Queen Prawn Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Cwsox, i wouldn't doubt you had a problem at an Illinois/Michigan game. Most people are so damn obnoxious and hate Michigan so bad that they'll jump at anyone with Michigan garb on. I mean, we don't have thousands of shirts flying around with "muck fichigan" on them for nothing. Hopefully it doesn't happen again LOL! I can only imagine how bad the Michigan vs Michigan state game is. Brian's went to that outdoor hockey game about 3 years ago, but he said it was too damned cold to argue much less fight with anyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 You've only seen one fight at a bears game?! I've only been to two or three and have seen a few (none involving Brian lol). About 6 years ago Brian and his brother went to a Packers-Bears game when Brian was cold cocked. His brother, who has no qualms about calling out some of the stupid things Brian has done even says Brian didn't say a word through out the game. The funny part is some bears fan had it out with the guy after that and the guy who punched Brian, appologized to Brian and bought him a pop and all was well. We went to Miami for Monday night football a few years ago... I kid you not.. we saw at least a dozen fights BEFORE the damn game even started!! And we went to the Bears Vikings game last year and I lost track of the BS I saw. I'm not going to do well at those games this year. I still don't understand why we bought season tickets.. :headshake Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Then you have never been to a Hawks/Red Wings game. There are always fights at those games. Rightfully so, those Wing fans are obnoxious with the damn squids and s***. Righfully so? I am sure there are obnoxious Wings fans and I am sure there are obnoxious Black Hawk fans. And it is not a squid. It is octopi. Used during Stanley Cup playoffs. I will pass up the obvious comment to simply say obnoxiousness does not come in one team's colors only and fighting is never right. It is a game, It is a sport. The person who gets so riled they have to throw a punch at a game is a person who seriously needs a life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Prawn Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 We went to Miami for Monday night football a few years ago... I kid you not.. we saw at least a dozen fights BEFORE the damn game even started!! And we went to the Bears Vikings game last year and I lost track of the BS I saw. I'm not going to do well at those games this year. I still don't understand why we bought season tickets.. :headshake Between price and that reason, we only go to one game a year. Either a patriots or cardinals game (if they are playing each other). If he goes to the packers game, I won't go (unless no one else will), I tell him to take a brother or a friend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 when I go to away games I wear our colors - and act like a guest in their house, as you say, politely cheer - I have had great conversations with folks at USCF in other team colors - and great conversations with fans when I was at their place - and outside of one time at Illinois football (and there were special circumstances there) never ever threat threatened. I think people respect that you are there to respectfully follow your team because they do the same. one time on the skyway toll booth on my way to USCF for a game against Baltimore I am pulling up with my Michigan license plates WHTESOX and next to me pulls up a car Indiana plates ORIOLES. We high fived and laughed - it is a sport after all. Exactly. That's the spirit and attitude I take. In fact, I have found it enjoyable to visit other stadiums. In addition to St. Lou, I saw the Sox at Tiger Stadium. Again, no problems. Though I was with my 6'7" 340 lbs. brother-in-law A little story. I went to St. Louis several years back to see a Cubs-Cards game (don't worry, I rooted for the Cards). I was, however, wearing a Sox cap. On the way into the stadium, some guy spots the cap and says to me "Gene Mauch said Chicago sports fans are losers, and White Sox fans are really losers" My response, "Gene Mauch wouldn't know a winner if he saw one. Tell me, just what has Gene Mauch ever won?" Turned out this same guy sat one row in front of me, and we had a great time talking baseball all afternoon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanOfCorn Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 There is no perfect solution. More security...sure, but higher ticket prices to support them. Police ourselves...alright, but it's going to be hard to get 38,000 people to buy into that prospect. No alcohol...do you punish the majority of good fans who just want a few beers for the mistakes of a few morons who can't hold their liquor? It's not fair to ask for an answer when there isn't a tried and true one. The Sox, for years, have been the Chicago team of the people, the blue collar, hard working South Siders. Always feeling snubbed (and mostly rightfully so). So when the shirtless, cell phone using, no game watching, preening Cubs