Jenksismyhero

QUOTE (bmags @ Jan 23, 2015 -> 03:41 PM) If this plan isn't working as well as others, why wouldn't you cut back on it and extend the others. This is just "oh but it SOUNDS bad" It is working, just not for the people Obama wants it to work for. It's not as if this program is designed ONLY for people who are rich. It would greatly benefit the middle class. They just have to use it.

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jan 23, 2015 -> 03:46 PM) You seem to be shifting from wanting to help the middle class to calling for more deductions and tax credits for the upper-middle/upper class. I said earlier do both - it makes little sense to get rid of something just because it helps people with money. For some situations, i'm sure tax free benefits of a 529 plan may be preferred over a 2,500 credit (middle class kid going to a private school, for example). And it's not adding MORE deductions/credits, it's not taking away one that already exists.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jan 23, 2015 -> 03:26 PM) Yeah, it is absurd how little benefit you get for something as expensive as day care, especially in an era where so many people are dual income (and to be frank have to be). Child credits/deductions only benefit people with money who can afford to pay those expenses. Let's end those programs.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jan 23, 2015 -> 03:21 PM) Well earnings would have to be like $10,000 to generate that amount of a tax credit (e.g., you generated $10,000 and had an effective rate of 25%, you would get the 2500). That said I think they already have the 2500 so not sure how it all shifts and even than I think that 2500 credit has its own exemptions, etc. All of this crap is complicated as can be and I would think a lot of the use depends on (A) whether a family can set aside money for college and (B) whether they have the financial knowledge (or have an adviser) who knows about such options. I think the reality is the wealthy tend to be more likely to have the extra cash (but plenty of middle class people can and should...its just a matter of what / where you spend your money and how thorough of a plan there is...once of course you get to a solid "middle-class" income) but I bet the wealthy also tend to be more financially educated (Or likely to have advisers) who help them take advantage of this. I don't know if the avg middle class person uses a 529 but the average middle class person probably could (if they adjusted their priorities from a spending perspective). That said, every unique family and household has their own things they feel are important. I can't tell you how many people I see that piss money away on phones or tech when they don't take care of more basic necessities / needs and I don't get it, but to each their own. I'm a tight ass accountant who works in FP&A so planning and being cheap is what I do for a living and its how I live my life (and my wife is an accountant as well and stingier than me, haha). Those purchases are necessities, not wants. You cannot live in 2015 without a smartphone and date plan no less than 1 year old. This, by the way, is why it infuriates me when liberals want to cut things that benefit people with money but not those without. In reality it COULD benefit a ton more people, they just don't take advantage of it. Let's penalize people for being smart and successful. That'll show em.

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/3944...-michael-barone Obviously the key here is for the GOP to break from the hardcore right and be more centrist, especially on social issues. Unfortunately the candidates right now are pathetic, but a guy like Christie - assuming he can get out of the primary - would be a formidable foe. He'd appeal to a lot of the centrist voters. .

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/04/opinion/...-2016.html?_r=0 Here's a counter to what you're claiming. edit: (Reddy)

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jan 23, 2015 -> 01:52 PM) The GOP has their largest majority in almost a century or something like that. Democrats lost just about every contestable seat and couldn't even manage to beat Sam "I've single-handily destroyed Kansas" Brownback for governor. Bingo. I get that turnout was low and that favors the GOP in midterms, but overrall the number of Dems/Repubs in an election is basically the same. It's the independents that will swing major contests. And lots can happen between now and 2016. Reddy is obviously be hyperbolic, but nothing is for certain when it comes to elections and I think if you're basing a guesstimate on anything, the mid-terms was a sign that the Dems aren't happy with the candidates and/or promises that are being offered and so they stayed at home. That could very well be the same situation in 2016.

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jan 23, 2015 -> 01:47 PM) It would be interesting to see an actual breakdown of it, but really it's all part of a larger "college benefits reform" proposal. I'd also imagine that, for most middle-class people, the actual average account balances would be just as low if not lower than 401(k) average balances, so $10k total in tax credits ($2.5k x 4) might actually be worth far more than the tax on capital gains. And it'd still be tax-deferred, so your money would grow tax-free for 15-18 years. Yeah we'd have to see some sample math. I just don't see the point of cutting something that is beneficial to some (even if it benefits the rich, why is it a bad thing to reward saving for education?) if the idea is to focus more on credits. Give both, but put a limitation on how much you can get on one or the other.

