Southwest Sider
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Posts posted by Southwest Sider
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3 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:
This thread sped right through depression into coping and acceptance
Pretty much because expectations matched reality. Sadly.
If new OC thinks Fields is fixable and can actually coach a QB let them spend the off-season together, draft MJH and o line with the 9 pick. f*** it at this point. The Bears are probably fucked anyway no matter what they do just like the White Sox.
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Imagine
BAL: Hey we want to trade for Cease
Getz: Awesome, I was thinking the package could start with Holliday.
BAL: Sorry, he's untouchable
Getz: OK, how about Coby Mayo?
BAL: We would trade him but not for Cease, he's too premium of a prospect.
Getz: Weird... okay what about Kjerstad?
BAL: Sorry, he's untouchable.
Getz: OK, what about Cowser and/or Basallo?
BAL: YEhhh.. maybe? ...But we think they are untouchable, can I interest you Joey Ortiz though?
Getz: ...K bye.
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10 minutes ago, almagest said:
Which is why most of the Sox fan proposals here are looking at prospects ranked lower than Eloy's #12 as the headliner. Orioles have #14, #24, #27 & #46 on MLB's 2023 list.
Starting with #14 sounds fair. Who is that? 😛
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16 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:
A HUGE difference with Quintana though...when traded, Quintana was under contract and controlled for 3.5 years. That's Luis Robert's control level (as of this year's trade deadline).
True enough but Quintana, while good, didn't have lockdown ace potential upside and carried significant downside risk. He basically never pitched up to his Sox stats with the Cubs, if I recall correctly (too lazy to look it up)
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14 minutes ago, almagest said:
Quintana was also in the midst of a pretty rough season when he was traded, and that was worth #12 and #77 on MLB's list.
Thanks for the context sir. AND he had way more downside risk (in my opinion) than Cease does, a risk he also kind of realized.
What it takes to obtain Cease is to blow Getz away with an offer. The BAL guy here doesn't get that, and keeps saying this dude and that dude are untouchable. Guys like Cease aren't always available, and he does not HAVE to be traded. Him being available in the first place negates any "untouchable" labels put on any prospect. BAL offering a bunch of mid and one pretty OK prospects and not budging "because no one has offered better" isn't going to get it done. Blowing Getz away gets it done.
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1 hour ago, almagest said:
Then there's nothing for you to talk about with us, because we're not trading two years of a cheap starter who's floor is a mid-rotation starter and ceiling is a Cy Young finalist for your lower tier prospects. The future value proposition just isn't worth it, because prospects have a ton of risk and this trade is too important to this team to fail.
EXACTLY
Makes no damn sense to trade Cease for mid prospects because this org as a whole is like 10 years out from relevance. That's how lolbad it is.
I frankly DGAF, the longer this goes on, the higher my personal price becomes. Now I don't want Mayo, I want Holliday. If Ruschmann was still a prospect I'd be demanding him. There's no reason to settle for "whatever the O's offer" because it just doesn't move the needle.
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3 hours ago, ChiSox59 said:
Mayo is a "premium prospect" with "4+ WAR upside", yet Cease a question mark after averaging 4.2 WAR the past three seasons under cheap control for 2 seasons in a market in which mediocre and injury prone SPs are getting $14M+ AAV.
This is why no one takes you seriously.
You forget man. Dylan Cease (a premium pitcher) isn't worth a "premium prospect".
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Let's not forget Jose Quintana, a durable reliable solid pitcher, not unlike Dylan Cease returned 2 of the Cubs best prospects in Jimenez (who I guess has kinda busted but was a HUGE prospect) and Dylan Cease himself.
BAL needs to GTFO with their prospect hugging untouchable nonsense. No one is untouchable if you actually want the guy.
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3 hours ago, Sports Guy said:
They aren’t being Moved for Cease.
I think they could be available in some deal but I doubt Cease is that guy. He’s not good enough, cheap enough or under control enough to get either of those guys.
You're insane dude. I think you forget how important pitching is and the premium the player who only plays every 5 games actually commands. To flat out say that most of Baltimore's top 5 isn't available for a durable, Cy Young potential pitcher for 2 years is just wild to me. Keep them, I hope they all bust and Dylan goes to NY somewhere and wins a Cy Young or finishes TOP TWO AGAIN.
