Challenge for Democrats

[3E8]

I recommend the book, 'The Future of an Illusion' by Freud.

[FlaSoxxJim]

Where you go to school doesn't matter.  As I've gotten older, I've realized that the true point of going to school is to learn how to learn.  You can do that at any school if you put some energy into it.  From CVS to New Trier to Exeter...there are just as many John Benders as there are Brian Johnsons.

 

Yeah, but who wants to aspire to this?

 

Nope, wrong one.

[JUGGERNAUT]

Juggs...c'mon buddy.  Atheism is the absence of belief in a god or gods.  If you look at that, there is belief.  The absence of belief is a belief. 

 

I believe the founding fathers wanted a separation of Church and State...not a holy jihad against non-Christian believers. 

 

I'm not going to get into the whole Dems vs. GOPs with you because you are obviously well read on the subject, but I will tell you this...until we get a Representative that puts his work ahead of his job, we aren't going to get much done in this country. 

 

Again, I say we should bring back "Profiles in Courage" from the Kennedy administration.  About representatives and others who would stand up to their party if it meant harm to their constituents. 

 

It's people like you and Nuke that make it difficult for the rest of us to accept politics in this country...left wing media?  C'mon...that nut has been cracked...you can't tell me that there aren't as many right wing based media outlets as there are left wing.  Taxes?  Both parties are guilty of this.  Trade deficits...see taxes.  Sorry, but you can't put an overarching statement about either party without looking completely ignorant.  As someone else recently said...there are good people in both parties and their are asshats in both parties.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

http://www.expertlaw.com/library/misc/first_amendment.html

I suggest you read it. There is such a thing as a FREE EXERCISE CLAUSE & if you study the background of the authors it would strongly suggest they would favor liberty over censorship.

 

But again that HAS VERY LITTLE TO DO WITH THE TOPIC OF THIS THREAD!

Let me simplify this for the masses. Look over the legislative records of the Democrats & Republicans on issues of faith & religion. It's blatantly obvious to any one with an adult level of reading comprehension that the GOP would be considered the party of Man's devotion to God & the DEM the party of Man's devotion to himself.

That applies only to those issues.

 

Today the GOP controls all but the USSC & with Roberts expected to be fast-tracked to chief justice status that's soon to fall under the wing as well. That's reality. You can hide from it if you like but that isn't going to prevent it from happening.

 

Roberts is what I would call a hard core economic conservative & a social conservative. There's a little room for moderate thinking on the social side but none on his economic side. Affirmative action is sure to fall under his leadership.

 

Does any one still doubt that the God-issue has played a role in GWB's re-election?

Does any one still doubt it's impact in the House & the Senate?

 

We are at a crossroads in this nation. The religious are in power & they are expanding that powerbase. Yet it does not seem they are intent on expanding freedom & liberty in that endeavor. It seems they are intent are incorporating their dogmatic beliefs into legislation. The ACLU is powerless to fight it because they have cleverly aligned these beliefs with 9/11 fears & anxieties. What's more is that they seem to be gathering support from DEMs like Sen Lincoln who are only too happy to put forth greater sin taxes.

 

Now the DEMs can continue to alienate the religious voter in America or they can start winning them back. Obviously my gripe in all this is that freedom & liberty is going to be compromised if the GOP expands it's powerbase. I don't believe in sin taxes any more than I believe in the government's right to censor an evangelically inspired majority. If the DEMs believe in liberty & freedom then they should play this smart. Appeal to the humanitarian beliefs of the religious, show repsect & admiration for the loyalty they have shown to their faith(s), agree that it's assenine to silence nearly all in order to uphold the "faith" of 1 or a few as the law of the school or the land, & emphasize the "do not judge lest thee be judge" dogma of the bible.

 

The DEMs failure to do so of late is leading us towards a theocracy. Something I don't want any more than an atheist does. A theocracy is not about people in government expressing their religious convictions. Rhetoric is simply that. It's about those religious convictions getting incorporated into law. The ACLU has not a leg to stand on to fight it because these convictions are not associated with religion as much as they are associated with 9/11. IMO, for worse 9/11 has become the "boogeyman". Write a bill mentioning 9/11 fears & it's sure to pass.

[CanOfCorn]

http://www.expertlaw.com/library/misc/first_amendment.html

I suggest you read it.  There is such a thing as a FREE EXERCISE CLAUSE & if you study the background of the authors it would strongly suggest they would favor liberty over censorship.

 

But again that HAS VERY LITTLE TO DO WITH THE TOPIC OF THIS THREAD!

