Balta1701
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Posts posted by Balta1701
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9 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:
Does he think we are stupid? We can Google players' stats.
The bigger problem is when he acts on this stuff. When he says they can hit just fine in the spring, then in August he insists that they need to get their at bats because we're trying to win games.
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1 minute ago, southsider2k5 said:
Substitute "right hand starters" for "left hand relievers" and "Thompson" for "Horn", and it is pretty much the same sentiment.
With the notable differences that one of them was already on the 40 man roster and one of them wasn't, and one of them could be transitioned to the bullpen to try things out and one of them...already was there.
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Just now, southsider2k5 said:
of all things, this one I don't care about. I don't expect a manager to come out and say "these guys suck, see you in 2030."
You are better off saying nothing than saying something obviously untrue. Give a meaningless word salad, its fine, just don't lie to our faces.
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25 minutes ago, WestEddy said:
To me, the funniest part of all of this is the pivot from calling Mike Elias some uncomplimentary names for not wanting to jettison multiple top-20 in the game prospects for Dylan Cease - to prospect hugging on a guy who is getting passed on the depth chart by pitching titans, like Chase Solesky.
Left-handed relievers are a commodity.No, "GOOD" left handed relievers are a commodity. We have several left handed relievers right now, they're just not "Good" left handed relievers. Tanner Banks has better minor league numbers than Horn, but he's not a commodity.
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9 minutes ago, WestEddy said:
It's really a chicken and egg situation with drafting vs. development, with a side of KW/Hahn jerking the top picks around by rushing them to the major league bullpen ahead of schedule. The organization is developing pitchers, with guys like Chase Solesky and Christian Mena even passing Thompson to AAA.
They have a group of guys right behind him in Kohl Simas, Jonathan Cannon, Tyler Schweitzer, Connor McCullough, Josimar Cousin, and Juan Carela. They still have Eder, Nastrini, Bush, and another 3-4 veterans to keep fresh at AAA, where frankly, they don't have the innings at AA or AAA to fart around with this guy anymore.I guarantee you that Christian Mena is not pushing Thompson anywhere right now.
They also don't have roster spots to fart around with Horn either.
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1 hour ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:
I know you want to run the front office like an algorithm. Do something the wrong way enough times and it's likely to bite you in the ass trading younger minor league guys for older minor league guys.
At least they don't have enough talent to get 36 yr old vets the Sox have to pay $10M for a year.
I don't know if what Getz is doing now will work. He's just hoping you get enough young vets and 26 yr old minor leaguers that someone is going to blossom even for a short period to trade them or in the case of the 26y yr old minor leaguers either trade them or see what they have for another year of 2.
This is precisely how they wound up having to pay mediocre vets $17 million per year. They gave away so many pieces to cover needs that by the end they had more needs than they could fill.
Here Getz is not trying to find guys he can turn into a 23 year old starter, he’s giving away those 23 year olds to fill the 23rd and 24th slots on his roster. It is the exact opposite of what you’re saying.
Getz is doing this because he thinks he knows these guys better than everyone else. Maybe that’s true and he has gotten two guys worth more than others think. Maybe he’s unloading Hahn’s trash and taking what he can get for them. That’s all plausible, but forgive me until I wait for evidence that these guys are massively smarter when they’re acquiring players who have little power or who walk the world.
And yes, eventually this blows up in your face. These are the types of moves the Twins should be making to fill holes in the back side of their roster and maybe push them up to 92 wins rather than 89.
These are not moves that prep for Trades. For the white Sox to get back more than they gave up in these two young pitchers, the guys who came back will need to be so good that the White Sox won’t want to trade them.
Getz is paying over market value right now. If it works it is to his credit. If it doesn’t I hope we’ve learned enough not to discount it with “oh we didn’t give up that much.”
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53 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:
Write-up on Horn from BA where he ranked the Cubs’ 28th prospect:
Did you miss something in the copying or was his control so poor they didn’t score it?
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8 minutes ago, fathom said:
I’ve never seen a fan base that seems so happy at the thought of the team possibly moving out of the state. It’s so bizarre.
Jerry Reinsdorf has worked super hard to make sure people have this reaction. He’s been threatening to move the team literally my whole life, and I’m not supposed to get tired of the threat?
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16 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:
I still don't see why some don't get it.
Sox are stockpiling as much AAA+ nothing's hoping they they become somethings. Even if they are older and not likely to be on the next Sox contender,LH pitchers who can K hitters are usually in demand . The dearth of talent was so bad the only way to try to build up the system is find as many guys capable of turning a corner approaching prime years who can be traded for higher end talent in the low minors (AA or lower).
