beck72

The RBI guys are supposed to be slow, power guys-I count AJ among them because the hitting the sox get out of a C is a bonus; and few C's are speed/ contact guys anyway. The key is getting the guys at other positions who compliment what the big bats do. With PK and AJ locked up [and Crede and Dye should as well, so he can take over DH when Thome retires], the sox should always have a mix of hitters. They don't now.

More public statements that the sox would love to have Tad hit lower, not higher or #2. And Iguchi has made comments of being more comfortable down in the order. http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...-baseball-print

QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ Oct 1, 2006 -> 12:18 AM) Which is why Walt Hriniak would make much much more sense than Greg Walker as hitting coach. Walker isn't the problem. He doesn't try to change hitters like Hriniak does. It's the hitters. If they have weaknesses to their game--a lot of K's, inability to hit to the opposite field, poor bunters--etc a hitting coach isn't going to change a pro who has been playing that way for yrs. The twins draft those type of players/ hitters to begin with and they come up through the system. The Twins don't change the way their young players hit once they get the bigs. The sox should draft or trade for the type of hitters they need that compliment their big hitters.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Sep 30, 2006 -> 07:55 PM) Pierre's post-ASB OBP was .339. So, Pierre at his best is a .340 OBP guy? But at least he'll be super-fly on the bases, right? Well, if you like leadoff hitters with OBPs of less than .330, than I guess that's your thing. I like to aim a little bit higher, mmkay? We don't need a leadoff man who can run real fast. We need a guy who can get on-base at an acceptable rate, so when Thome and Dye and Konerko launch their homers, it's not just a solo shot. You do realize that next August, Pierre will be 30 years old, ie in the end of his peak years? And you do realize that once Pierre starts to lose speed, he'll be a completely useless player, yes? And you do realize that Pierre will probably get a four year deal for close to $30 million because apparantly there are still GMs out there under your dilusional impression that speed is more important than having a good OBP, yes? He's already on the team. Tad Iguchi. He's going to finish the seaso with an OBP right around .350. He won't have to hit behind Scotty anymore, so I could see him posting an OBP closer to .360. Plus, we won't have to give up anything to get him. BTW, Beck, I should add that I'm not totally against your ideas; I do like the idea of buying low on Crisp. But, there's also a situtation arising in New York, where Milledge is being "outted" by some of his teammates. I'd love to see Kenny swoop in and (a semi pipe dream) tag Milledge along with a pitching prospect for Garcia. I'm not completely sold on Pierre. Not for his numbers, which 2005 was his off yr [and the start of this yr]. But his style of play fits in with what Ozzie and this team needs [someone who can make contact, put the ball in play and get bunt and infield hits [Pods number of IF and bunt hits in 2006 were far off his 2005 numbers], put pressure on the defense while batting and on the bases] If his price tag wasn't going to be so high, I'd say go for him. He's probably too expensive Crisp though would fit in nicely. He could play LF and CF with BA getting most time in CF. I could see Owens possibly in LF vs RHP, with Crisp moving over. While not the ideal leadoff guy, his defense and style of play would seem a good fit. There aren't many other options for top of the order help at the only realistic spots the sox could upgrade--LF, SS and CF. The price in terms of talent or long term salary would probably be too high. Your plans for Iguchi in leadoff would have been tried already if was going to happen in 2007. With Pods in a platoon much of the year, Iguchi was never once tried there. Tad is many things. But not a leadoff hitter. He K's too much for one. While he can steal a base now and then, the sox would be looking for more speed. I'm trying to go by Ozzie's philosophy and public statements. Tad may stick at #2. Or hit lower. But he's not going to hit higher than 2.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Sep 30, 2006 -> 07:20 PM) His OBP is .329 coming into today. Even Scott f***ing Podsednik had a higher OBP coming into today. So yes, he doesn't get on base enough. You don't seem to get it. Relax, wise guy. Had a bad day? We're talking career avgs here. The guy didn't hit for the 1st two months. And still upped his avg. to near .300 like professional hitters always seem to manage. His OBP is off this yr. A difference of .38 between his BAvg. and OBP. Pierre's career avg of .303 and OBP of .350 would look more than fine on the southside. BTW-I'd love to hear your idea for a leadoff hitter.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Sep 30, 2006 -> 06:08 PM) .350 OBP>>>.300 hitters in the 1 and 2 holes, especailly with the makeup of this team. The sox don't have either. With the make up of this team, the sox need more speed/ contact guys/ guys who can get on base by putting it in play. Both Pierre and Crisp use their speed to get on base, and steal once on. Any changes should be made that expect the 3-7 hitters to fall off at least somewhat off what they did this yr. They were incredible. All the more reason to upgrade at other spots. Maybe I'm late 'coming to the party' but what is your plan for the offense/ lineup for 2007? QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Sep 30, 2006 -> 06:02 PM) So you want to move Iguchi out of the two hole for guys that have worse OBP than he does? It's not just me. But ozzie's been intent on getting someone else in there for the last 2 yrs. Iguchi gets on base. But he also strikes out a lot. Tad's the best option the sox have at the #2 hole now. Crisp isn't the best leadoff hitter. But he's put up some nice numbers in the 2 hole and does the things a #2 hitter Ozzie likes--bunts well, makes contact-low K's/ steals bases/ hits to all fields. Iguchi's speed and power could be utilized in the bottom 3rd of the lineup--another thing Ozzie has said he would like.