Let me simplify this for the masses.  Look over the legislative records of the Democrats & Republicans on issues of faith & religion.  It's blatantly obvious to any one with an adult level of reading comprehension that the GOP would be considered the party of Man's devotion to God & the DEM the party of Man's devotion to himself.

That applies only to those issues.

 

Today the GOP controls all but the USSC & with Roberts expected to be fast-tracked to chief justice status that's soon to fall under the wing as well.  That's reality.  You can hide from it if you like but that isn't going to prevent it from happening. 

 

Roberts is what I would call a hard core economic conservative & a social conservative.  There's a little room for moderate thinking on the social side but none on his economic side.  Affirmative action is sure to fall under his leadership. 

 

Does any one still doubt that the God-issue has played a role in GWB's re-election? 

Does any one still doubt it's impact in the House & the Senate?

 

We are at a crossroads in this nation. The religious are in power & they are expanding that powerbase.  Yet it does not seem they are intent on expanding freedom & liberty in that endeavor.  It seems they are intent are incorporating their dogmatic beliefs into legislation.  The ACLU is powerless to fight it because they have cleverly aligned these beliefs with 9/11 fears & anxieties.  What's more is that they seem to be gathering support from DEMs like Sen Lincoln who are only too happy to put forth greater sin taxes.

 

Now the DEMs can continue to alienate the religious voter in America or they can start winning them back.  Obviously my gripe in all this is that freedom & liberty is going to be compromised if the GOP expands it's powerbase.  I don't believe in sin taxes any more than I believe in the government's right to censor an evangelically inspired majority.  If the DEMs believe in liberty & freedom then they should play this smart.  Appeal to the humanitarian beliefs of the religious, show repsect & admiration for the loyalty they have shown to their faith(s), agree that it's assenine to silence nearly all in order to uphold the "faith" of 1 or a few as the law of the school or the land, & emphasize the "do not judge lest thee be judge" dogma of the bible. 

 

The DEMs failure to do so of late is leading us towards a theocracy.  Something I don't want any more than an atheist does.  A theocracy is not about people in government expressing their religious convictions.  Rhetoric is simply that.  It's about those religious convictions getting incorporated into law.  The ACLU has not a leg to stand on to fight it because these convictions are not associated with religion as much as they are associated with 9/11.  IMO, for worse 9/11 has become the "boogeyman".  Write a bill mentioning 9/11 fears & it's sure to pass.

 

First of all, you are a pompous ass. (Sorry mods.)

 

Second of all, you are saying that the Dems need to "play the game." Maybe, the Dems are letting the Republicans fall on their collective asses. Just waiting for the backlash to occur. Or at least that's what they THINK is going to happen. The Dems could be wrong. If you have a problem with the way things are going...vote. If you already do this (and I'm assuming you do) then run. Run on your laurels and if you get in, start the change. Until then, all we can do is vote for who we think is best for our little area of the country in which we live. Can't do much more than that...

 

EDIT: Except move to that Representatives area and campaign against him or her.

Edited July 25, 2005 by TheDybber

[JUGGERNAUT]

Again, don't care, still however waiting for a response to your moronic claims that atheism is dead and that religion is somehow sweeping the galaxy.  Where's your backup for that?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Ignorant to no end. Catholics, Muslims, Buddhists, Hinduists, & Protestants make up over 5 billion registered believers in the world today. The Muslims were expected to overtake the Catholics but Africa has seen an upsurge in new Catholics to where Muslims are still a few 100 million behind them.

 

In Japan alone (a nation of 120M souls) there are over 100M Buddhists. Japan represents the future of religion. What is happening there is a convergence of faiths.

There are many Buddhists that send their sons & daughters to Catholic schools & have them participate in the sacraments. There have been several books written up on this phenomenon & the consensus is that it is the family oriented aspect of the sacraments that is appealing to many Japanese. Every sacrament is celebrated with a family reunion. The Japanese Catholic churches incorporate elements of Buddhism

into their mass structure for these sacraments.

 

The same thing is happening in Korea, Singapore, Vietnam, India, & yes China.

Catholic Church registration with the communist party of China is growing quickly.

The Vatican may not like this flavor of Catholicism but that is not stopping it's growth.

 

These were traditionally the bastions of atheism & they are weakening. That is why your statement is ignorant to no end. Atheism is never going to be the norm. Get used to it. Religion will always be a tool by which those in power can sway the masses. Those in power will never give that up. Even the communist party in China understands this.