All this trading is likely to continue but they started with very little to work with.
Stockpiling AAA nothings while hoping they become something is fine when those guys cost zero, or when they cost an Aaron Bummer that they want to get rid of anyway.
The problem is - if this guy turns out to be tolerable, puts up an ERA in the mid 4s in the big leagues next year, is he going to bring back anything worth more than a strong arm, struggling guy from AA who is on the lower end of some team's prospect list? Unless he turns out really darn good, which would be surprising from his minor league numbers, the best you might hope to get back is...approximately a Matthew Thompson level wild card.
If you're signing guys or bringing in NRIs to fill these spots, that's fine, I get that. I think they've been a little reckless with money this offseason (Maldonado), but that's at least understandable. If one of them turns into something valuable, maybe you can trade one of them for some A-ball player.
But when you're giving the A-ball player up, and at the same time losing a 40 man spot that could do exactly what you say you want to do, be filled by a AAA+ nothing gotten for free, you're doing it backwards. You are hoping that, if they're lucky, they might be able to get back what they just gave up for this guy.
Big deal? Probably not, unlikely to have given up the next Max Scherzer once again, but a decent red flag. You've outlined the correct plan, trying to bring in talent/wild cards using AAA+ guys, and this deal is the opposite of that plan - giving up talent/wild cards to bring in a AAA+ guy.
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5 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said:
At least they scored some runs today but the pitching is horrid.
1 walk, 11 K's for that offense today.
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4 minutes ago, Jerksticks said:
You think Getz is raising the floor of the organization with most of these moves? These aren’t big ceiling plays but depth seems better
Honestly, no, because they have so many NRIs who could fill this roster spot that this just replaces one guy who is likely bad with another guy who looks bad.
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17 minutes ago, Jake said:
Horn is a lefty who, based on the numbers, has shown some propensity to miss bats which is the name of the game nowadays. Thompson, according to all information available to me, stinks. I believe in the potential of all men but I'm not losing sleep over this trade.
Thompson's K rate at Birmingham last year: 9.8 K/9.
Horn's K rate last year at Iowa: 10 K/9.
Yes, this is another of those trades that is, on its own, unlikely to backfire. It is unlikely that this specific pitcher will break out next year, just like the last one with Arizona. However, it is once again a low reward trade from the White Sox perspective. If you do that type of trade over and over and over again, you get low rewards overall, but eventually the odds start stacking together and it turns out that you get a trade that does in fact implode. It's unlikely to be any specific trade, but when it happens .... boom. That is how it went with Hahn and Williams - "it's ok to give these guys up, they never come back to hurt us", until they did.
With the White Sox's current situation, adding another low reward guy to the 40 man roster is just bizarre. the hope is that Getz is just cleaning out guys he doesn't like for whatever reason, but even then why are you adding a guy to the already packed 40 man roster when you signed so many NRIs who could fill those slots?
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12 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:
Maybe Horn is a nothing too, but right now he's a better nothing.
What supports this?
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3 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:
On a team with a ton of youngsters, a guy who can go out and give you a lot of innings on a regular basis out of the pen is something that is valuable. Not burning out your kids who are your future is a thing.
This team has a ton of youngsters?
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Oh come on.
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9 minutes ago, WestEddy said:
Perez is not on the 40-man, and Drohan will start the season on the IL. Many people here throw out Banks and Peralta as detritus that could be cut whenever some AAAA name passes through waivers. Tim Hill, because he once wore a Royals' uniform, will never be able to record an out while pitching for the White Sox. They're focusing on developing Ky Bush as a starter until they aren't, and Ellard probably needs a couple months in AA before they make any decisions on him.
Maybe Getz was working up to teaching Horn how to be a great pitcher, just like he did with Christian Mena, when Hahn traded him in 2021.You're right, most people would throw out Tanner Banks and Peralta as detritus that could be cut when some AAA name passes through waivers.
Banks also has significantly better minor league numbers than Bailey Horn. He's 26 already, has a similar AAA K-rate to Banks, but a walk rate nearly twice as high.
Most people would add Bailey Horn pretty quickly to the list of "Detritus that could be cut when some AAA name passes through waivers". Which is, frankly, what he's likely to be pretty quick.
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7 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:
I was going to say, on a 40-man roster, 5 left handed relievers actually seems kind of deep. And that doesn’t count just lefties in general.
That also doesn't count Crochet, but who knows exactly how they will be using him.