QUOTE(santo=dorf @ Sep 30, 2006 -> 06:12 PM) Crisp OBP 2004: .344 OBP .2005: .345 ....and he has never batted over .300. Juan Pierre is about to set the record for lowest BA with 200 hits in a season. He just doesn't get on base enough. Technically you are correct. Crisp never hit ABOVE .300. He hit .300 in 2005. And .297 in '04. My bad. He's horrible. And Pierre? A guy leads the league in hits and he doesn't get on base enough? You got me. I guess I didn't see your offseason to-do list. But it's fine to criticize.

QUOTE(santo=dorf @ Sep 30, 2006 -> 06:01 PM) Pierre's and Crisp's OBP aren't that good, so how are they supposed to get on base for the big boppers? Both are .300 hitters. Crisp broke his finger in May and played all yr with it. He should get back to his 2004 and 2005 #'s at the #2 hole. Get him while his stock is low.

QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Sep 30, 2006 -> 05:38 PM) Did you happen to read Balta's post earlier this week? This years offense was shut out less, produced a higher output of runs, and was far more consistent across the season. It was hardly the problem. What Williams needs is players capable of adequately hitting lefthanded pitching. Leftfielder should have decent numbers, as any new OF/IF backup. So replacing Pods and getting a platoon player will address the weak areas of the sox offense? OK. I disagree. Personally, I'd get a new leadoff and #2 hitter [which could move Iguchi down in the order to provide speed and situational hitting]. Sign Pierre and trade Freddy for Coco Crisp [and a bullpen arm like Delcarmen or Hansen]. You could have those two swap #1 and #2 spots ala Pierre and Castillo in 2003 based on LHP or RHP. QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Sep 30, 2006 -> 05:44 PM) It's not, but Thome,Dye,Kong,AJ, and Crede are not the problems like it seems you make them out to be. I'm saying the guys around them are the problem not those guys.

QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Sep 30, 2006 -> 05:38 PM) Uh, starting pitching? Bullpen inconsistencies? The offense isn't blameless, is what I'm saying. I wasn't ranking the causes of the sox 2006 downfall. If you think the sox offense is complete, so be it. I don't. QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Sep 30, 2006 -> 05:38 PM) Uh, starting pitching? Bullpen inconsistencies? And what's the deal with the Buerhle hate? One bad season and he's all that in your sig?!

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Sep 30, 2006 -> 05:33 PM) So then all of you who want to keep Garcia would be willing to give him a 3 year big $$$ contract extension right now right? Because if you're not then he needs to be traded. Thank you. I thought I was the only one not willing to give Freddy a big new contract based on his hot streak.

QUOTE(fathom @ Sep 30, 2006 -> 05:18 PM) Super....does this mean we can make more trades like Carlos Lee for Pods? Maybe we can trade Thome for Joey Gathright, or Konerko for Kenny Lofton. The "big boopers" on our team were great this year. It's just that guys like Pods, Anderson, etc., sucked, and they were supposed to be our smallball guys. When you have Dye, Thome, Pk, AJ, and Crede with career yrs and still not make the playoffs, yes, some different type hitters are needed. I'm not saying any of those should go. Those are the spots to have the HR's and non-speed guys. Just that other guys around them have to have a different skill set. The sox have too many guys with the same type of skills on offense. Now, isn't that "super"?