fans come in to Comiskey, Sox fans go back to what they know...being the overlooked team and fans in a Cubs town. So Sox fans get pissy and drunk and start yelling. So what's the solution JimH...a combination of all the suggestions above. Like it or not, there isn't a magic solution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 While we are on it, might as well throw this out: Games this weekend at Wrigley. My best guess is that it will be 75-80% Cubs fans. That's just my guess, don't kill me if i'm way off or anything. Friday i'm going for sure, Saturday i might go SRO. With smaller numbers of Sox fans, i think we need to just keep our mouths shut for the most part, because everyone is an even bigger target. Hell, you could end up being the only Sox fan within 50 feet of someone. I'm going. And sitting right behind the Cubs dugout. I will be wearing ALL the Sox crap I can fit on.. and I will be screaming "pee pee hands". Yea.. I'll probably get my ass kicked, but I'll deserve it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JimH Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 I'll summarize my suggestions as to how to eliminate fights/excess rowdiness at U.S. Cellular Field: 1. Increase ratio of seurity/spectator for the balance of the season to get a sample size in terms of # of altercations. 2. Institute a training program and/or aggressively work with the Police union with the ultimate goal of more proactive security. First step, have security guards walk up and down each aisle at least once every other inning. 3. Have a greater security presence on the outfield concourse, including plain clothes security. Their specific role would be similar to a "beat cop". 4. Greater security presence in the parking lots for tailgates. If excess consumption and/or intoxicated behavior is noted, a friendly but stern discussion should result. 5. Get adults as ushers. Not kids, not senior citizens. Pay them more if needed. Pass cost along to consumers if needed, state it's for a safer situation for all of us if there needs to be a PR effort. 6. More public service announcements from players in recorded video messages. They do this now, they need to do more. Consider asking a player to make a live announcement before the game. 7. Have a season ticket holder panel and/or survey on security issues. Ask season ticketholders how they feel, ask for multiple choice feedback and also free form feedback. 8. More security presence after the games. Rarely do I see a security guard on my way out of the ballpark (could be just me, don't know). Especially with a volatile game/opponent. That's 8, I'm sure there are more suggestions. My suggestion about not wearing your jersey to other teams stadiums is not included since obviously that is a personal preference thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniKrush Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 I taught him well.. :headshake Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 you asked, I assumed you couldn't find my post. To be honest... I thought there was more to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Controlled Chaos Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 I think the answer is people have to be responsible for their own actions...Some people are just assholes. I mean honestly...how many people here would start s*** with someone telling you to watch your language cause of their kids. Even in my punk. Im smarter than anyone days...I wouldn't talk back to someone like that..let alone a cop. I'd feel like an idiot for swearin so loud...and I thinkn most people here would. Those guys have no respect for other people and clearly no respect for authority. Most people aren't like that. As for solutions....well the only thing that sucks is they affect everyone because of a select few....but if ya want some...then here they are. 1) Stop paying vendors by how much beer the sell. 2)Only allow people to by beer in the vicinity of their seats. If you lost your ticket stub...oh well....sorry. It would cut down on at least one beer that people get as soon as they walk in the park. It would also force people to go to the same vendor or food place to get a beer. 3) have an asshole screener at the gates of the park. Marriotti should be good at it, since he looks at one in the mirror everyday. I mean seriously...some things can be helped and somecan't. Like I said those guys were real jagbags. Most people are decent people...whether they been drinking or not....most of us know right from wrong. These guys weren't decent and you can tell by the way they acted. Is it cause they're sox fans??? I don't know. Hell I don't even know if they are sox fans. If they were at wrigley would they have done the same thing?? YEP!! If they were at wrigley and did do the same thing....would people associate them with the park and it's drunk unruley fans or would they just say these were a couple of jerks out of 99% of good fans. I'm thinking the latter. We just don't get that benefit of the doubt. There's assholes everywhere...but our park is the only one with camera's in the