NorthSideSox72

Floyd for Salty, Salty platoon with Flowers (until one emerges maybe). Saves you $5-6M. Use the $5-6M along with the other money they were maybe going to give Adams, and sign Youkilis. If they can't get Youk, get Keppinger. Leave the bullpen as is. Sign a guy like Jurrjens to compete with the likes of Santiago and Rienzo for the 5th spot. That is what I'd like to see happen, assuming they really are pretty close to their salary ceiling.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Dec 4, 2012 -> 01:12 PM) That's totally fine -- if you aren't interested in evaluating player performance, there's nothing wrong with that. Just acknowledge (to yourself) that you have no idea what you're talking about and remember that since you don't understand and have no interest in learning, that no one should take your assessment seriously. Now this is just ridiculous. Having more knowledge of advanced stats does not grant you some sort of special talisman that means anyone else's opinions on the value or performance of a player are wrong. YASNY could just as easily make your exact same post in reverse - that if you are unwilling to acknowledge or learn about the dynamic, non-stats-driven aspects of the game, that your assessments should not be taken seriously. How does that sound to you? Stats are powerful tools in evaluating impact and performance of players over time. They can also be used as semi-reliable predictors of LIKELY outcomes - not definite ones. Therefore, all stats are limited in scope, have inherent flaws, and will never be able to capture all aspects of a player's value to a team. That is an impossible standard. Stats are great. Baseball is great. Stats only describe certain aspects of the game. Get it?

Back in April, the US House passed HR 4089. Purports to help support hunters, fishermen and shooters. In reality, if you read the bill, it completely guts the Wilderness Act. Ugh. Fortunately the Senate buried it in committee, but still, even the threat of something like that passing is enough to make me ill. And why the hell is recreational shooting, in wilderness areas, being championed anyway? Not hunting mind you - just shooting. Why would you want to do that specifically in a wilderness area?

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Dec 3, 2012 -> 01:38 PM) digging around for some other stuff, I came across this from CBPP: They don't source this, but it appears to be valid: http://extension.missouri.edu/p/G508 That's a good start, thanks. Though I don't think there needs to be an filed exemption process to prove those things - just base it on asset type, and therefore liquidity. Makes the process more fair and more efficient. And you have to pay interest - I don't like that part. It is a penalty, and I don't feel there should be a penalty for this, since they were basically given a situation and did not do anything wrong.

QUOTE (warehouse41 @ Dec 3, 2012 -> 11:44 AM) Sign AJ (3 years, 24 million), trade Flowers to Mets for a top prospect 3B that is MLB ready and that wold be inexpensive. With David Wright blocking the position for the next 8 years they should have some expendable pieces at 3b in the minors and they seem to be interested in Flowers whose power is great but I worry about the Sox adding another peice to the everyday lineup that strikes out all of the time in place of a fairly consistent contact hitter with some pop in AJP. Flowers will not get you a "top prospect 3B'. And I don't think AJ is worth 3/24, nor do I think that any team will give him 3 years. The Sox may indeed sign AJ, as it seems few teams are on him right now, but only if the market really dries up and they can get him cheap on a 1+1 type deal in terms of years. if they can't get him for that cheap, I'd rather not get him at all. I hate to say that because I love AJ, but, he's likely to go back to career norms or lower with the bat in 2013, and his defense is declining.

In terms of Salty's value... he's got 2 arb years left, and will likely only get about $3M for 2013. That versus 1 year of Floyd at $9.5M, which is slightly under market, but only for a year. I'd say the Sox would likely get a prospect as well, but not a big one. I like the idea. Salty with a .779 OPS vs RHP in 2012. Makes a perfect match for Flowers. And I don't think Salty will be a backup, I'd bet he gets half the AB's, unless or until one of them shows they are much better than the other. And there is no commitment past 2013 for Salty either. This also frees up about $6M in payroll space to help with 3B, which is a potentially big factor.