QUOTE(Wanne @ Sep 30, 2006 -> 04:57 PM) This whole thing about Ozzie not being on the same page as KW is gonna get to be an interesting war or wills...and Ozzie WILL lose. I wouldn't cry if he got so pissed out about somebody telling him how to run his team and just walked (of course expecting KW and the entire Sox fanbase to chase him down to kiss his ass to come back). But he really does need to get with the program. It was KW who got on Ozzie's page after the 2004 season--after playing with a softball team for 4 yrs. I think both understand the importance of pitching. But KW seems to love the long ball [and players he's gotten in trades/ drafted] more than Ozzie. KW has far more of an agenda holding onto players he's drafted or traded for. Ozzie has to try and win with what he has--no matter where they came from. If you were manager, wouldn't you want your kind of players? For Ozzie, it's guys who can make contact/ situational hit/ create their own offense rather than swing for the fences and hit into DP's. KW is the one who needs to get with the program and get a few more guys who can get on base for the big boppers.

Freddy should be asking for a big contract after 2007--dollars the sox shouldn't pay. He may have accepted a "hometown discount" for his first sox contract. But Freddy has a lot of miles on his arm, and showed how bad he could be for long stretches. I just don't think the sox should put out a 3 yr deal for him worth over $36 mill--which is what some team will give him. IMO, he's the most likely of the current sox SP's to pitch the worst the next 2, 3 yrs. Somehow those 36 HR's Freddy gave up this yr give me visions of Russ Ortiz. Jose on the other hand, should be willing to go yr to yr after his new deal expires. MB should come back fine. He stated publicly that he needs to get in better shape after taking it easy in the 2005 offseason. Put money into MB rather than Freddy, esp. if MB comes back and pitches like he has in the past. He's proven his worth since 2001. I'd give him the benefit of the doubt, no matter how bad MB looked this yr.

QUOTE(beautox @ Sep 30, 2006 -> 12:25 AM) what do we do with this Garcia quandary? i'm still all for dealing him, would you offer to see who would sign first MB or Freddy? and then deal the one that doesn't sign along with jose? Deal Freddy. MB will bounce back For some reason, the sox look like they can compete with the Twins tonight. The last couple of series the sox looked overmatched.

QUOTE(aboz56 @ Sep 29, 2006 -> 02:52 AM) Can't wait to see what KW has in mind to improve this club. I was thinking about that as well. There might be some strong hints in the lineups this last week. Such as yesterday when Owens was in CF, hitting #2, Iguchi down in the lineup. Not that Owens is the answer. But that there are/ might be questions in CF. Or having Haeger in relief.

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Sep 28, 2006 -> 02:31 AM) You do realize Juan Pierre is going to get $9M+ per this offseason right? Soriano will likely make around $15M a year and considering how much better Soriano is than Pierre I'd say Soriano is worth the extra $4M-$6M per year. Juan Pierre is going to make a lot more money than some people think he's going to get. Soriano should make $13 mill a yr. Pierre should get $7 mill a yr. I'm not sold on Soriano for his d. Plus his 2006 year was in his contract yr. I'm not saying the sox should get Pierre. but I am saying no to Soriano

QUOTE(fathom @ Sep 28, 2006 -> 02:09 AM) Pierre is a more realistic option. On no planet is he a better option than Soriano. Better after taking contract, cost, salary, etc into consideration. I know Soriano is more talented.

QUOTE(VAfan @ Sep 28, 2006 -> 12:53 AM) With much better lead off hitters available as free agents, I wouldn't trade ANY talent to solve the lead-off-left-field hole we have. As I write on a separate thread, Alfonso Soriano and Gary Matthews Jr. are both much better choices. Both are just better hitters than Crawford, with better OBPs and more power. Plus both hit lefties much better than Crawford. After watching lefties KILL us this year, we can ill afford not to try to address that problem at the same time. Crawford's splits. vs. Left 162 24 46 6 3 4 26 10 3 31 11 1 .284 .337 .432 .769 vs. Right 426 62 132 14 12 14 50 26 1 52 45 8 .310 .349 .498 .847 The only benefit to Crawford is that he is younger and will be cheaper than Soriano or Matthews. But this trade off isn't worth making since we would have to surrender an equal talent that is also younger and cheaper to get him. Juan Pierre would be better options than those two. And more likely with Ozzie knowing what to expect from Pierre.

QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Sep 27, 2006 -> 10:32 PM) You mean like Alex Gonzalez? Maybe Royce Clayton. Look, a .250 OBP is unacceptable. There's no arguing that... but our best chance at having an upgrade, both offensively and defensively, over '06 Uribe, is probably by understanding that Uribe can't possibly be as bad next season... and hiring Walt Hriniak as a consultant. If the sox found a way to keep Uribe and his sub .300 OBP, fine. Crawford's addition could help the sox score more runs while keeping Juan in the 9 hole. But we fans and the sox shouldn't count or expect Uribe to find religion in Hriniak or come near his 2004 yr.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Sep 27, 2006 -> 10:43 PM) Honestly, I can't totally object to keeping him, because he does have the potential to do some really great things with the bat and on defense. If we plug the hole in LF and Anderson continues to improve and Rob Mackowiak is traded, Uribe is not the worst option in the world at that spot. But he's not the best, and he's not guaranteed to improve either. Well put. If the sox have a Crawford type upgrade in LF, Uribe and his d would be OK. But to expect him to produce like 2004 is a false hope. Some type of lesser d, better offense could be out there