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3 minutes ago, WestEddy said:
Before the trade, the left-handed pitchers slated for bullpen duty seem to be:
Tim Hill (ml)Tanner Banks (ml/AAA)
Sammy Peralta (AAA)
Andrew Perez (AAA)
You're right! 4 left handers is the exactly perfect amount of left-handed bullpen guys in the bigs and AAA to go into the season with. 5 Is just one too many.I would agree, that is an awful lot of LH bullpen-only arms. Not counting Drohan, that's 10% of a 40 man roster, whereas normally 1 or 2 LH relievers is normal, which is 7.7% of a 26-man roster (or 3.8% if you had only 1). That's just collecting LH relievers.
They also have LH relief pitcher Fraser Ellard in camp. Ky Bush is there too and is also LH, although for now he's a starter.
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7 minutes ago, WestEddy said:
That's what I'm guessing. Bannister cut bait on a low ceiling, onerous fix in Thompson.
You still need relievers when you're losing 90 games.Are there no other potential relievers on the current White Sox 40 man roster? I see quite a few, and there's numerous other minor leaguers in camp who could be brought up with a roster spot if one was available.
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Just now, Harold's Leg Lift said:
Get rid of the players you don't think will be part of the future for players you think have a chance to be part of the future. Don't stop now, Boys!
A 26 year old who has never made the big leagues, who requires a 40 man spot on a team without many available 40 man spots, who has a minor league walk rate of 5 BB/9IP, and a minor league ERA of 4.2 is a guy who has a chance to be part of the future? I guess in terms of "he's been designated for assignment" is an activity that would have to happen in the future.
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1 minute ago, southsider2k5 said:
If this article was written about literally anyone else but Mena, Sox fans would be blowing this off as spring training fluff.
I would be excited if I heard a positive report about Cease's spring velocity. Or Crochet's. Or Kopech's.
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Just now, WBWSF said:
The Marlins have Burger and Anderson on the left side of the infield. As of now the White Sox have Moncada and Dejong on the left side of the infield. I would rather have the Marlins left side of the infield over what the White Sox have. I'm hoping Montgomery has a good spring training and is the Opening Day shortstop.
I am absolutely hoping for the opposite. Rushing the guy from AA because you have to fill a spot on your competitive roster that is totally competitive and definitely competitive is a Rick Hahn classic.
Montgomery was hurt for a good portion of last year, has 218 plate appearances at AA, and a .218 batting average at AA.
Let him play his way up. Give him 2 good months at AA if he's healthy, then move him up to Charlotte, and if he's still strong there, then bring him up later in the season. If he has any more injuries or struggles with anything, take your time and wait until next year - if you wait until April 2025 you might even have a shot at a compensatory pick for him being an opening day callus.
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1 hour ago, ptatc said:
Because they are all new at the job and let's see what the results are.
Again, I realize most people here are very impatient and are automatically going to not like anything that happens.
I'm going to wait for the results and base my judgemental on that instead of going with the "well it's the White Sox so everything they do sucks."
Just because you disagree with it doesn't necessarily mean it's wrong. It very well could be but I'm willing to wait for the results before condemning everyone.
Results like a team the GM thought was competitive in a weak division that spent a season at each others throats, where basically everyone underperformed, where they were sloppy and unfocused, and where they lost 101 games?
Tell me how I shouldn’t judge Grifol based on his team’s underperformance last year. They had the talent of a 75 win team. Fine, this wasn’t where they wanted to be, but they played like a 67 win team in the first half, so bad that they had to trade people away. Multiple veterans ripped them after they left, all the way to literally yesterday.
How many seasons do we have to wait for before judging him? In spring 2025 do we have to hear that we can’t judge the coach until we see the results? 26? 27? Is Grifol still someone we are waiting on in 2028? 2029? Maybe he gets better in season 8, after all it’s unfair to judge any coach based on their first 7 seasons.
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3 minutes ago, FloydBannister1983 said:
Reinsdorf doesn’t get credit for offering Machado $100 million when there were poison pills in there and he had no intention of ever paying that money. It’s as credible as any one of us offering Machado $100 million.
Same for Wheeler. It’s easy to offer something that won’t be accepted.
I do actually think they tried for Wheeler, but they weren't willing to step up and declare "We are going to put the highest offer out for this guy".
There's lots of components about that. There's the team's hesitation to actually go out and buy guys that are really good fits. There's the fact that they blew $50 million on trash the offseason before that.
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Grifol: DeJong, Lopez, Maldonado are good on offense
in Pale Hose Talk
Posted
"Well even the best teams have guys there to play different roles. Great teams have guys who are there to play great defense, to be great on the base paths. We have guys in our lineup who we are counting on to generate offense, we have other guys who we're counting on for defense or to work with the pitching staff. If we're counting on guys for defense, we expect them to do their best with the bats, and the other guys will be knocking them in."