Edited July 25, 2005 by JUGGERNAUT

[JUGGERNAUT]

For atheists who are clueless mathematics is what governs my faith. Not what some man of the cloth thinks or says. I choose to beleive because I have found harmony in my vast knowledge of mathematics & science with that of my knowledge in Christianity.

 

I can write 1000's of pages correlating the three but that would be pointless here because many of you don't value mathematics or science as I do. I have yet to find one scientific fact or mathematical premise that contradicts my interpretation of the Word of God. If you choose to challenge that do it in another thread. Likewise since my foundation lies in math & science I am able to converge other faiths to that same foundation just like my peers do in Asia.

 

We have found spiritual harmony in our love of math & science & we probably will grow to be the biggest threat atheism could ever imagine.

Edited July 25, 2005 by JUGGERNAUT

[Soxy]

For atheists who are clueless mathematics is what governs my faith.  Not what some man of the cloth thinks or says.  I choose to beleive because I have found harmony in my vast knowledge of mathematics & science with that of my knowledge in Christianity. 

 

I can write 1000's of pages correlating the three but that would be pointless here because many of you don't value mathematics or science as I do.  I have yet to find one scientific fact or mathematical premise that contradicts my interpretation of the Word of God.  If you choose to challenge that do it in another thread.  Likewise since my foundation lies in math & science I am able to converge other faiths to that same foundation just like my peers do in Asia. 

 

We have found spiritual harmony in our love of math & science & we probably will grow to be the biggest threat atheism could ever imagine.

[JUGGERNAUT]

I've created another thread to debate the value of atheism as a philosophy of life. I've gotten tired of this thread diverging from the near future of politics & law in America. That's the focus of the thread in case you couldn't figure it out.

 

Algebra comes natural to some of us & others struggle mightily. You're forgiven

[Wong & Owens]

Ignorant to no end. Catholics, Muslims, Buddhists, Hinduists, & Protestants make up over 5 billion registered believers in the world today.

 

So what? I never claimed that that wasn't true, nor did I ever argue that the majority of people today are atheists. Stick to the relevant points, and stop going off on tangents.

 

The Muslims were expected to overtake the Catholics but Africa has seen an upsurge in new Catholics to where Muslims are still a few 100 million behind them.

 

Yeah, the christian church has a powerful marketing department, that is true. However, Bishop Desmond Tutu tells the real story: "When the missionaries came to Africa they had the Bible and we had the land. They said "Let us pray." We closed our eyes. When we opened them we had the Bible and they had the land.

 

The same thing is happening in Korea, Singapore, Vietnam, India, & yes China.

Catholic Church registration with the communist party of China is growing quickly.

The Vatican may not like this flavor of Catholicism but that is not stopping it's growth.

 

These countries, all similar in that their general populations were very unsophisticated and uneducated and oppressed until 50 years ago or so, all equate religion with modernization and individual freedoms. Another victory for the christian PR machine.

 

"In reviewing the history of Korean Christianity, we note certain peculiar circumstances of Korean history: Korea's long history of vulnerability to Chinese and Japanese control, Japanese colonialism and the Korean War, afforded Christianity a unique opportunity to offer a compelling salvation ethos and promise of both personal and national empowerment.

 

We also note that the profound social structural developments that marked the modernization process in Korea following WWII provided a cultural opening for the "selling" and "reception" of a Christian worldview that harmonized with the industrial transformation of the society."

 

It will be a short-term growth, as it won't be long before the christian churches in asia are just as empty as those in europe or, increasingly, the U.S.

 

These were traditionally the bastions of atheism & they are weakening.That is why your statement is ignorant to no end.

 

No, you are the ignorant one(again). These countries had no means or interest in counting their religious people, so no reputable data exists before the christianity boom. There is no way to truly tell if there are more "believers" in these countries or not. These village-central populations all had their own tribal religions, and saying they were atheist simply because they weren't a member of the "big 3" is ignorance at it's best.

 

Atheism is never going to be the norm. Get used to it. Religion will always be a tool by which those in power can sway the masses.

 

Again, I reiterate, have you been you a church in Europe lately? Have you read the facts regarding church closings in our very own city? Get used to it? Ha, I only regret that I doubt I'll be alive quite long enough to see you eat these words.

 

 

Those in power will never give that up. Even the communist party in China understands this.

 

Another glowing endorsement for the word of god. "It's a tool you can use to control millions through scare tactics and brainwashing!"

I think I read that in an ad in a goverment trade magazine somewhere......

 

[JUGGERNAUT]

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Let's keep this thread confined to the realm of politics for which it was created.