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Sep 27, 2006 -> 10:23 PM) This Anderson persecution from certain media members sure seems like the crap Garland got for not being more "emotional" during his pre-2005 years. Did Anderson not punch enough lockers and throw enough stools when he was slumping to be considered 'competitive' and 'gritty'? What's the story here? Because every time I've heard Anderson talk, or seen someone that I actually respect talk about Anderson, I've never gotten a bad impression from him. Sure, hitting .230 didn't do a whole lot to help his cause, but why does it seem like Anderson is now being labeled as a guy with attitude problems? Why not? The anderson persecution is from Ozzie. He's the one who has said BA needs to play winter ball, improve his game, etc. Most everyone else believes BA has done a nice job the 2nd half. Personally, I'm happy with his d and expect him to hit over .260 in 2007 Uribe's inconsistent offense needs to be addressed--either by him putting more work in or by replacing him

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Sep 27, 2006 -> 09:43 PM) Except with the main core of this team, guys to get on base at the top of the order is just what we need.... Exactly. The question is how do you add [or more importantly, who do you add] to the existing core, that helps the sox win now and in the future? Few teams will part with those guys. And the few spots the sox could improve--LF, SS, CF [i don't even consider BA a guy the sox should part with, though Ozzie may have a differing opinion]--have top of the order guys who could help this team. Uribe seemed like a keeper after his 2005 playoffs. Yet with few SS's available who could add top of the order type qualities, the sox will have to look elsewhere. The cost might be high in BMac. But the cost of doing nothing--like having Ozuna platoon with someone--might be even higher. Worst case scenario, Crawford doesn't improve on his 2004-2006 stats, and Bmac becomes a #2 SP with the D Rays. Those stats would help the sox win a lot of games they lost in 2006. QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Sep 27, 2006 -> 10:12 PM) I don't see how Crawford's presence suddenly changes Cintron into an everyday SS. Does Crawford have super powers? My point is the sox wouldn't have to trade to get a leadoff hitter for SS--ala Rollins, who likely isn't available anyway. Cintron might not be the answer at SS. But Uribe sure isn't. The sox could go for a strictly defensive SS, someone who could make better contact and be more consistent at the plate than Juan, though-an 8, 9 hitter with some speed. Cintron's numbers would go down playing everyday, and his defense be exposed. But a change is coming at SS. It's a question of who. With a stellar, stellar upgrade in LF, SS could be a lateral move at worst--such as better offense, lesser defense.

One big omission in this argument is the fact that the starting lineup isn't getting much younger. Having a guy like Crawford in his prime helps the sox have a guy who'll be around for years. Right now, it's Crede and Anderson in their 20's [i don't count Uribe, who likely is gone. Hell, with Crawford added Cintron could play SS]. I know Sweeney is on the cusp of contributing. Though it certainly seems like Anderson has burnt some sox bridges this yr. The Sox still need position players to build around. They have with PK, Thome, Dye and AJ. But they need complimentary players at the other spots. Crawford is as complimentary [with his speed, defense, top of the order ability] to the sox roster as they come. The starters are getting older [and are expensive]. But trading Josh Fields could help the sox net a top starting pitching prospect very near ready for the bigs. The bullpen is young and needs a solid dependable vet or two. Having Freddy stick around for 2007 wouldn't be the worst thing in the world. I wouldn't have said that in August but damn he came on strong at the end.

Because the Drays are apparently looking for a BMac type arm in return. http://www.nypost.com/sports/mets/ex_rayvi...oel_sherman.htm My thinking is yes. Crawford just turned 25 and is locked up for 4 more yrs and IIRC an option for a 5th. The sox need a speed type guy like Carl in their lineup. He'd improve the OF defense, with him in LF and BA in CF. The sox could then hold onto Freddy. Or trade him and insert Haeger [or an arm they get if they trade Fields, which should net them a very solid SP prospect ready to step in or a 1st or 2nd yr pro]. Cooper seems really high on Haeger. The SP should be better with an in shape Buehrle, and a fully rested Jose. The key area is improving the bullpen, which wouldn't affect BMac at all. Hell, look what Minny has done with Santana and four bodies. The bullpen and a versatile lineup. Crawford would singlehandedly change the complexion of the team Thoughts?