drew 2,684,395 fans last year, so they need about $3.75 more per head. Figuring in the cost of the vendors and the paying the brewery, if each fan had roughly one more beer per game the White Sox could pay him from the net. I, for one, am willing to do my part.
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QUOTE(iamshack @ Nov 29, 2007 -> 02:29 AM)Well, I think there is a difference in what kind of innings these guys are pitching. There are "stressful" innings and "non-stressful" innings. If you ask any Indians, Red Sox, or White Sox fan how Riske does in stressful innings, you'll get the same answer. To quote from a favorite commercial of mine, he folds like a lawn chair. He does, however, seem to do fine in non-stressful innings where the game is not on the line.
I think many of his would-be suitors recognize that and therefore hesitate to give him big dollars...
Agree. Riske's value is in keeping the team close when it is down a couple runs. As soon as the game is tied or you get a lead he folds. Cleveland tried to close with him in '03-'04 and he got 13 saves in 25 opportunities. Life time he has 20 saves in 38 opps so he blows the lead about half the time.
The best measure is how his managers use him, 1-1, 0-0, 0-1, 4-8 save/opp since '04. Eric Wedge, Terry Francona, Ozzie Guillen and Buddy Bell all chose not to use him in save situations if they had an alternative.
He is a usefull part of winning team in that he can eat innings in games you are losing and preserve the front line guys for games you have a better chance of winning. He is not a first tier relief pitcher, but he can keep you in some games and you have better chance to come back than if you use, say a Dewon Day of 2007.
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Roto again:
Jason Bourgeois-DH- White Sox Nov. 21 - 3:19 pm etWhite Sox re-signed second baseman-outfielder Jason Bourgeois to a minor league contract.
Bourgeois, who turns 26 in January, looked like one of the better minor league free agents out there after hitting .306/.365/.440 between Double- and Triple-A last season. Whether he gets a chance to make the White Sox next spring could depend on what happens with Pablo Ozuna.
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RotoWorld:
Jason Bourgeois-DH - White Sox Nov. 18 - 2:18 pm etFree agent Jason Bourgeois drove in six runs Saturday for Los Mochis of the Mexican Pacific League.
Bourgeois is back playing second base in Mexico after spending most of the last couple of seasons in the outfield. The versatility could be his ticket to having a career as a bench player in the majors. The soon-to-be 26-year-old hit .306/.365/.440 between Double- and Triple-A last season and is currently at .304/.377/.413 in the MPL.
This is interesting. Bourgeois started out as a SS and has moved all over the field since. He played in 44 games at 2B with Charlotte last year. Did anyone on the board get a look at him?
Quality left handers had Danny Richar for breakfast last year, it would be nice to have an option against guys in the central like Santana without spending a bundle on a guy to play 50 games.
---Bourgeois also played everywhere Andy Gonzalez did and hit .311.
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QUOTE(BearSox @ Nov 13, 2007 -> 10:49 PM)Just curious, but if the Sox get Hunter and have a LF of one (or two) of Owens/Stewart/Crisp, that would be an all black OF. Now, when was the last time Chicago had an all black OF?
Since the 80's
1995: Tim Raines, Lance Johnson, Mike Devereaux
1994: Raines, Johnson, Bo Jackson
1993: Raines, Johnson, Ellis Burkes
1981: Ron Leflore, Chet Lemon, Harold Baines
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QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Nov 7, 2007 -> 03:37 PM)Bringing in a guy like Colon or Garcia makes sense to me if ...
I'd love it if the White Sox would take a flyer on Freddy Garcia. He won't be ready to pitch until the ASB so offer him a minors deal like the Yankee's did when Jon Lieber was coming back. It worked for them, the Vermin tried it with Wade Miller and it didn't.
Even if Garcia's arm never gets better you can write it off as a reward for Game 7 in WS. Garcia is the gutsiest pitcher I've seen since Jack McDowell. He might do better than what I'm suggesting somewhere else but I'd still love to see him have a shot of getting back with the team.
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I've always liked Eckstein as a player but I believe in the saying "Old shortstops never win". The Eck is going to be 33 next year. The last shortstop on a WS champion who was that old was Larry Bowa in 1980 at age 35. Next was Maury Wills at 33 in 1965. The SS is traditionally the best athlete on the team, if David Eckstien at 33 is your best athlete, you are in trouble.
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QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Oct 31, 2007 -> 04:30 PM)He is going to be homeless himself if he doesn't quit running his mouth...
Ouch!
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MLB.Com Scott Merkin
CHICAGO -- The White Sox declined club options on both outfielder/first baseman Darin Erstad and left-handed reliever Mike Myers, with both veterans officially filing for free agency on Tuesday.After a highly successful 11-year career playing for the Angels, Erstad signed a one-year deal as a free agent with the White Sox last January and the club held a $3.5 million option for 2008. Erstad proved to be an immediate fit in the clubhouse, but an injury-plagued season that cost him basically the entire months of June and July limited the left-handed hitter to 310 at-bats and 87 games played.