QUOTE (IowanSoxFan @ Dec 2, 2012 -> 02:56 PM) Is Josh Phegley the backup catcher then? QUOTE (spiderman @ Dec 2, 2012 -> 04:39 PM) If they don't bring back AJ, my guess is that they will bring in a veteran catcher who can complement Flowers. Yeah, Phegley is probably well down the list of options. He did play AAA all of last year, and he is currently at the top of the minor league depth chart for Sox catchers. But... he only did "OK" in Charlotte last year (.266/.306/.373, good contact rate though amd hit .361 in final 10 games)... his defense was never considered a strong suit... he's actually only gotten in 2.5 full season's worth of AB's due to his injury history (but was healthy in 2012)... and he was a much better hitter last year against lefties (.830 OPS) than righties (.611 OPS). So he just doesn't fit well as a backup for Flowers.

I'll say this again like I did a month ago... baseball is aware of AJ's prickly demeanor, and that has an effect. They are also all very aware that his 2012 is 99.9% likely to be an aberration. So you're looking at a 36 year old catcher with a ton of innings who is likely to regress offensively, has already been on the decline defensively for a while, and has potential character issues. Not surprising that teams aren't jumping to get him. Yankees are intriguiing though - seems like a potential fit for a number of reasons. But they are no longer the Yankees of unlimited budget. I'll be surprised if he gets more than 2 years, or more than $8M per. Probably more like $6-7M per for 2. And at that range, the Sox might think about taking him.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 30, 2012 -> 08:12 AM) Russel Martin is out there as well. Signed with the Pirates.

QUOTE (HickoryHuskers @ Nov 30, 2012 -> 06:48 AM) Only way it makes sense to give Johnson a roster spot is if Paulie or Dunn is being traded. Depends on who your other bench guys are. Assuming you carry Johnson and a backup C, with a 4 man bench, you have two guys to cover the OF and skill IF positions. If one of them is a guy like Lillibridge, then all you reall need is a CF backup and you're set.

Heyman hints that Yankees may be looking at AJ too. Seems like there are about 4-5 teams looking for a full time catcher, and pretty much only AJP and Napoli available as free agents. Not sure who else in trade.

Unless the Sox are freeing up money in some novel way, I don't think it makes much sense to spend that kind of money on a reliever right now. I'd rather roll the dice with the 'pen we have, and spend the money on 3B and/or C.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 29, 2012 -> 12:13 PM) How many White Sox players can you really consider popular by the consensus of Soxtalk? Sale, Paulie, probaby Ramirez, Tyler Flowers is starting to become popular like a back up QB, but I wouldn't call him popular just yet. Everyone else gets ripped plenty. Pretty much everyone except Sale gets ripped plenty. Rios was ripped relentlessly (with good reason) in 2010 and 2011, but he was suddenly very popular in 2012. And he does make sense to trade, at a high point in his performance and with the salary he has on the table. Outfielders are easier to replace than some other positions, relatively. Might be Rios.

QUOTE (Cali @ Nov 29, 2012 -> 11:43 AM) A singles hitter at third. Just what we need... Can't have ZERO power from every infielder except Paulie Zero power? Alexei hit 9 homers last year, right around average in MLB, in a down year. In 2010 and 2011, he hit 18 and 15, good for 3rd and 6th in baseball. Beckham hit 9 in 2010 (T-14th among regular 2B's, basically average), 10 in 2011 (14th, again, average), and 16 in 2012 (T-8th, above average). Then there's Konerko, who is typically above average or near league-leading in HR's even among 1B's. Power from the non-3B infield isn't the problem with the Sox, at all. The middle infielders lack OBP, that is the bigger issue, and that is where Youk came in handy in 2012.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 29, 2012 -> 08:13 AM) I am sure teams have a lot of questions about AJ, and deservedly so. I have a lot of questions about AJ, and he has played here for years. That could work out well for the Sox.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Nov 29, 2012 -> 06:26 AM) Yes, because Buehrle suddenly became a power pitcher who was throwing 98 mph and striking 200+ guys out a season, right? Not even the same comparison. Pretty sure he was being sarcastic, mocking your link of draft round to success-only-by-chemical.