toliet's!!!!!!!! Lost in this hijacked thread was my most insightful post with what just may be the quote of the year at the bottom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wong & Owens Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Excellent point. Agreed. Would anyone have a problem with removing Ligue from society and making him a permanent test subject for research labs? Or just launching him into outer space? Would anyone object to this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 To be honest... I thought there was more to it. No, I figured as long as I was two or three ahead of you, I was fine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 No, I figured as long as I was two or three ahead of you, I was fine Obviously you're referring to beers. I've been long complaining about this crap and giving suggestions. Nothing's going to change until something makes people afraid to do that crap there. The "phonebook" is not enough. They need to stop slaping the hands of these idiots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Critic Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 To be honest with you.. I think if a tough example was set in the first place a lot of this crap would stop. Ligue got a slap on the hand. If he had gotten some jail time or somthing other than ust probation it might have deferred others from the bahavior. DINGDINGDINGDINGDING!!!!! THAT is the solution - examples need to be made of these asswipes. At the old Stadium, they had a lockup in the basement that was notorious for taking the subhumans down there and giving them an "adjustment". That obviously will never fly anymore, given today's hyper-litigious society. But if you give REAL punishment to dickheads, future potential dickheads may have a moment of clarity through the alcohol-induced fog and realize that it ISN'T worth it. As things stand, all they stand to get from their actions is notoriety among their dips*** cro-magnon friends, and THAT's probably what they want anyway. I occasionally wear the other team's colors at a game, and will always respond to a taunt with some sort of self-depricating wisecrack. Finding a comical way to put them off their guard works REALLY well in my experience. In this case, since the Burbank cop's family weren't seated near the foul-mouthed dopes, they could just as easily walked past the Tard Brothers and simply told their kids later "that kind of language is NOT nice, and I don't want to ever hear you use those bad words". If they were seated in the same area as Dumb and Dumber, you can notify security that your ballpark experience is being compromised, and after enough complaints something will HAVE to be done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniKrush Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Jim, all your 8 points are pretty good, i like #4 though because it's something that i don't think has been talked about much anywhere. I really do think alcohol causes the majority of this stuff. That's not an excuse, certainly...but too drinkee (as Boers would say) is not good at sporting events. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 LOL! I can only imagine how bad the Michigan vs Michigan state game is. Brian's went to that outdoor hockey game about 3 years ago, but he said it was too damned cold to argue much less fight with anyone. UM-MSU is never bad in any sport. Some mouthing off but nothing major - it usually is literally a family member who is the closest person to with the other team's jersey! Plus we play too much in too many sports to be all hostile all the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 The answer? How about the fans at the Cell being proactive and self policing. When you become aware of someone being a little too rowdy and a little too inebriated, report it to security. If it continues, report it again. Encourage fans in the area to back you up by doing the same thing. If the offending party targets you personally, don't "accept the challenge". Just shut up, walk away and get security. this the best advice ever Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 DINGDINGDINGDINGDING!!!!! Yea.. uh hu.. Go me, go me.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JimH Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 I do not see any value in arguing that another stadium has more problems. Would it help the Sox if more people attended games? Would more people attend games if fans were not getting their noses broke? If so called fans were not screaming profanities? You can argue all you want how other venues are just as dangerous, but the bottom line, people stay away from the Cell and attend games at Wrigley. Maybe characterizing Cub fans as yuppie drunks on cell phones actually helps their attendance. I'll even agree that Hawk games are now filled with fights. Maybe that is why the Hawks ranked 27 of 30 teams in attendance? Behind some big hockey markets like Phoenix and San Jose2003-2004 Attendance Numbers And the Bears were 24 out of 32. Tex ... read the posts please. You keep hanging your hat on people saying "other