QUOTE (Reddy @ Jan 23, 2015 -> 01:39 PM) I'm 28. I'm not that young. I live in the same real world as the rest of you. It's brilliant given today's context, the context of 2016, and the fact that I didn't really expect it out of him. He keeps doing what he's doing, and it's not just the Presidency we'll have locked up in '16, but we'll make gains in congress as well. I mean I love the positivity here, but the democrats just got smoked in the last election. The american people are clearly tired of progressive policies. Why do you think anything in these next 2 years is going to change that? If Obama gets any of these policies passed, which is a dubious claim, they are things that the majority of people want and the GOP can claim partial credit for it.

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jan 23, 2015 -> 01:35 PM) It's apparently part of a larger plan to simplify the numerous college credits/deductions/incentives that are out there. The money saved from this change would be used to expand the American Opportunity Tax Credit, which provides a tax credit of up to $2,500. The growth inside of a 529 would still be tax-deferred, but you would pay taxes upon disbursement so there's still some incentive to use the plan. Per an "administration official," the 80% of the current 529 plan benefits go to households making $250k or more. You can eliminate that benefit and shift it to something that more heavily favors the middle class, like the AOTC seems to do. You're just shifting the incentives/federal funding from one type of program to another that might be better at what you're trying to accomplish. I would hope the earnings in a 529 plan for 15-18 years is more than a $2,500 tax credit!

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jan 23, 2015 -> 01:28 PM) Correlation versus causation, but the growth in all plans, not just Exchange plans, has been slowing since the bill started kicking in. Plus there's a lot of things that effect lots of people who had employer-based coverage before such as allowing children to stay on a plan until 26. Yeah there were some clauses in there I agreed with, extended the coverage age, pre-existing conditions, etc. but that doesn't mean the whole law is good. And if it does fail in 10 years you all obviously have your built in excuse: it wasn't expansive enough to actually work!

QUOTE (Reddy @ Jan 23, 2015 -> 12:54 PM) Nah, not delusional. Y'all conveniently forget how much I don't like Obama. I hate the way approached his presidency for the first 6 years, with no backbone, no spine, and not being willing to stand up to the GOP that was just stonewalling him. In the first couple years, the reason MORE didn't get done, is that he was TRYING to reach across the isle - foolishly - and the GOP was just shaking their heads at every single policy proposal. He handled all that horribly. I hate his viewpoint on the NSA, on Snowden, on drones. Much of his foreign policy is suspect. He's an old-school conservative dressed in blue. But all that said, his approval ratings right now are MUCH higher than Bush's ratings at this point in his presidency, and he's working with the single most obstructionist congress in the history of America. And I have a feeling he's going to go hard these next couple years with his new "IDGAF" attitude, and, like I said, it's gonna look good on him, because the onus will be on this ridiculous congress to GET THINGS DONE. I mean, where is THEIR approval rating compared to Obama's? I may be wrong, but we'll see. God, you are such an easy sell if that speech is all that it took.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jan 23, 2015 -> 01:17 PM) Jenks, I don't know if you guys have daycare or not, but if you do, I highly recommend taking care of a dependent care FSA (maximum of $5K per family). Works similar to a 401K / IRA / FSA, where basically you are using pre tax dollars vs. after tax dollars. So you would save 5K (presuming you have daycare costs of at least that) X your effective tax rate. Not a ton (considering how expensive daycare is) but as far as I'm concerned, every $ helps. I looked into this when we started him in our daycare, but isn't the catch that you can't then also claim the child care credit?