Here is what is weird to me about the AJ situation... if you look at the noise on Twitter, MLBTR, and other places from the usual chatterboxes... the catchers being talked about all the time are Martin, Salty, and a few others. I have not seen AJ mentioned at ALL, except in reference to the Sox wanting him back but maybe not able to get him. I can't tell what that means, but I think it is interesting. My personal theory is that the teams looking for a C, at least some of them, may be scared off of him due to a combination of age and reputation. If I'm right, then the Sox will sign him late, and for cheaper than most of you are supposing. Of course, I could be wrong. As for Rock's intimation about a deal sending off a popular player... if it clear salary room, I think they will then quickly sign Youk for 3B.

Balta pretty much covers it for me, as far as why the power spike in the minors is maybe something, but all the pedigree stuff is pretty useless information. And even the minor league spike isn't a dead giveaway or anything. QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Nov 28, 2012 -> 01:57 PM) That's not even bringing up some of the allegations against him. The andro use when he was young, the sudden 20-pound muscle gain in the middle of his career, the back acne everyone mentions. If you really think Piazza is clean, then IMO you have to say Sosa is clean, because there is the exact same amount of "evidence" for both of them. Now, if you are saying there are people who claim he used andro, or had physical changes like you describe, then that is something worth considering. I haven't seen or heard of those, and I didn't see him suddenly bulk up either - and I was a burgeoning baseball fan when his career started, so I did watch him quite a few times. The evidence for Sosa is not at all the same as for Piazza. The only commonality is that neither was ever caught with a test.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Nov 28, 2012 -> 01:32 PM) The only reason he was drafted was as a favor to Tommy Lasorda. If you want to believe this is some great story of a passed-over kid who becomes a Hall of Famer, then go ahead. But after everything that went on in MLB in the 80s & 90s, it's pretty obvious how dirty Piazza was. I see nothing obvious about that at all. Baseball history is littered with players both overachieving and underachieving. Some were dirty, others weren't. For all I know, all six players I listed as who I'd vote for may have been roided up. But if there is no evidence, then I can't draw that conclusion. I can only work with what is in front of me. And scouting opinions from high schoolers is not evidence of, really, anything at all. The sudden spike in the minors means a lot more to me as evidence.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 28, 2012 -> 12:53 PM) The went from being a 62nd round draft pick, only because he was related to someone in the Dodgers organization, to Hall of Fame stats. If you look at his minor league numbers, you can see a tell-tale hop in power from 1990 to 1991 http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/p...id=piazza001mic I didn't look at the minor league numbers - that certainly is interesting. Just as he was repeating High A as a low round pick, soon destined for filler status, he explodes. That is somewhat incriminating. But... he also kept up the power and numbers for his entire career, and a long one at that (hard to do as a catcher). That makes it seem less likely, but still possible. QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Nov 28, 2012 -> 12:54 PM) A 62nd round pick during the steroid era ends up hitting more home runs than any other catcher in history. That's all I need to know. That means nearly nothing to me. Players are drafted wrong all the time. No way I'm going to rely on what scouts said about a kid's tools in high school to determine whether or not he was a roider years later. That's ridiculous.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Nov 28, 2012 -> 12:42 PM) It's pretty damn obvious that Piazza is a roider. I think there is the same amount evidence for him as there is for Sosa though. Hm. I'm not so sure. Piazza's power numbers curve doesn't show much of any sudden spike or alteration, like with Sosa's. I also don't recall Piazza suddenly showing up after one offseason with 30 pounds of extra muscle. So if we're talking purely circumstantial, I see nothing here. But if there are any pieces of evidence out there, any witnesses or the like, that's different.

Have there ever been any PED rumors or evidence about Piazza, that anyone knows of?

My ballot would be... Craig Biggio Edgar Martinez Jack Morris Dale Murphy Mike Piazza Tim Raines Or is there a max of 5 votes? If so, I'd have to drop either Martinez or Murphy, probably Martinez.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 28, 2012 -> 10:25 AM) I'd be willing to bet the Sox haven't even asked about Hamilton. KW and Hahn have both said, they pretty much ask about everyone. Doesn't mean it will work out. But I'd bet they asked.

QUOTE (Springfield SoxFan @ Nov 27, 2012 -> 08:53 PM) Did Kloess get traded to the Padres? Yes. Thus, I didn't write him into the article posted on FS.