SMH
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5 hours ago, Quin said:
R.I.P. Burger, Mayo, Colas.
Kenny Williams stole you from us
Don't forget Jace Fry and they could have gotten Seth Beer I guess.
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Fields footwork is bad. He's not great against zone defenses and he's practically a lock to get seriously injured at some point, especially with refs apparently having zero interest in calling penalties on late hits against him.
Him really leveling up this year would have been huge but now I think the bears need a QB. One game isn't a make all but a win and a dominant passing effort against the zone heavy Packers may go a long way toward swaying me. I'm just not sure he's the ride or die and give him a big contract.
Sucks cuz I wanted MHJ.. I won't be mad if they go this route and run it back with Justin but he's got a lot to clean up still and I wouldn't be shocked if this was who he was.
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2 minutes ago, Snopek said:
And if you still don’t see the return you like at the trade deadline, then what? At what point are you being too stubborn?
Getz should obviously be trying to maximize the return, but it’s also such a fine line to walk. I’m surprised at how comfortable some of y’all are with hanging onto Cease. Just insanely risky.
Ehhh I'm coming from the standpoint that this franchise is likely a decade out anyway from any sort of relevance and if we're not really getting needle movers for Cease then what's the point? May as well roll the dice on an awesome first half and see if you can get someone's actual top prospects. No one should be untouchable for a guy like Cease, especially if he returns to 2022 form. May as well give him that chance.
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4 hours ago, ron883 said:
A back end top 100 guy is extremely unlikely to be as good as Cease is, and the other pieces are almost guaranteed to not be good or even MLB players.
This is what I'm saying.
We are being gaslit into believing this is the best we can get. I'd rather hang on to Cease if we can't get any actual TOP prospects. MAYO OR BUST.
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4 hours ago, caulfield12 said:
And Kjerstad has to hit without any other dynamic tools and limited positional flexibility...
Exactly. I don't understand all the Sox fans willingness to accept high risk high reward (probably not needle movers) for a potential Cy Young candidate for 2 fucking years. It makes zero sense. All respect to the Os guys here but coming over and downplaying Cease because he was just "ok" on the team with the worst culture many Sox fans have ever seen in their life is asinine. #2 Cy Young doesn't happen by accident, it takes a full ass year of amazing pitching. He is going to be FINE on a team with actual structure and culture. He is more than capable and... if it ain't Holliday headlining this deal it better be fucking Mayo.
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6 hours ago, Jerksticks said:
Exactly. People overthinking it trying to decide “value” like some kind of Keith Law type. We’re trading the proven durable cy young type guy on a ridiculous contract.
it’s not ridiculous to want 2 guys in return. 2 bad ass unproven young guys. Sounds like Mayo and Cowser to me.
Mayo and Cowser. I'm down with this. f*** the shitty packages being badied about it. Sox need a needle mover and MAYBe they will be better 1 or 2 years sooner. Getz if he is smart knows he is absolutely fucked for awhile and trading Cease for whatever the f*** isn't going to change the trajectory of this franchise.
O's want a world series. Os need another pitcher. Someone who can put up a Cy young season. Pay the f*** up then.
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7 hours ago, FT35 said:
Non Sox fans don’t understand how important it is for us to fleece someone in a Cease trade. For teams like us who don’t develop talent, this is our only path to any sort of success. And we will need to set the market high because we will want top dollar for all these guys we’re about to get for Cease when we burn it all to the ground in a few seasons.
Exactly. I'd be a terrible GM insisting on Holliday but I'll let it slide for now and insist on Mayo. f*** the O's. Pay up if you want the dude. If not f*** off.
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7 hours ago, Sports Guy said:
Mayo is going no where. Mayo and Cowser in the same deal is a step above a pipe dream. You aren’t getting Mayo.
Mayo was an absolute steal when we drafted him and he has done morning but tear up the minors at really young ages.
He also likely can stay at third defensively but the O’s have the left side pretty covered.