stadiums are worse". I've outlined suggestions. Where are yours? What I pointed out, and you know this is what I pointed out, is there are problems at other stadiums and not just problems at U.S. Cellular. I never said there are worse problems at other stadiums. All stadiums have problems. To point to security being the issue why people flock to Wrigley and not U.S. Cellular is, well, ignoring multiple other factors. As for Hawks games "NOW" filled with fights, again, read the post. The fights were one hell of a lot worse when you attended the games, late 80's, early 90's. There were tons of fights in the early 70's. There are actually LESS fights now, based on my personal observation only, that observation based on going to 15 home games this year and roughly that amount, or more, over the last several years. And 30 or so from 1998 previous. Saying that there are more fights now, and pointing to attendance numbers being low, and implying that's the cause ... way off base. You sat in the mezzanine at the Stadium during Hawks games, you had less fights there than in the 1st balcony, I'll grant you that. But there were lots of fights in the mezzanine too, you were lucky to have not been there on those nights. I do not have the "fight card' Chicago Police statistics, but I've been to tons of Hawks games, tons of Bears games, tons of Sox games. My personal observation, based on attending games since 1965? Hawks games worst, especially 10+ years ago. Bears games next, especialy w/ a division rival. Sox games last. All have problems though, no doubt about that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniKrush Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Fights at Hawks games aren't the reason people aren't going. There haven't been many in the games i've been to over the past 3-4 years (I was at 4-5 last year, and 10 the year before). I could write for pages upon pages why people don't go, i'll summarize it in one word: Wirtz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Cwsox, i wouldn't doubt you had a problem at an Illinois/Michigan game. Most people are so damn obnoxious and hate Michigan so bad that they'll jump at anyone with Michigan garb on. I mean, we don't have thousands of shirts flying around with "muck fichigan" on them for nothing. Hopefully it doesn't happen again its a long story - not for now - Illinois was more trash talk than usual at other team's places but it was special circumstances that led to that being potentially ugly at the end of the game (2000), however, a large group of us in maize and blue stood together and waited until the Illini fans left but I was not impressed really at all by the football fan attitude at Illinois -- but until game end I didn't feel anyone was going to jump me - visiting the oither schools and seeing their campus and tradition is fun, and Illinois has a beautiful campus, really impressed by it. trust me, Michigan fans have a long standing special place in their, ah, affection for Illinois, goes back to the 1980 or 81 game - everyone does that Muck Fichigan. I give Illinois credit for having the most obscene and wickedly funny tshirts I ever saw mocking Michigan, there was some creative wit went into that - something the folks at Iowa or OSU would never have, creativity - damn was it foul but it was funny! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Ok, everyone convinced me. There have been a ton of fights at Hawk games. A ton of fights at Bears games. Brewer games are crazy with fights. People get shot at Wrigley. College games are fight filled. The Cell is just like every where else and I'm an asshole for expecting Sox fans to be better. Personal safety and abusive language is not something that should keep families away. No problem. I just have to learn to be more tolerant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniKrush Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Oh, it was the 2000 game? Then you deserve everything you had coming to you Just kidding...BUT IT WAS A FUMBLE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JimH Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Ok, everyone convinced me. There have been a ton of fights at Hawk games. A ton of fights at Bears games. Brewer games are crazy with fights. People get shot at Wrigley. College games are fight filled. The Cell is just like every where else and I'm an asshole for expecting Sox fans to be better. No problem. I just have to learn to be more tolerant. No one said you're an asshole. You're expecting Sox fans to be "better", well ok that's fine. You ahve tons of casual fans who go to games too, and lots of out of towners, groups, etc. People who aren't Sox fans. You suggest, or imply, that Sox fans should band together for the greater good, and police not only themselves, but the activities around them. IMO, that's pollyanna. I agree that people should report things to security vs. taking the issue in their own hands. How about some specific suggestions for improving things, maybe something measurable vs. suggestions to society? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.