upnorthsox

Johnson won 16 games Clement won 9 games Who's pitched better? Or do we need to look at their run support first? This whole arguement is much more amusing when it Scrubs fans: Obviously Kerry f***ing Wood is a better pitcher than Buehrle, just look at their stats. Obviously Matt f***ing Clement is a better pitcher than Buehrle, just look at their stats. Yada Yada Yada

No, you're missing the point.

And he will get more with the '05 White Sox? Why is that so much a f***ing given?

Then again, if you wanted to stick it to Twins management where would you want to go?

Oh, and Beane would love to have someone take Kendall's contract off his hands. That could easily be a deal closer right there.

Well they'd love to get a closer along with another starter, I think Marte would be the closest thing to it available of the teams supposedly in the running.

In this context, as a 5th I want someone who's actually won before. ELo, Millwood, Sele are all former 20 gamers, Washburn is an 18 gamer. They don't have to have their best stuff anymore, they just need to find a way to win 11-12 with what they've still got. Playoff experience is a plus too. I believe Nomo is available too and he's also someone I'd consider.

Sorry, hate it.

Look at the same deal for RJ as Hudson, Gar, Marte, Anderson, and mid-prospect. Whichever GM bites first I'd be happy. With the A's, I'd be glad to throw in Everett for Kendall too.

If we had to give up Gar to get RJ or Hudson I'd love to get Washburn to be our 5th, I just don't want him as our 3.

IMO he took the trade too hard and acted immature about it, after he got called on the carpet about it he turned things around. It may be because of bad first impressions or it could be about money that they're cutting him, but teammates b****ing when they have that steroid loving asshole down the lockerroom gets no traction with me. Btw, this is all conjecture on my my part, in reality WTFKs.

Of course Clement is being used as leverage, something had to be done to get ARI to move off their rediculous position. That said, I'm sure Clement is a fallback position anyhow so it's not a bluff either per se.

Actually, with Gars $3.5 mil and Carl's $4 mil, if you can Get the Yanks to throw in even $2 mil with Vazquez then you are only 500k in payroll from where you are now, that's plenty to still sign a Perez or possibly even a Clement(though I'm against that). Dye can DH and and we can go get Dave Roberts and his 30+ SB to play the OF, that'd give us 3 guys(Roberts, SPod, ARow) with CF range plus a 100+ SB outfield. You could even trade Crede for Furcal giving us close to a 200 SB team. Now that'd be a run and gun team.

Given the choice between paying Vazquez or paying Clement all that money, it's Vazquez hands down. It's keeping Garland or having the chance to get rid of Everett that's the tough call.

I think that's more than I care to know about you.....................not that there's anything wrong with that.

Yes quite the conundrum, it's like the winter 1997 all over again. After being the runner up in the central for 3 straight yrs the Sox are looking to aquire a pitcher to put us over the hump, sound familiar? In '97 the choices were: An aging multi-CYA winner who's career was winding down - Clemens A young up and coming CYA winner in his walk yr - Pedro And a 30ish Cub pitcher who had put up good stats there in the previous 2 yrs but not alot of wins - Navarro Of course the aging multi-CYA winner was not washed up and would go on to win multiple CYA's. The young up and coming CYA winner would go on to win multiple CYA's while dominating the league(and maybe his era). And the 30ish Cub pitcher would...........................................come to the Sox. In '04 the choices are: An aging multi-CYA winner who's career is winding down - Johnson. A young up and coming CYA winner in his walk yr - Hudson. And a 30ish Cub pitcher who has put up good stats there in the previous 2 yrs but not alot of wins - Clement. Do you ever get the feeling that if you got an opportunity to do a "do over" in life that you'd make better choices or are you resigned to the fact that history repeats itself. Such is life being Sox fans.

IMHO Johnson would be the emotional choice Clement would be the dumb choice Perez would be the cheap choice Hudson would be the intelligent choice With KW you can't rule out the emotional choice. With JR you definitely can't rule out the cheap choice. God forbid we ever make the intelligent choice. So the answer is.......................................................... .........We'll just have to wait til July to find out.

MB would be getting less than whatever Clement gets since he had a higher era, less K's and more hits than IP. Stats are what's important.

So would we be paying him $10 mil a yr to put up stats or win games? Houston finished 76-86 that yr in 3rd place.

.....And he hit .253 the yr before that. Like I said, I like Juan and I don't have a prob with us signing him but the $$$ are based on a big statistical jump which can be problematic if he reverts back. After a similar statistical jump in '99 Pokey Reese signed about the same contract we just gave Juan, after signing that contract there were definite regrets. So since ARow is a .310 hitter and also a 1st yr arb guy we should be expecting that steal of a $3.5 mil deal, right?

If he was a .283 hitter you might be right although that'd still be alot of money even for a 1st yr .283 hitting arb guy.

Damm, I like Uribe and all but we sure are paying alot for a .250 hitter with a statistical HR blip.

Funny, I read a thread this morning on quotes from all the different sportswriters on this trade and except for a few kudo's thrown Arvia's way it was pretty much a bash the media fest.

Cowley has always been the funnel for leaks on this team, whether from players or management.

LOL!!! Too F'ing funny!!! I knew since we weren't a winner in this trade that it would become common knowledge by Friday that CLee was pure evil. Looks like my prediction was dead on spot.