QUOTE (Reddy @ Jan 23, 2015 -> 12:46 PM) I'm on the drug called "facts" and yes, sadly it's true that facts tend to skew left. - Obama care was gutted BECAUSE of compromise with Repubs, in order to get it passed. The original legislation was a much, much better program. And the point I was making is not that it's perfect, but that it's the first step in creating something that is much better. Sadly the GOP doesn't WANT to make it better, because a better health care plan isn't what their lobbyists want. For a small minority of people. It did nothing to lower costs for the remaining 80% of the country that aren't using it. We'll see if the promises that it will effect the entire system ever comes true (not likely). If the GOP/Bush implemented them, they weren't against them, at least not all of them... I wouldn't have, actually, because again that's enemy #1 and any person in that chair is going to make the decision to go after them. And oddly the fake wars sorta caused the entire thing to happen....without the war he wouldn't have been forced to live in a suburb of Pakistan and is probably living it up in a heavily defended mountain fortress somewhere. I know you're young, but jesus go read some books or the internet on SOTU speeches. Obama did nothing new. It was not "brilliant." Every president when speaking to the American people promises the moon. That's how they get to office in the first place. An income dependent repayment options has been around for years. I'm not sure why you think Obama did that. Maybe he tweaked it some, but he didn't create it. Gore invented the internet though right? And you better read the fine print on that 25 year clause. You're paying taxes on what's forgiven after 25 years. And you have to make so many qualified payments. And if you end up making a decent chunk of change later in the term of the loan, you're potentially going to get hit with some high interest if you don't meet the criteria. It's designed for people in public service who will never make a lot of money and will always be unable to afford the standard or graduated repayment figure.

QUOTE (LDF @ Jan 23, 2015 -> 01:02 PM) there is something about a smoke anything that gets me sick. so i avoid smoking anything. That is literally one of the saddest things I have ever read.

QUOTE (shipps @ Jan 23, 2015 -> 01:00 PM) My next "me" purchase will be the green egg or the turkey fryer. I find it difficult to have bbq that isnt smoked nowadays. I have had too much great smoked bbq to turn back now. But I am sure yours are probably really good though. Slow cooking it on low heat and then saucing it on the grill. Thats meat candy right there. $300 bucks gets you an electric smoker with a digital therm. I use mine almost every weekend (probably giving myself cancer in the process, but oh well). Set the meat and basically forget it. It's worth every penny. Smoking with an egg or a weber is fine, but labor intensive. edit: I have this with leg extension kit: http://www.amazon.com/Masterbuilt-20070910...r/dp/B00104WRCY

Whelp, that'll significantly change my shopping habits.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jan 23, 2015 -> 12:21 PM) Take the link and paste it into google and you can read it. Supposedly he has another incentive he wants to use but I presume his rational is that the benefit is only being taken advantage of by the more wealthy so lets drop that benefit. I just don't see why the program you want to whack is a program like this which provides an incentive for people to go to college and for families to actually save for college (vs. being in debt, which is a massive problem for the current and future generations of collegiate graduates). But since it involves you actually paying for money, I'm presuming another reason is you cut this and than offer free JC to all. I mean, if that's the case, that's moronic. That's hurting the middle class, not just the rich. My wife and I were about to start looking into this for our son. But if there's no tax advantage, there's no point.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jan 23, 2015 -> 11:46 AM) Since no one has talked about it. Just an FYI, that if you have young kids and use or are planning on using / taking advantage of a 529 plan for college savings that Obama is proposing to cut the benefits. That said, existing 529 plans will likely be grand-fathered in (not sure if that is existing based upon current balances or just plans that were set-up and new contributions to those existing plans would still benefit from the beneficial tax treatment). All of this might be a moot point cause republicans won't support it. http://www.wsj.com/articles/obama-proposal...tion-1421811117 That's a subscriber only article, what's the jist of it? Why does he want to cut those benefits? Isn't it a good thing that people set aside money for college tax free?

This thread is just torture. I'm on a diet (and i'm actually sticking with it, 3 weeks and down 10 lbs) and i'm drooling over all of these delicious foods that I can't have.

I still can't wrap my head around why Kirk is getting minutes over Moore. Moore has looked downright impressive (for a guy playing 5 minutes a game) in his playing time this year.

This is a much more enjoyable game.

Capt Kirk strikes again. Just f***ing brutal to watch him play.

Pssh out on Leonard.

Defense is actually showing up. Spurs pretty lifeless though.