Lip Man 1

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 01:50 PM) You don't have many problems/issues. That's me. Mark

QUOTE (captain54 @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 11:47 AM) Here's an idea.. .just throwing it out there.. how about the Sox acquire players who already possess those skills, or develop players to acquire those skills? Unfortunately in baseball as in many other sports, fundamental skills have gone by the wayside in favor of an attitude of "what will get me on ESPN highlights?" Mark

QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 12:49 PM) Hmmm, hard to tell reading your posts. The Sox are also one of the more prominent parts of my life, always have been and likely always will be, but I take such a different approach to things than you. But as you said, everyone is different. Just don't think pointing out every single negative thing helps the picture, really, and certainly sucks out the enjoyment (at least would for me). Which is why, as I told an earlier poster, I'll let the results on the field and the front office moves do the talking from that perspective from now on. That should make a segment of the readers happy. So it's win / win for all! Mark

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 12:35 PM) It isn't gospel for sure. But in terms of it being a third priority in life, I will never understand that at all. Seeing something like that just blows my mind. As Kenny Williams would say "it is what it is..." I've got a comfortable life, doing what I want to do broadcasting-wise and I'm very content save for the way the Sox are performing. I don't know what more someone could want out of life. I'll be 61 this August and have been "exposed" to many different ways of thinking over the years. I do those folks the courtesy of hearing them out and listening to their point of view but in the end I'll do what I think works best for me. Mark

QUOTE (ptatc @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 12:21 PM) I can see that. I think working for so many different pro and amateur sports teams has taken some of the intensity out of my "must win" attitude. For years it was just keep them on the field or get them back ASAP. After awhile it becomes, is the one more win really worth all of this? I understand it it from the athletes and management point of view but from a long term health position it can be very different. It almost sounds like you were a team doctor or a team physical therapist. Mark

QUOTE (ptatc @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 12:08 PM) That's fine. Everyone has their own point of view. I was just joking about the response to your post. I love the game of baseball. i don't like to see the Sox lose but I can still enjoy a game if they lose unless the play is really awful. Understood and I respect that view. Sometimes I wish I could be more like that but I'm not. As I explained to South I happened to grow up perhaps in the only time in franchise history where if they lost (i.e. at the end of the season they actually had a losing record) it was inconceivable. That tends to color how you view things. And given the success the Sox had in that time period that view wasn't necessarily a bad thing in my opinion. I go back to late May 1961 when the Sox lost a DH to Baltimore and for a day or so dropped into last place for the first time since 1950. They'd finish the year in fourth place with another winning record. This actually happened. Some aldermen in a Chicago city council meeting brought up the fact the Sox were losing, in last place and thought the city should allocate some "disaster funds" for them. (Now I'm sure they were joking) That really reflected the overall attitude of the city though about what was expected from the Sox. The 'motion' by the way was defeated with the alderman from the Cubs ward saying it wasn't fair, that the Cubs were a disaster for decades. LOL (Wonder what would happen if they said something like that today? LOL) Mark

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 11:50 AM) Bingo. The games are entertainment, not life, death, or any of life's other problems. It is an escape from that. If it stresses you out, or angers you for any real period of time, you aren't getting out of it, what you should be getting out of it. South: With respect that's your opinion. Your thinking isn't gospel and isn't set in stone from Moses. It depends on the individual. Again no offense, people are different, they have certain values and approach things differently. To me my passion for the White Sox is, was and always will be the third most important / prominent part of my life behind my wife and my son and his family. Mark

QUOTE (ptatc @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 11:42 AM) I guess this is the difference. I still love the game of baseball. Win or lose I still enjoy watching and going to games. The games are more enjoyable when they win but really just love to watch baseball. I think the best way to sum up my feelings PTATC is to say I like baseball but I love the White Sox. And when the Sox are doing poorly baseball has very little appeal for me. I don't care to watch other successful teams and wonder why it is the Sox can't do the same thing. Just the way I'm wired. Winning means more to me personally that the sport itself. Not saying you are right or wrong just that we take different approaches to this. Mark

QUOTE (ptatc @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 11:36 AM) I will if you stop posting every single negative thought you can come up with about the team. Done and done. I'll let the on field and front office actions speak for themselves. I'm serious about this. You get your wish. Mark

