November 19, 200421 yr Which is why I described in detail all the cowardly things terrorists have done over the years? Did I mention the Achille Lauro, where the ever courageous Abu Abbas shot a wheelchair bound American in the head and threw his body into the Mediterranean? To think that I have any regard for the safety or their lives would be naive. Its too bad that the AIDS epidemic raging through South Africa isnt raging through the Mid East. We could completely do without that region of the planet. :headshake
November 19, 200421 yr Which is why I described in detail all the cowardly things terrorists have done over the years? Did I mention the Achille Lauro, where the ever courageous Abu Abbas shot a wheelchair bound American in the head and threw his body into the Mediterranean? To think that I have any regard for the safety or their lives would be naive. Its too bad that the AIDS epidemic raging through South Africa isnt raging through the Mid East. We could completely do without that region of the planet. When did I4E move to Hawaii? Not cool dude. You may wish to re-think and hit edit, or not. :headshake
November 19, 200421 yr Which is why I described in detail all the cowardly things terrorists have done over the years? Did I mention the Achille Lauro, where the ever courageous Abu Abbas shot a wheelchair bound American in the head and threw his body into the Mediterranean? To think that I have any regard for the safety or their lives would be naive. Its too bad that the AIDS epidemic raging through South Africa isnt raging through the Mid East. We could completely do without that region of the planet. Too bad the English didn't drop off that measile ridden blanket in Hawaii when they had the chance
November 19, 200421 yr Too bad the English didn't drop off that measile ridden blanket in Hawaii when they had the chance We could balance the budget and save Social Security by selling Hawaii to the Japanese. What do you think we could get for a developed island?
November 19, 200421 yr We could balance the budget and save Social Security by selling Hawaii to the Japanese. What do you think we could get for a developed island? The funny thing is, Japan couldn't buy a rock on Oahu right now because they have been a perpetual recession for about 15 years now, because their savings rates are too high, and the government refuses to infuse the economy at all, beyond their 0% interest rates. BTW as an FYI for everyone else, Hawaiisoxfn was good old Roman. He has been banned.
November 19, 200421 yr The funny thing is, Japan couldn't buy a rock on Oahu right now because they have been a perpetual recession for about 15 years now, because their savings rates are too high, and the government refuses to infuse the economy at all, beyond their 0% interest rates. BTW as an FYI for everyone else, Hawaiisoxfn was good old Roman. He has been banned. Roman Mem’ries, Like the corners of my mind Misty water-colored memories Of the way we were Scattered pictures, Of the smiles we left behind Smiles we gave to one another For the way we were Can it be that it was all so simple then? Or has time re-written every line? If we had the chance to do it all again Tell me, would we? could we? Mem’ries, may be beautiful and yet What’s too painful to remember We simply choose to forget So it’s the laughter We will remember Whenever we remember... The way we were... The way we were... Nice catch Southsider. May I take this moment to again thank you for the diligent manner in which you perform your duties. This would be a wild and wooly place, unfit for man or beast, if you were not so quick a detective Edited November 19, 200421 yr by Texsox
November 19, 200421 yr How about fight to the death? Once they are wounded do they toss aside their weapons and just lie there waiting for the enemy? Are you stating that proper procedure is shooting wounded soldiers? What happens when the enemy believes they cannot surrender? The soldier on the ground clearing a building has about 1/4 of a second to decide whether someone poses a threat to him or not. Nobody here is in a position to question the judgement of someone in that situation. The enemy knows very well that he can surrender but he isin't doing his comrades any favors when they fake it as they have done so many times in the past.
November 19, 200421 yr The soldier on the ground clearing a building has about 1/4 of a second to decide whether someone poses a threat to him or not. Nobody here is in a position to question the judgement of someone in that situation. The enemy knows very well that he can surrender but he isin't doing his comrades any favors when they fake it as they have done so many times in the past. What does he care ... he's headed toward 72 virgins.
November 19, 200421 yr The soldier on the ground clearing a building has about 1/4 of a second to decide whether someone poses a threat to him or not. Nobody here is in a position to question the judgement of someone in that situation. The enemy knows very well that he can surrender but he isin't doing his comrades any favors when they fake it as they have done so many times in the past. Two different situations. I agree 100% with what you are saying regarding moving into an unknown situation in a building in Iraq. It is something I would never want to experience. You do have to make a split decision, you have to decide if it is an enemy, an unarmed civilian, a US troop, or a wounded enenmy. I can fully understand mistakes happening, and am truly impressed that it doesn't happen more often in this building to building, room to room, fighting. US soldiers are the best trained, most highly skilled in the world. At least from what I see and hear. This was an area that they allowed a camera crew into, and an enemy they stood over, and clearly the men involved didn't seem to fear for their lives. It wasn't a split second decision. The brass needs to quickly remove this guy, have him evaluated, and an appropriate course of action found. Based on some of the quotes I've read, it seems he needs treatment, not punishment. My concern is we are creating a situation that feeds into the enemies psychological plans. They are convincing a generation of the evil pigs we are, and when we have these abuses, it confirms what the enemy is saying. I want, for the safety of US soldiers, the belief in the enemy that life is better when they surrender. That they might not get 72 virgins, but they will get three squares a day in a nice warm jail, and be treated like humans. Wouldn't it be nice if they ran into our jails, fleeing their commanders instead of fearing they will be shot, or abused? It is also the treatment we should demand from an enemy. It is on a much higher moral plane to ask for what you give.