Throughout the final two months of the 2007 season, Erstad refused to speculate on his future with the White Sox, adding there was a time and place to think about such decisions but not during the season. Erstad did admit to enjoying his time with the White Sox, after playing more than one decade with the same team.
"There's an adjustment period, being in one place for so long, but everyone was very welcoming," said Erstad before the close of his one year with the White Sox, as the team used its $250,000 buyout. "Being the circumstances what they were, I had a great time with the people.
"We all would have liked it to go better, but I by no means would second-guess my decision. I made the right decision, but hit a little road block in the middle of the year."
That road block came on May 31 in Toronto, when Erstad severely sprained his left ankle while swinging and missing on a pitch from Roy Halladay. Erstad re-aggravated this same injury while making a diving catch on a line drive to center field in a June 22 contest against the Cubs, a game marking Erstad's first appearance after his initial stint on the disabled list.
"It's definitely frustrating," said Erstad of the injuries that slowed him down. "I had it going differently in my mind at the start of the year."
Myers, 38, joined the White Sox on Aug. 19 via a prorated, one-year contract, with the club holding a $1.1 million option for 2008. General manager Ken Williams liked the different look Myers provided with his sidearm southpaw style, but Myers finished with an 11.20 ERA in 17 games for Ozzie Guillen's crew and allowed 28 baserunners over 13 2/3 innings.
Boone Logan figures to fill the left-handed specialist role for the White Sox in 2008, with the young hurler limiting left-handed hitters to a .221 average last season.
Shortstop Juan Uribe remains the only case left for the White Sox to decide, with the team having until Nov. 12 to exercise a $5 million club option or invoke a $300,000 buyout. Uribe hit .234 in 2007, marking the fourth straight year his average has dropped with the White Sox, but also knocked out 20 home runs and drove in 68.
Scott Podsednik, Joe Crede and Alex Cintron all are arbitration-eligible, with Crede figuring to be the lone one of the three to return.
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QUOTE(max power @ Oct 30, 2007 -> 07:33 PM)I don't see how its prudent to judge anything from 17 at bats, especially when they are as sporadic as his were and the fact that he is and was a developing player at the time, not some established vet.
17 on top of about 400 similar ones the two years before. I know it's harsh, I had great hopes for Brian, but he is just not maturing as a baseball player. He has so much more talent than, say a Rowand or even Joe Crede, but he just doesn't know or doesn't want to take the right approach to a given situation. He just wants to be the star, in the mean time the White Sox were giving ball games away. Grrr.
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I really think he's just too dumb to be a good major leaguer. Do you remember his 17 at bats? He was situationally terrible. Forget the numbers, there are many ways a player can help a team if he can field like Brian, even if he's not hitting for numbers. But he came up needing a lazy fly ball or even a ground ball to get a guy over and would strike out trying to put it on the moon. Then he'd come up with 2 out and nobody on and bunt. He was very frustrating for the fans to watch and must have driven the coaches nuts. A great athlete but a bad ball player.
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Destroy Hawkins
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Get Gameday Audio and listen to some of the other guys doing MLB and I think you will find the current team compares well. Farmer and Singleton call every pitch and keep you in the game. Singleton has come miles, but he had many miles to go. He has really improved his analysis spots. He needs a little more energy in his PBP,you can still tell he is laboring, and he will be fine. I'm good with this team and happy both will be back.
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QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Oct 24, 2007 -> 09:21 AM)Trib reports that Hahn was kept out of many discussions at the organizational meetings because of his being recruited for other jobs. Secrecy and all. Sounds to me like they think he is likely to leave.
Remember when they did that to Bryan Little because his BROTHER got hired in Boston!
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QUOTE(joesaiditstrue @ Oct 22, 2007 -> 05:07 AM)just want to state that the pituitary gland isnt' at the base of the brain, its behind your sinus cavity
my dad's pituitary adenoma (growth) was removed through an invasive surgery through his nose, leaving no visible scarring which of course is nice! and he was put on a topical steroid called Andro Gel, so these types of growths often times require hormonal treatments such as steroids or hghWasn't that the year your dad hit 50 home runs?
Sorry, hope he is well.
Least favorite Sox players
in Pale Hose Talk
Posted
Claudell Washington
He had a lot of talent but just played lazy (or looked like it anyway). 17 errors in RF over about 2 years, and those are balls he got to. There had to be a ball per game than anyone else would have caught but he would loaf and take it on a bounce. Selfish at the plate, he hit 2nd most of '79 and accumulated 2, count 'em, sacrafice bunts. It was all about Claudell, and it always looked like he wanted to be anywhere in the world except Chicago.
30 years ago and it still bothers me.