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 11:08 AM) I remember how common that line of thought was in the early 2000's. You are quite literally the first person I have seen bring it up and say they might have been wrong about. Everyone else just pretends it never was said. South: Again I've always placed a lot of weight towards having a winning season. Some might say to much and that my thought process limits expectations. They say attitudes are shaped as a child and you have to remember I was born in 1955. I was vagely a where of the 59 World Series but remember nothing specific. I do start to remember things about the Sox in 1960 for example and from there on out. Went to my first game in 1963. Remember for me, growing up, I never even experienced a 'losing' season until 1968. That summer I was 12 about to be 13 that August. That's an amazingly long time to grow up without the Sox ever having a bad team. I submit that simply because that probably has a lot to do with why I'd have to consider 'giving up the World Series win' if it meant another "Golden Age" for wont of a better word. Mark

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 11:14 AM) If the White Sox had the advantage of the current playoff format, they definitely would have won at least one World Series title over that time period LIP is referring to. Heck, they SHOULD have by all rights won the 1994 World Series, the one that never happened. (Thanks, JR!) But as usual, we should still be loyal 11 years later, because, "2005!" And yet for some strange reason, ALMOST everyone here supports the idea of getting rid of Williams to let Rick Hahn run things, the same Rick Hahn who has shown us what exactly in terms of talent evaluation (other than the Adam Eaton trade) over his tenure? But logically, without KW to meddle/interfere like the villain in a Scooby Doo cartoon, we would have made the playoffs numerous times if Williams and JR just got out of the way and let Hahn do his job. It's hard for me to place a lot of blame on Rick yet because fairly or unfairly I simply don't know if he has a free hand to run things the way he wishes to. Hahn has talked about rebuilding the minor leagues and having "sustained" success and he did a very good job of beginning to cut out the dead weight in 2013-14. It appeared that his plan was taking shape. But then you have the almost 180 degree rotation to what the Sox did the off season before 2015 and it just makes you wonder. Those moves seemed to be a disconnect between what history showed he was doing and what he wanted to do to what actually happened. So honestly I don't know what to think right now. The only way to know for sure would be for Kenny to be completely cut out of the organization and then see what history shows after Hahn had complete control. Since that isn't in play, I think its reasonable to say the jury is still out on him. Mark

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 10:57 AM) The Braves really were failures. Yankees, too, since that run in the mid to late 90's. Mid to late 90's Indians. All those great Mariners' teams. Twins making the playoffs 6 out of 9 seasons as a small market team that was almost relocated by MLB. We basically have had the same degree of success, if not more. Kenny Williams deserves another promotion, just for 2005. Well played sir! Mark

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 10:51 AM) Ok, but again the Indians havent won in like 60 plus years, Twins havent won since 91, Detroit since what, 84? Dont come in stumping success for these teams when they havent even grabbed the brass ring in decades. We all want consistent success. Can you read that? WE ALL WANT CONSISTENT SUCCESS. As white sox fans, we all know consistent success has been nonexistent and want it to change. But thanks for pointing out every chance you get that they dont have consistent success. Without you telling me every chance you get, I dont think i would know. Kyle Very happy to provide that service to you. We all do what we can! Mark

QUOTE (lasttriptotulsa @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 10:50 AM) Nobody's talking about the Marlins or the past hundred years. You are acting as if the Twins of the '00s, the Tigers of the '00s and '10s and the Indians of the '90s were much more successful than the Sox since the '90s. And the fact of the matter is none of those teams won a World Series. Making the playoffs doesn't mean s*** unless you win it all. Winning a World Series trumps everything. Would you trade the '05 World Series for the Tigers 2 appearances and a couple additional playoff appearances? I highly doubt it. Your last point is very interesting. At the time I was among those who felt that if the Sox won the World Series and then sucked for the next ten years it would be worth it. Having (ironically) basically gone through that exact scenario, now I really wonder. The Sox from 1951-1967 were one of the best, most stable franchises in all of MLB. 17 straight winning seasons, seven of them with 90+ wins yet they only made the World Series once and lost it. To be perfectly honest with you if the devil offered me that scenario today I might very well take it...at least I'd see very good baseball and know that more than likely when the season was done the team was going to win a lot more games then they lost. I'd have to think hard about that one. And one final point, you're chances of winning the World Series are zero if you don't even make the playoffs. Those teams you mentioned at least had a shot to do so by making it. I'd gladly take my chances of the Sox not winning it if at least they could get there to try. Mark

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 10:49 AM) tasty irony. Be more than happy to, in fact I'd LOVE TO. Let me know when the Sox provide me a real reason to do so OK? Mark