November 19, 200421 yr BTW as an FYI for everyone else, Hawaiisoxfn was good old Roman. He has been banned. Nice catch!
November 19, 200421 yr Nice catch! Ahh Alex, "What is something not said to Jose Valentin last season?" Correct, please choose a category
November 19, 200421 yr Ahh Alex, "What is something not said to Jose Valentin last season?" Correct, please choose a category Nice!
November 19, 200421 yr Nice catch! You can't teach an Old Roman new tricks... Knowing it was Roman, it's pretty impressive he made it almost a month before the hate bombs got launched. Must have been killing him.
November 19, 200421 yr You can't teach an Old Roman new tricks... Knowing it was Roman, it's pretty impressive he made it almost a month before the hate bombs got launched. Must have been killing him. I guess we just need to periodically throw out a "Frank Thomas sucks" thread just to lure him out if he is hiding in the weeds
November 22, 200421 yr The guy who filmed the video has released a statement about what happened. http://www.kevinsites.net/2004_11_21_archi...107420331292115 It's a long read but really good because it's a first hand account of what when down.
November 29, 200421 yr Just a thought here, but every story I see on this has a headline saying something like "Muslims angry at shooting IN mosque". Why aren't the headlines more ike "Muslims angry at shooting FROM mosque"? Why are they not upset that these people are using a holy place as a battleground?
November 29, 200421 yr Just a thought here, but every story I see on this has a headline saying something like "Muslims angry at shooting IN mosque". Why aren't the headlines more ike "Muslims angry at shooting FROM mosque"? Why are they not upset that these people are using a holy place as a battleground? About 50 years worth of US supported authoritarian dictators, weapons smuggling and election fraud assistance tends to leave a bad taste in their mouth regarding the United States. Plus they see us as occupiers and not "benevolent liberators" and want us the Hell out so they don't identify with us.
November 29, 200421 yr About 50 years worth of US supported authoritarian dictators, weapons smuggling and election fraud assistance tends to leave a bad taste in their mouth regarding the United States. Plus they see us as occupiers and not "benevolent liberators" and want us the Hell out so they don't identify with us. Anyone whos been there knows thats a bunch of bulls***, including me.
November 29, 200421 yr Anyone whos been there knows thats a bunch of bulls***, including me. I've talked to people who were there -- lots of them.
November 29, 200421 yr About 50 years worth of US supported authoritarian dictators, weapons smuggling and election fraud assistance tends to leave a bad taste in their mouth regarding the United States. Plus they see us as occupiers and not "benevolent liberators" and want us the Hell out so they don't identify with us. That still doesn't explain it. Why was there a lack of anger at the mosques being used as bases and firezones BEFORE we went in there to root them out? This is like Saddam using hostages as hman shields, damned if you do, damned if you don't.
November 29, 200421 yr First off Evil Monkey (and completely off topic) did you get my PM? Secondly, how many average Iraqis knew it was going on? I Googled the topic and found this: "This cowboy behavior cannot be accepted," cleric Abdullah Abu Omar of the Ramadi Mosque told the Associated Press. I think he was blanketing both sides with this statement. And in some further Googling I found this --"The hadith (narration on the prophet) states that he hid in the Mosque his weapons to fight. First off we must remember that the hadiths are not part of the Qu'ran, but many Muslims follow it...Groups of their "Jihad" are trying to follow the procedure of Muhammad, the way that Muhammad was able to fight the unbelievers." Ah religious fundamentalism, you cause yet more death and destruction. Nothing wrong with religion per se, but when anybody starts getting militant about it -- they might want to calm down and do something else with some of their time.
November 30, 200421 yr First off Evil Monkey (and completely off topic) did you get my PM? Secondly, how many average Iraqis knew it was going on? I Googled the topic and found this: "This cowboy behavior cannot be accepted," cleric Abdullah Abu Omar of the Ramadi Mosque told the Associated Press. I think he was blanketing both sides with this statement. And in some further Googling I found this --"The hadith (narration on the prophet) states that he hid in the Mosque his weapons to fight. First off we must remember that the hadiths are not part of the Qu'ran, but many Muslims follow it...Groups of their "Jihad" are trying to follow the procedure of Muhammad, the way that Muhammad was able to fight the unbelievers." Ah religious fundamentalism, you cause yet more death and destruction. Nothing wrong with religion per se, but when anybody starts getting militant about it -- they might want to calm down and do something else with some of their time. YES, I got your PM. Thanks. On the other subject at hand, I would have to disagree with you that the clerics statement was adressing both sides. I just don't see it, don't hear it and don't read it. Sure the wording is ambigous enough that we can both interpret it our ways, so we will have to just disagree there. But to me it is just looney to think that the average Iraqi doesn't know that there are people inside mosques, shooting at coalition forces, from within the mosque. The fact that these people, be they Iraqis or outsiders, are taking refuge in a mosque and shooting from within should have every Iraqi citizen up in arms screaming at them to leave, or even forcing them to do so. If they can get so adamant against our forces for simply being there, why can't they get off their collective asses and do something for themselves? It is just hypocracy at its finest on the part of the muslims. I will, however, agree with your last paragraph. Some people need better hobbies.
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