I don't give a s%*# what this guy says. If Mayo isn't available then why are we even entertaining Cease to BAL?
I want 1 guy they don't want to trade for this deal to happen.
I reiterate, this franchise is fucked anyhow, so may as well hold out for the moon and take the risk if no one pays.
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1 minute ago, Frobby said:
Kind of a premature comment IMO. We have no idea what’s been offered for Cease, nor do we know what eventually will be offered before the dust settles. If Cease goes to another team for less value than Cowser and Ortiz would have provided, I’ll say Elias was too stingy with his prospects (depending on what else he does). Until then, it’s anybody’s guess what has happened or will happen.
I’ll say this: in general, GMs move more slowly than their fan bases would prefer.
I'm reading this thread and seeing stuff about no one from their top 5...which I guess also seems premature but who knows.
All I'm saying is if Getz is holding out for the moon I don't blame him. This organization needs to be rehauled top to bottom. Succumbing to some middling package from Baltimore because they don't want to play ball makes no sense. Take the risk and see if he pitches lights out and someone gets serious at the deadline. If the worst happens oh well this team was entering probably an entire new decade of futility anyway.
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18 hours ago, YouCanPutItOnTheBoardYES! said:
Elias is a prospect hugging clown. I hope Baltimore never wins anything.
Word. No one from their top 5 for a durable TOR starter with 2 years left? Even if he isn't an "ace" like 2022 there is a ton if value here just being dismissed because he didn't repeat 2022 with the worst group of baseball players I have ever seen.
The Sox are fucked as a franchise anyway so if you can't even pry a decent package from Baltimore just roll with him and maybe try again at the deadline. If he goes down to injury oh well, a few ok to good Baltimore prospects weren't going to turn this s%*# show around.
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I get that teams love their top prospects but you gotta give to get. There shouldn't be 3 "untouchables" in the Orioles farm system for 2 years of a Cy Young caliber pitcher.
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4 hours ago, Jake said:
I didn't want to talk about it when the news broke, but the feeling is still there. After all the baseball-related s%*# I've been served, I didn't really waver. But my overwhelming feeling upon hearing the Benetti news was that I didn't want to be a Sox fan anymore. I feel basically stuck, there's no other team I care for and I continue to harbor the resentments towards various Sox adversaries. But man are the White Sox playing with fire (with me specifically, at least) if the expansion teams get rolling soon...especially if Charlotte gets one.
Good, they can just go become the MLB Knights and the White Sox can disappear. They're no better than a AAA team anyway and they'd likely have no major logistical problems getting rid of the Sox, Knights become MLB, Barons become AAA, and so forth. It's not like Jerry has poured so many resources into the minors that getting rid of one team would be a huge problem.
Then a real team can move to the South Side.
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6 minutes ago, Y2Jimmy0 said:
I heard him and he’s correct. Jason Benetti is better at his job than anyone else currently employed by the White Sox. Benetti will do final fours and super bowls etc. He’s one of the best at his job in the country and he wanted to broadcast White Sox games. Jerry didn’t pony up and he’s never liked his style anyway. He’s a short-sighted old f*** though and he can’t be gone soon enough.
preach brother. Wont be long before jason does super bowls or at least conference games. f*** the white Sox.
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Home run calls arent the only thing that makes a broadcaster. Yeah.. we all grew up on Hawks HR calls but there is so much more to the job. HR Calls are a small part of the equation. The larger baseball community very much loves Benetti and people who dont like Jason are frankly in the minority.
This is a huge L and further indication the Sox are an awfully run org and dont give a f*** about you.
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55 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:
I understand both sides when it comes Jason, but hopefully we can all agree this is yet another embarrassment for the Sox.
Reddit is what it is but fans of other teams say they'd tune into Sox baseball specifically for Jason. Plenty of haters around here but it's a loss no matter how you slice it.
By the way who can hate Sox math? It literally is during commercial time and for the kids. What a weird reason to dislike Jason.
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Cease To Padres per Passan
in Pale Hose Talk
Posted
Whatever. If people don't want to pony up a real prospect package f*** it and let him pitch for us. Someone will want him at the deadline with more desperation even if he pitches how he did last year.