QUOTE (knightni @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 09:59 AM) It's almost as if you enjoy the Sox doing poorly. Right, I've been a fan for 55 seasons. I must be a masochist. LOL. Try something else please. Mark

QUOTE (lasttriptotulsa @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 10:07 AM) Who is missing from that group? I don't know, maybe the only Central Division team other than the Royals to win a World Series in your given time frames. Great! Eleven years ago. Four World Series appearances in the last 100 YEARS. Hey we're TOTALLY successful!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Let's put it another way, the Miami Marlins have won two World Series in a shorter period of time. Mark

QUOTE (pettie4sox @ Jun 6, 2016 -> 10:12 PM) The 2013 Indians made the WC because they absolutely dominated the Sox that year. They went like 15-4 or something. Not sure why the Sox play poorly against division opponents not named the Twins. I think it was actually 17-2. Mark

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jun 7, 2016 -> 08:36 AM) Ummm they traded 6. None of the above crazy spending happens without Cabrera, which necessitated gutting their system at the time And by "gutting" their farm system it appears they went to the World Series twice and the playoffs what four times in the last eight years? I'd take that in a New York minute. They took their turn dominating the division much like the Indians in the 90's and the Twins in the 00's and maybe the Royals right now. Geez...I wonder who is missing from that group? Mark

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jun 6, 2016 -> 03:19 PM) Guy$, Guy$, Guy$ ... Money talks. Flash 5 million or 6 million at Leyland and he'll f***ing come back. Do it now. 3 mill for the rest of this season; 2 years 10 million dollar deal to follow. Just for him to turn the organization around. He will take the money; they all do. If he won't do it, flash a bit more at LaRussa. 4 mill the rest of this season and two years 14 million contract. it's THAT important. Sorry both guys are done with the managing game. Not going to happen, you can flash them 10 million. Tony has complete control of the D-backs and is working with his old friend and mentor Roland Hemond. He isn't going anywhere. Leyland is well into his 70's I think and still has issues with JR over Gene Lamont's firing. Just not in the cards. Mark

QUOTE (Black_Jack29 @ Jun 5, 2016 -> 07:06 PM) If Maddon wasn't available a year and a half ago, Renteria would probably still be managing the Cubs. Absolutely. He did pretty well given the circumstances. But the difference was that when the Cubs had an opportunity to 'upgrade' their situation they did it. Loyalty be damned. And I think Renteria had two years remaining on his deal. Mark

QUOTE (Black_Jack29 @ Jun 5, 2016 -> 07:45 PM) The problem is the lack of player talent, not the guy who fills out the lineup card. The answer is obviously both. Mark

There once was a time when the White Sox were an exciting team with a revived enthusiastic fan base and some of the best players in the league. Now isn't one of those times but that was the case on June 4, 1972 before over 52 thousand at Comiskey Park. It will be forever known as "the Chili Dog Game". Cue Dick Allen in the bottom of the 9th inning with the Sox down two runs and looking to sweep a double header from the Yankees. On a side note, I was sitting in the lower deck right center field when this took place. Still an amazing moment. Announcers: Future Sox broadcaster Frank Messer and Phil Rizzuto. (Rizzuto's reaction was priceless!!!!) Courtesy: WMCA / Yankees Radio Network http://www.chicagonow.com/soxnet/2016/06/t...chili-dog-game/ Mark

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 5, 2016 -> 04:03 PM) My guess it that there is probably a nugget of truth there, don't forget there were times where Kenny wanted to fire Ozzie and Greg Walker, and couldn't. It also isn't unprecidented when you look at what happened with Anahiem last year. Agreed. On a decision of that nature JR has to give his blessing. For example he OK'd letting go Tony LaRussa (and has admitted publicly many times afterwards that was one of the biggest mistakes he ever made as owner. The others? OK'ing the trade of Jerry Koosman and hiring Hawk as G.M.) Mark

Depends... On the off chance there is a new owner next year, it could be an actual person with experience at the big league level who has had some success. If not it'll be another inexperienced, learn on-the-job- former White Sox player because JR loves loyalty and hates paying huge money for top head coaches / managers. Jim Thome, Aaron Rowand, maybe Paul Konerko COME ON DOWN!!!!!!!!!! And the Sox haven't hired a manager with previous managerial experience at the big league level since Jeff Torborg in 1989. Think about that one for a second or two. Mark